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Newbie seeks cab upgrade advice

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Brian Middleton, Feb 8, 2005.

  1. Brian Middleton

    Brian Middleton

    Feb 4, 2005
    Hi everybody. I want to upgrade my rig, which is a PowerJazz into a Trace Elliott AH250 into a Hartke 115 XL, all vintage 1989. I also have a Bag End 15-inch cab (S15 I think) that I use for low-volume gigs.

    The first item on the upgrade agenda is the Hartke. I'm looking for three things in a new cab:

    1) nice round, warm, but tight lows/low-mids. Enough midrange to cut through the mix, but I don't need a lot of top end, and what there is should be clear and smooth. I'm strictly an "old school" fingerstyle/pick player.

    2) enough volume to fill a medium-sized room without PA support. (By "medium-sized," I mean your typical function hall--say about 2500 square feet.)

    3) light weight--I'm an old fart. Definitely nothing above 80 lbs., and under 65 lbs. per unit would be preferable.

    My budget would top out at about $800, but I'd rather keep it in the $500-600 range.

    I'm also interested in how well a cab records, though I'm fairly happy with the sound I get off the Bag End for recording purposes so that's not necessarily a huge factor.

    Here's what I've been looking at:

    - Avatar Neo 1x15 (or 1x12?) plus 2x10
    - Dr. Bass 1x15 plus 2x10
    - Dr. Bass 2x12
    - 2x Aguilar GS112
    - Schroeder 21012 (this is a little over both the $ and weight budgets, but I hear such good things that I have to put it on the list)

    Anybody have any suggestions which direction I should look in first? Any good options I'm missing?

    Many thanks....
  2. iriegnome

    iriegnome Bassstar style Supporting Member

    Nov 23, 2001
    Kenosha, WI 53140
    Just a point of view reference for you. I am currently getting out of all of my SWR (Goliath II and Big Ben) and going with the Schroeder cabinets. They are great. My SWR 4x10 runs about $800. The Schroeder 1210 that I bought is only $675 and is about 30 pounds lighter.
  3. lo-freq

    lo-freq aka UFO

    Jan 19, 2003
    DFW, Texas
    From your tonal taste, I'd suggest the Schroeder 1212.

    It has a very nice warm, round tone in the low end and low mids, cuts through very well and is very smooth all over (it will also get VERY loud for its size).
  4. IvanMike

    IvanMike Player Characters fear me... Supporting Member

    Nov 10, 2002
    Middletown CT, USA
    you might also want to look into more powerful heads to run the bag end. i run my s-15 with 1/2 a a stewart 2.1 which puts out about 400 watts into it. loud enough for most gigs w/o a problem.
  5. Brian Middleton

    Brian Middleton

    Feb 4, 2005
    Hi lo-freq,

    Would you say a single Schroeder 1212 would put out enough SPL for a typical small-to-medium room gig? Keep in mind I have a loud drummer. :D

    I liked the look of the smaller Schroeders but I was afraid a single one wouldn't be enough, and two of them is beyond my budget.
  6. Steve


    Aug 10, 2001
    That description fits an Eden D115XLT perfectly.
  7. iriegnome

    iriegnome Bassstar style Supporting Member

    Nov 23, 2001
    Kenosha, WI 53140
    Schroeder 1212!!! MMMYea 1212 :cool:
  8. lo-freq

    lo-freq aka UFO

    Jan 19, 2003
    DFW, Texas
    You should probably talk to Brian Barrett or Jorg Schroeder.
    I couldn't say with your head how loud it would get.
    With 600W or more it will get plenty loud for most club gigs.
  9. Contrapuntal


    Mar 1, 2004
    I'm an older fart too and also play mainly fingerstyle (Soul, R&B...) I recently traded in my Ampeg 210 & 115 for a couple of Aguilar GS112s and am very VERY happy. They're lighter than the Ampeg cabs were (only 42lbs), have a great deep mellow sound and also fall into your budget. They have great handles for easy carrying. Everyone in the band whoever carries one of them is always amazed how light they are (for such a big sound). They look good too. I play them through an Ashdown MAG 300R and a Sansamp BDDI.

    Aguilar customer service is also fantastic. I bought one new and one used and the used one had lost a grill screw cover and I emailed them and they mailed one (actually they sent me three!) immediately.

    I based my decision on reading the many positive posts here on Talkbass...they're are many Aggie converts here.

  10. iriegnome

    iriegnome Bassstar style Supporting Member

    Nov 23, 2001
    Kenosha, WI 53140
    Forget all these others. Take my advice and buy an SWR Goliath II with a Big Ben 18 under it. You will thank yourself. Oh and by the way did I mention that I have my Goliath II and Big Ben for sale :hyper: for an awesome TB price :smug: :hyper: :eek:
  11. Brian Middleton

    Brian Middleton

    Feb 4, 2005
    OK, so we've got votes for the Schroeder 1212, the stacked Aguilar GS112's, and the D115XLT.

