Neodimium revolution...

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by barroso, May 17, 2004.

  1. barroso


    Aug 16, 2000
    Actually i use a cab with Neodimium woofers.

    Pretty decent in tone, great in portability. Just out of curiosity I would love to know which is the first amp equipped with this kind of speakers you have heard (even on the web) of played thru.

    Whici company is for you pioneer in this kond of speakers use related to bass amplifications?

  2. ingmar


    Oct 14, 2002
    Normandy, France
    I don't know who was first historically, but Hughes & Kettner sell combos out of the Quantum series with Neo speakers, EBS has 2 small cabs, Epifani have some in their range as well, German Tech have been using them for a while, and I'm sure the list is not exhaustive.

    I've been eyeballing the Eminence Deltalite for a while, I'm tempted to build a 2*10" cab with Neo drivers ...

    I have a feeling that these speakers will take over quite rapidly, they significantly reduce weight in most enclosures, and their prices should come down as production and competition increase. I never played one but heard from a friend who owns a music store that the Epifani's with Neo drivers are excellent, and he is a bassist too !!
  3. GK has been working with Neo's for a couple of years. We're finally releasing our Neo series, 112, 212, 115, and a 412. We are not happy with the 10 yet so that one will be awhile longer.
  4. JMX

    JMX Vorsprung durch Technik

    Sep 4, 2000
    Cologne, Germany
  5. oversoul

    oversoul fretless by fate

    Feb 16, 2004
    But still Neomydium has been used by headphone and speaker manufacturers like sony, claiming to provide extra bass response.
  6. I tried the 2x10 PB cab and didn´t like it, but I think it´s got more to do with enclosure design than the magnets.
  7. Petebass


    Dec 22, 2002
    QLD Australia
    I built a 2x10 with neo's from P.Audio, (cheap but that's all I could get my hands on at the time) and recently used the same speakers for a small and lightweight vocal PA. They don't sound brilliant, but they certainly don't suck either. All up I consider them to be Excellent value.

    Apparently neodymium has also been used in Hi-Fi systems for years, but mainly in tweeters. The Pro Audio market were quick to jump in, so the industry responded by desigining their raw Neo drivers to cater for them. So you'll find a lot of the neo raw drivers don't make great bass guitar speakers because they just don't go low enough. There's a few good ones around, but a majority of them are better for PA use - for now anyway. BTW Ingmar, the Eminence Delalite 10's spec up quite well, but stay away from the 12 and 15. The 10" is definitely the pick of the bunch in the Eminence range.

    Thankfully some of the bass amp manufactures have started producing products with these lightweight speakers. I've been watching closely and so far only one manufacturer has been recieving bad reviews for both tone and reliability, even in this thread. All the others seem to have nailed it.

    The issue with Neodymium is heat. Neodymium doesn't tolerate heat as well as Ferrite or other magnetic materials. Scientific fact maybe, but there is a lot of debate as to wether or not this is even an issue in real world audio applications. Indeed the consensus so far is that it's nothing to worry about.

    And my back has never felt better.....................
  8. Mike Dimin

    Mike Dimin

    Dec 11, 1999
    Clinician: EA, Zon, Boomerang, TI. Author "The Art of Solo Bass"
    Neo is great - my EA NL-210 weighs the same as my EA Cxl-112. As has been mentioned, heat is an issue. Heat will permanently demagnetize the neo. One more reason for the expense of Neo is that is very hazardous to work with.

  9. barroso


    Aug 16, 2000
    by the way tha cab i am actually using is made by the italian company called MarkBass. is the website.
    as said by Mr. Dimin is a pleasure to carry around Neo equipped cabinets. really really light. mine is pretty loud too.

    that's why i spoke about a "revolution".
  10. Aristotle


    May 12, 2002
    Easton, MD
    Dan, what info can you give us on the new Neo's? I was just wondering when theyre going to be released and what the estimated MSRP's are? I'm currently in the market for a new cab but I don't know how much longer I can hold out. The GAS is killing me!
  11. Whappo Grande

    Whappo Grande

    Feb 9, 2002
    Santa Clara, CA.
    Manager: AccuGroove Speakers
    We've used neo tweeters from the very beginning. At this last NAMM we introduced our 36 lb (300 watt) 1x10; 38 lb (400 watt) 1x12; 57 lb (600 watt) 2x10 & 74 lb (800 watt) 2x12; all of them with neodymium drivers.

    As a manufacturer you can rush in & skimp on the cost of designing & building neodymium drivers. The end result is a light speaker that sounds mediocre at best & has questionable durability. (this is typical of a market driven company)

    Companies can also invest the time & money needed to build them with every bit of integrity of the best that’s out there. The choice is up to the manufacturer.

    As a consumer, there are neo cabs that you can buy simply because they are inexpensive & sound ends up being less of an issue than weight. You can also invest in those that give you incredible weight savings with solid reliability & great sound.

    Everyone’s needs are different so it’s good to have choices…

  12. whappo, when are you planning to have these cabs on the shelf?

  13. Whappo Grande

    Whappo Grande

    Feb 9, 2002
    Santa Clara, CA.
    Manager: AccuGroove Speakers
    They are all available right now, but the waiting list is getting longer as more & more orders come in. ;)

  14. 112 - $549 list
    115 - $675
    212 - $799
    412 - $1349

    Should be out around late June.
  15. barroso


    Aug 16, 2000
    interesting point Whappo.

    for sure neo speakers are a fresh idea for bass cabs. and for modest players like me tht's a big thind could use these cabs. they are SO light!!
  16. Transverz

    Transverz believer of the Low End Theory

    May 3, 2004
    Los Angeles, CA
    Sorry to ressurect this thread, but has anyone had any luck replacing their existing 2x10 cab speakers with Eminence Delta-Lite 10" Neo speakers? Is it always a successful trade-in or are there lots of things to consider?

    One cab I'm thinking of trading them into would be the Avatar B210. But not sure if that's a good idea.

  17. Petebass


    Dec 22, 2002
    QLD Australia

    On paper, A direct transplant almost work, but it won't be ideal. The larger cab and higher tuning frequency will play havoc with excursion when this cab is played hard, especially since we just created a hump at 80Hz. The result is distortion. Then again, the standard Eminence drivers in this cab seem to do the same on paper, so maybe it's not an issue for you. And distortion at frequencies that low is not easily picked up by the human ear.........

    If it were me, I'd look at fine tuning the cab a bit. They're a fairly good speaker. They like a cabinet volume of about 40 litres each, so an 80 litre cab is ideal. The Avatar 2x10 is more like 108 litres, so I'd put something in there to reduce the cabinet volume a bit.

    However, the Avatar cab is tuned to 63Hz. The Deltalites will work better a 41Hz tuning, so the ports will have to be adjusted (made longer). The trouble is the Avatar has a shelf port which makes it near impossible to adjust. The only way I can see this working is if we block the existing port, and install a circular port wherever it will fit.
  18. Transverz

    Transverz believer of the Low End Theory

    May 3, 2004
    Los Angeles, CA
    Thanks Petebass,

    So though the Delta-Lites aren't perfect for this cab (too much cabinet volume and too high tuning frequency), the Eminence Deltas that come with the cab are undergoing the same challenges?

    I guess the real question for me is: So there isn't going to be a major advantage to running these Delta-Lites, other than to save on weight? And even then, is the weight worth the sound mismatch?

    Thanks for the detailed info. I live for stuff like that. I appreciate it!

  19. Lockout


    Dec 24, 2002
    Just out of curiosity, does anyone make 12" neodymium drivers that will work well for bass in a smaller-volume cabinet (~1.8 cubic feet)?
  20. Transverz

    Transverz believer of the Low End Theory

    May 3, 2004
    Los Angeles, CA
    Quick, but important, side question on the Neodymium stuff and their thermal sensitivities:

    I run an SVT-4 Pro: Will I fry the HECK out of a 2x10 cab with Neodymium Delta 10's in them?

    Eminence Delta-Lite Neodymium: 300 watts handling each (600watts total)

    SVT 4 Pro: 1200 watts continuous bridged @ 4 ohms

    Am I looking at a super-fried cab?