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Neo's can't handle low B??

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by abarson, Mar 18, 2009.

  1. abarson


    Nov 6, 2003
    Santa Cruz
    With regards to my 15" DIY cab with an Eminence C2515 speaker, I did some testing:

    Genz-Benz GBE 400 w/MTD Kingston 5 and Fender Jazz 4
    Sounded huge and powerful, but the low B sounded kind of wierd, like it couldn't make up its mind whether to distort or not. Other than that, just as sweet as my Tubeworks.

    Ampeg SVT-4Pro w/MTD Kingston 5 (not the same one!)
    Everything on the low B string lost volume. Couldn't find a good tone, but the knob selection was a bit overwhelming. Sounded like a gorilla trying to suppress a fart.

    A veteran bass player happened by and stated that low note rolloff is a known problem with neodymium drivers. Is this common knowledge? Is this what other players are experiencing?
  2. greenboy


    Dec 18, 2000
    remote mountain cabin Montana
    greenboy designs: fEARful, bassic, dually, crazy88 etc
    You and the "vet" seem to have something in common, but hopefully yours stems from having experienced only one neo driver, in a cab not necessarily optimized for it, let alone much better ones.

    The vet's problem runs a lot uh, deeper.
  3. jobu3

    jobu3 Artist formerly known as Big Joe

    Feb 17, 2002
    Mountain Top, PA
    Could be the bass too.
  4. +1
  5. Fuzzbass

    Fuzzbass P5 with overdrive Gold Supporting Member

    Haha. "Veteran" musicians can be as full of urban legends as anyone... and because they have held those misconceptions longer, they are probably less likely to give them up, because that would mean admitting they've been wrong for all this time. Vanity such as this is human nature, unfortunately.
  6. fivestringdan

    fivestringdan Supporting Member

    Dec 4, 2001
    Little Rock, AR
    My 2x12 genz new kills on any string. Not sure what you were hearing.
  7. not to rip this thread but what is a good brand neo speaker and or cab for good deep tone and is that posible ?
  8. kraigo


    Jun 21, 2007
    Minneapolis, MN
    If you're doing a homebrew, look at the fEarful thread.

    If you're buying new, it's possible at a variety of pricepoints. You'll have to be more specific. On the cheap side, Avatar gets a lot of love, but I've never played one.

  9. Rick Auricchio

    Rick Auricchio Registered Bass Offender

    The most likely cause is the cabinet design (or lack of it). The speaker is fine.

    And neo speakers have no "low end rolloff" problem. It's just a different type of magnet.
  10. rpsands


    Jul 6, 2007
    Phoenix, AZ
    I heard there are not enough picofarads in neo magnets.
  11. stflbn


    May 10, 2007
    I have no problem with my low B as shown in my signature... but... I also do not hammer on my B string unmercifully.
  12. abarson


    Nov 6, 2003
    Santa Cruz
    Thanks, all!
    I'll mark the vet's comments down to urban legend or personal bias. Or maybe he was just trying to be politically correct, and not say that my "design" sucks! I've kind of drawn the conclusion that it can't handle low B string notes nicely, but it still sounds great for standard EADG.
    It's also true that the only other neo loaded cabinet I've encountered was a Genz-Benz Neox112, and that did sound very different from all non-neo speakers I'd encountered. Without more exposure to neo's, I don't always know what I'm hearing in comparison. Your insight is appreciated, as always.
    I'm not too familiar with 5-string basses either, but I trust MTD as a decent reference.
  13. As I remember the same ridiculous myths were abundant when we went from AlNiCo magnets to ceramic. Neo speakers, just like any other, can handle the full range of frequencies as long as the box design is correct. I too think you got the cabinet design wrong. Sorry.

  14. Kenny Allyn

    Kenny Allyn

    Mar 25, 2006
    Neos NOT being able to take a low B is not my experience.

    :meh: ... The problem is most likely another factor.
  15. agedhorse

    agedhorse Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 12, 2006
    Davis, CA (USA)
    Development Engineer-Mesa, Product Support-Genz Benz
    There is no reason why a Neo driver will not work just as well (or even better) than a ceramic magnet driver. None whatesoever. It all comes down to how good the designer is, and how appropriate the particular driver is for the target design.
  16. pbass62


    Sep 24, 2007
    Concord NC
    I let my GB Neox 212 speak for itself! It handles a thumped B better than a NYC bellhop handles luggage:hyper:
  17. DukeLeJeune

    DukeLeJeune rational romantic mystic cynical idealist Supporting Member Commercial User

    Nov 24, 2008
    Princeton, Texas
    Owner & designer, AudioKinesis; Auth. mfg, Big E (Home Audio only)
    Bass extension depends on the parameters of the woofer and the box that it's in.

    Just so happens that neo magnets are used in what I believe to be the best line of non-boutique woofers for bass guitar, the Eminence Kappalite family.
  18. Rick Auricchio

    Rick Auricchio Registered Bass Offender

    abarson, have you broken in the driver?

    Feed it a 30Hz sinewave for a day or so. Measure AC volts at the speaker cable and keep it at 10v or less. You should see the cone vibrating about 1/8". You can use a computer or record a looping 30Hz on a CD. I used an effects unit that can generate a tone.

    After a day, play through it again.
  19. Big John66

    Big John66

    Feb 12, 2008
    I played my recently acquired Avatar B-410 neo for the first time last night. A Lakland 5502 threw LMII into the B-410 provided gobs of low-end at pretty high volume with no farting in sight. The neo speakers had everything my regular 410 has except the weight.
  20. spode master

    spode master

    Jan 21, 2007
    I can never get enough picofarads, but I've really been trying to find a speaker with lots of Femtofarads.

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