    Leaving the Eden aside for a sec....is there anybody out there who has used both the Schroeder and the Aguilars and can compare them? Which rig would mate better with a Thunderfunk TB420 (the early frontrunner in the amp upgrade stakes)?

    Thanks, guys! This is really helpful.
  12. TheChariot


    Jul 6, 2004
    Boston, MA
    Avatar's are nice and cheap, and you can load em up with a whole ton of power.... but I think the easier solution is to just pick up a small-box Schroeder cabinet. Everyone who owns a Schroeder will swear by its volume capabilities. My vote goes to either the 1210 or the 1212.
  13. lo-freq

    lo-freq aka UFO

    Jan 19, 2003
    DFW, Texas
    The Ag's are a bit mid-shy (scooped) and don't cut through with a band nearly as well as the Schro's.
  14. tim99

    tim99 Supporting Member

    Jan 28, 2003
    You would like the low smooth warm sound of the Aguilar GS112, but they may not have the midrange you seek. People who strive for mids to cut through the mix often like the Bergantino HT112 over the Aguilar GS112.

  15. Brian Middleton

    Brian Middleton

    Feb 4, 2005
    Well, I have spent a few more weeks scouring the web for info since my initial post, and I even got to get out to a couple of music stores and try a few things (the only definitive thing I learned from this process is that I want something that sounds as unlike a Bergantino 310 as possible!).

    I'm leaning toward a 2x12 cabinet, and I've pretty much narrowed it down to the Dr. Bass RX212 and the Schroeder 1212.

    Running down the pros & cons...basically, the Dr. Bass costs half as much and has that cool non-fuzzy coating (a definite plus in my cat-infested house); the Schroeder is a little smaller and lighter and can handle about twice as much power.

    I guess the question is, what does the Schroeder give me for that extra $350 or so? Anybody who's played through both, can you give me an idea of the difference? I've done some searches, but while there's a ton of stuff on each maker individually, and some comparisons with other makers (especially Dr. Bass vs. Avatar), I couldn't find any direct Dr. Bass/Schroeder comparisons.
  16. I'd like to throw in my obligitory suggestion for the Gallien-Krueger Neo 2 x 12. Great Cab. 600 watts @ 8 ohms, 64 lbs.
  17. jayzarecki


    Feb 23, 2005
    san diego, CA
    wow! i must be out of it...ive never heard of any of these things!!! the last SWR i played was this ****ty 1x12 combo. What ever happened to ampeg/fender/GK....and lets not forget the best bass cabs/amps ever. Mesa Boogie! Can someone explain to me what these amps are, ive asked a ton of bass people i knwo and no one knows what any of this stuff is?
  18. Brian Middleton

    Brian Middleton

    Feb 4, 2005
    Dr. Bass

    These are both small shops--Dr. Bass deals only direct as far as I know, while Schroeder has a small dealer network. They make cabinets that appeal to old farts like me because they're compact and lightweight and reasonably priced and supposedly sound great (I haven't heard any of them yet).

    If you search the amp forum for "Schroeder" you'll find a huge mega-thread with over a thousand posts in it. The info on Dr. Bass is a little more scattered, but there's lots of it (search on "Dr.Bass" without a space in between).
  19. Brian Middleton

    Brian Middleton

    Feb 4, 2005
    Yeah, I took a long look at this--I even came close to ordering a GK 2x12 Neo/1001RB II combo. But then I stopped and thought, the GK costs the same as the Schroeder, and weighs 15 pounds more...so unless I would like the sound better, what's the point? And from what I've read so far, I suspect I would like the sound of the Schroeder better.

    Also, if I buy a 2x12 I'm going to use it as a standalone, so I'd prefer a 4 ohm cab.
  20. iriegnome

    iriegnome Bassstar style Supporting Member

    Nov 23, 2001
    Kenosha, WI 53140
    Just got my 48 pound 1000 watt 1212 from Jorg Schroeder. WOW. There is nothing that I can say that describes this cabinet. Tone and quality. $689 shipped. 1000 Watts. 48 pounds. The cover is really cool too. I started as a peavey guy. Dual 15's, 1516's, 1820's, 3620's. Then moved to SWR and I thought I found heaven. Until I realized I hated the Foster horn and at 89 pounds, these things are getting heavey at 4 in the morning. I found the Mega thread for Schroeder and called the company. A man answered the phone "Hello". I was pretty sold on them from there. I spoke with Jorg for about 20 minutes. Great guy and you can talk to him about your rig, style and sound. He will help figure out the cabinet for you. For me it was the 1212, because of my love for 18's. Personal service and when you call the company you talk to the guy who owns it, make the cabinets, and even answers his own phone. :cool: