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No bass on Metallica's "...And Justice For All"

Discussion in 'Recordings [BG]' started by Kelly Lee, Sep 24, 2005.

  1. Kelly Lee

    Kelly Lee Yeah, I'm a guy! Supporting Member

    Feb 17, 2004
    Marana, AZ, USA
    ***? I read this on another forum:
    I was wondering if I have been mistaken all these years in believing there were bass tracks on this album? I know Jason had come in to replace Cliff but did he really not play at all on it?
  2. Ian Perge

    Ian Perge Supporting Member

    May 11, 2001
    Evansville, Indiana
    I think it's easy enough to disprove this via straight facts: MOP was released February 21st, 1986, and Cliff's death was on September 27th, 1986. Between those two dates they opened up for Ozzy and started their first headlining tour in Europe (where the bus accident happened.) I think it's improbable that they could write the majority of the album in only seven months while on tour.

    As for the lack of bass on AJFA, I refuse to believe that the band, admittedly while hazing Jason a huge amount, would sacrifice the production of the album simply out of spite, or that producer Flemming Rasmussen would let them do so. I believe what's said to have happened to be true: that the album was mixed to sound as good on cheap car stereos (as their fanbase wasn't nearly as large or as "moneyed" as they would become later in Metallica's career) as it would on a high-end system, and that the low-end suffered because of this decision. Also, the general sound of thrash production at that time period was lacking bass as well - AJFA simply took it a step or two farther.

    There's also the fact that in post-Metallica interviews Jason has been nothing but forthcoming about his "status" in Metallica, and that he most likely would have stated this "on the record" in an interview, or more likely the "Some Kind Of Monster" documentary.
  3. this has been done to death but here we go: There IS bass. Its just turned way down. But there is defiantely bass.
  4. cowsgomoo

    cowsgomoo gone to Longstanton Spice Museum

    Feb 8, 2003
    there's bass... it can be heard in the quiet bits in 'One' definitely.. but it's very very low
  5. ihixulu

    ihixulu Supporting Member

    Mar 31, 2000
    South Shore MA
    There is bass. There are no mids.
  6. Yeah, I read that the rhythm guitar and bass both had scooped mids, and that meant that they were eating up the same frequncies. When they tried to bring the bass up in the mix, it "overpowered " the guitar, so they had to leave it down in the mix. Even though that's the explanation he gave in an old Bass Player, it makes me say COME ON!

    MAJOR METAL The Beagle Father Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jason recorded all the parts for it so its in their just not mixed right.
  8. Kelly Lee

    Kelly Lee Yeah, I'm a guy! Supporting Member

    Feb 17, 2004
    Marana, AZ, USA
    Thanks guys. I thought so and I even put the album on last night to make sure. Yes, there is definately bass on there. The reason I posted the question was I wanted to make sure I was correct before I put him straight.
  9. Tash


    Feb 13, 2005
    Bel Air Maryland
    You can hear bass in several places on the album provided you have a decent stero and are not scooping the midrange on your EQ. Blackened, AJFA and Harvester of Sorrow all have parts where the bass can be heard reasonably clearly under the guitars.
  10. Joe Garage

    Joe Garage

    Mar 13, 2005
    I think to production serves the songs. This album has most aggressive and trashy songs Metallica ever recorded, and a very commercial production like they have on the Black album would not fit the songs that well.

    You get to hear a lot of Jason on his first recording with the band called “Garage Days” where the bass is very upfront.
  11. Petary791


    Feb 20, 2005
    Michigan, USA
    There you go.

    And the song "To Live is To Die" was written by Cliff.
  12. That's BS. If you're going to EQ stuff to sound decent on a car stereo or boom box, you want that bass presence. Every time I've done mixes, you run what you think would be a nice sounding mix out to the car and have a cheap boom box along.

    AJFA is just excessively poorly mixed.
  13. Audiophage


    Jan 9, 2005
    The bass is mixed horribly on the retail version of that album, but it is there if you listen hard enough. Jason definetly had a part in the album seeing that he had writing credits for "Blackened".

    I have a version of "...Justice" that has the bass mixed much better. Its pretty cool, but I don't know exactly how it was made or if its really is Jason's playing.
  14. There is definately bass on that album. I'm pretty positive you can hear it clearly in one of the songs, don't remember which one. I think it's Shortest Straw or Harvestor of Sorrow. I remember being able to hear it clearly in one of them.
  15. Audiophage


    Jan 9, 2005
    The intro of "Blackened" has some pretty audible bass.

    MAJOR METAL The Beagle Father Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jason did a great Job playing One live, I particularly liked his tone on that song when he was playing with the Sadowskys. :bassist:
  17. did james or lars have anything to do with the mixing of it?
    sometimes its a bad idea to let egos get into the mixing, it always seems to be the bass that dissapears.
    its happened to me a few times.
    has anyone had this with their own band?
    its a right bummer.
  18. origami


    Jun 26, 2005
    Big D TEXAS
  19. dannoman

    dannoman Supporting Member

    Feb 3, 2004

    I believe that it is done by our fellow TB poster Lokire.... Correct me if i'm wrong....
  20. Hahah... i'm listening to the title track, this is really cool.