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NEW ORDER'S PETER HOOK

Discussion in 'Bassists [BG]' started by SMEGandtheHEADS, Jan 16, 2002.


  1. ONE OF THE MOST OVERLOOKED MUSICIANS IN THE BUSINESS HOOK HAS BEEN ASTANDOUT FOR MORE THAT 20 YEARS WITH JOY DIVISION, NEW ORDER, REVENGE AND MONACO WHAT DO THE REST OF YOU GUYS THINK OF HIM?
     
  2. I've always been a New Order Fan, and love Peter Hooks Playing.

    Although it must be very hard to play a bass on the floor <g>
     
  3. ZuluFunk

    ZuluFunk

    Apr 14, 2001
    Pennsylvania
    Not overwhelmed by him, but overall, pretty decent. I can't find anything bad to say anyway.

    btw - Is the "Caps Lock" button on your keyboard broken?
     
  4. NO IM HARD OF HEARING
     
  5. Hey SMEGandtheHEADS...care to give us a rendition of "OM"?

    (If you're what I think you are then you'll get that)
     
  6. i havent preformed that song since that "tension sheet" incident way back
     
  7. I think he's one of my biggest influences. When i think bass solos, I think of his melodies.
     
  8. CaptainWally

    CaptainWally Supporting Member

    Oct 21, 2000
    Sandy Eggo, CA
    I've listened to plenty of Joy Division and
    New Order. What songs come to mind that
    would exemplify Hook's playing?
     
  9. with Joy Division
    "love will tear us apart"
    "Isolation"
    "24 hours"
    "These days"
    "She's lost control"

    with New Order and Monaco IMHO all too often he used the same overdubbed sliding riffs, especially on the new NO album, which sounds like New Order by numbers, but of that stuff I'd pick "Regret" and "Thieves like us".
     
  10. CaptainWally

    CaptainWally Supporting Member

    Oct 21, 2000
    Sandy Eggo, CA
    Don't get me wrong, I like Joy Division, New Order,
    and Peter Hook's solo album. Great songs.

    The bass playing is the tunes mentioned isn't
    really noteworthy (IMO) and therefore I wouldn't
    consider him "overlooked".

    He gets interesting sounds with effects and
    plays some nice melodies....but....am I missing
    something here?
     
  11. I like his style and his tone. I think his lines are tasty.

    And the man himself is one great big a******.
     
  12. well, as the time-honoured saying here at TB goes, "he ain't no Victor Wooten":D
    it's all technically simple stuff, and IMHO Simon Gallup of The Cure is a far better and more technically capable player in the alt.rock genre.

    but I still give Hooky credit for being distinctive and for coming up with some memorable riffs, especially in the Joy Division days, even though nowadays I wish he'd stop recycling the same old "sliding-around-the-fretboard" stuff .
     
  13. Smiling Bob

    Smiling Bob

    Jan 19, 2002
    North Wales
    My ex-girlfriend was related to him. H ebought her a really cool, expensive leather coat! I know you all wanted to know that!
     
  14. DanGouge

    DanGouge

    May 25, 2000
    Canada!
    New Order is like a movie with a good ensemble cast performance, it's good but no one really stands out to me. It's how they all come together that counts.
    -Dan
     
  15. CaptainWally

    CaptainWally Supporting Member

    Oct 21, 2000
    Sandy Eggo, CA
    Well said --- my thoughts exactly....
     
  16. Mock Turtle:
    I won't argue directly (simon's been probably my biggest single influence, though most bass players would giggle to hear me admit it) .. but we should note he's badly ripping Hook off ... here's Hook on the topic from http://www.thomaswictor.com/book.html


     
  17. Bruce Lindfield

    Bruce Lindfield Unprofessional TalkBass Contributor Gold Supporting Member

    Having been around at the time and playing in bands then, I can testify that Hook is the "original" and spawned countless imitators as he says. I saw one of New Order's first "secret" gigs after the death of Ian Curtis and the sound was awesome - I was standing a few feet in front of the band in a small club in Brightion with no stage and they were incredibly intense.

    I think that looking back it is possible to lose perspective on the impact that Joy Division and New Order had on other musicians at the time - they weren't that popular at the time and only became legends with the "fans" in retrospect. But a lot of musicians went to their gigs and picked up on Hook's sound, which really drove the band in the early days.

    Before Joy Division, it was always the case that this type of music was driven by the guitars; but JD were a revelation in that the songs are clearly written around the basslines and the guitar is often incidental. This gave them a completely different "feel" and I think it made all the bass players in the UK sit up and take notice - suddenly we could be the most important member in the band!

    I think that "Blue Monday" being a big hit in the clubs was the death of Hook as an innovative player and he has declined ever since - he just didn't seem to be "bothered" any more and lost the instensity of his playing in Joy Division and early New Order.

    If people just wanted programmed rhythms, why bust a gut to play a driving bass line?
     
  18. I won't argue directly (simon's been probably my biggest single influence, though most bass players would giggle to hear me admit it) .. but we should note he's badly ripping Hook off ...

    well, the similarities are there- the low-slung bass, use of chords, use of chorus (although Gallup has used distorted tones a lot too), sliding lines, but I think Gallup has taken whatever Peter Hook influence and gone far further than Hook ever did- you couldn't imagine Hook playing a line like "sinking" or "piggy in the mirror"(live version), or even "a forest" and a lot of Cure basslines are not like Joy Division or New Order, and more conventional supportive lines.

    meanwhile Hooky's still recycling the same old sliding lines,
    And I'm proud of the fact that I've worked hard and achieved something, but you have to be careful, I suppose. But that was the only time I've ever been irked by it, was when I saw [Simon Gallup] play live. Everybody always says, "You know, that guy in the Cure just ripped you off."- probably people telling him that has caused "the death of Hook as an innovative player"- that he can rest on his laurels and not try anything new.

    as for the low-slung style, in an old interview in Guitarist Hook said that he wore the bass low as "all the players I liked wore it low- like Paul Simonon of the Clash".
    who's imitating who?
    also Jean-Jacques Burnel of The Stranglers used to wear his bass low around 1978/79, and do the crouched playing position thing too- as seen on the video of the Battersea Park gig in 1978.

    an amusing aside, Gallup could be seen as having copied Hook in using a custom built long-scale semi-acoustic bass (Hook had his custom-made by Chris Eccleshall, Gallup's by Dick Knight), but switched to using Gibson Thunderbirds around 95/96.
    when New Order were on TOTP last year, Peter Hook was playing a Thunderbird too.... ;)

    come to think of it, Steve Harris of Iron Maiden wears his bass low, plays chords a lot, including using the open strings as a drone- did he rip off Hooky too?
    John Entwistle could say that every bass player (including Hook;)) who uses roundwounds with a cutting tone ripped him off...
    seems to me Mr Hook should keep his ego in check, stop accusing everyone of ripping him off and try something different in his playing rather than re-cover old ground.
     
  19. Some good points, MockTurtleRegulator and Bruce. I agree Hook's prolly not progressed much since his Joy Division days, and will grant that Simon lays down some pretty non-Hooky lines too.

    Simon (The Cure in general) still ripped Hook (and the rest of JD / early NO) off pretty seriously ... but hey, I dont really care, they've made some of my favourite music in doing so. But if I were Hook and I saw other people making ****loads more money than i was by ripping me off ... again, not saying Gallup "stole" Hook's style , but i can see Hook's frustration ...

    PS I probably rip both of them off at times, and if I ever get the money I think it'd be hard *not* to get a custom longscale semi-accoustic ... hmmm .....
     
  20. Bruce Lindfield

    Bruce Lindfield Unprofessional TalkBass Contributor Gold Supporting Member

    Well, I think that a lot of the names being talked about here did their best work in the 1980s and haven't really taken it on any further - I think they hit the typical "block" of the self-taught player and are doomed to repeat themselves as they can't take it any further.

    I remember in the early 80s being really inspired by new bands I saw live every week, where the bass player was really doing something different and that I hadn't heard before - I wanted to go out and try it stright away.

    So I was seeing bands like Stranglers, New Order, XTC, Echo & the Bunnymen, Magazine, Teardrop Explodes, the Cure etc etc. Being a bass player was really exciting!

    But in the late 90 early 00s - I just don't hear any new ideas in rock/pop bass players - the old groups are re-hashing their hey day - liek the Bunny men and New Order - while newer bands like Travis, StarSailor, ColdPlay have really boring basslines! :(

    From about 95 onwards I have had to look to the Jazz world for inspiration and innovation....