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Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by rummonkey, Aug 31, 2015.
I was on my way out and took a quick snap. There's a D800+ under there, with pedals on top of that.
The dark side of tone
Hey @agedhorse I noticed this yesterday while I was recording. The first image is the DI signal out of the WD set to Post EQ and the 2nd one is Pre-EQ. Are those normal "noise" levels?
Off the top of my head (and because I don't have any reference levels with which to compare) and depending on the gain of the recording device, it may be normal. It looks like the noise in post mode is 85dB (maximum at 20kHz) below whatever zero reference you are using, but particularly the difference between pre and post looks about right (again, this depends on the settings, but with the gain control at 12:00 and the eq flat, bright switch off it looks reasonable.
Generally,the s/n ratio of the pre eq signal will be slightly better, it looks like the average is between 6 and 9dB, and the shape looks reasonable too, representing 1/f noise. This maximum is ~94dB (ignoring the noise at 10-12kHz which is likely a measurement artifact.
I don't think you will find many DI's on bass amps with this level of noise performance, this is unweighted and not averaged. Applying weighting and averaging would improve the numbers to (guessing) better than 100dB s/n which IME is about as good as it gets without going into ape-poopie bizarre design territory.
A couple of things about noise, because these questions come up from time to time here. There is noise that is significant and objectionable because if falls into a sensitive part of the hearing (ie. 50/60Hz and its harmonics) and noise from say 500Hz to say 10kHz which also falls into sensitive hearing territory. When we start looking at >10kHz, the normal adult hearing is beginning to roll off, a tweeterless cabinet will be well rolled off, and even many horns used in bass cabinets will be 6dB down or more. These conditions generally reduce the effects of the noise >10kHz by 9-12dB.
Looking at your graphs, the area of 50/60Hz, 100/120Hz, 200/240Hz and any 3 phase artifacts are below -100dB, and the region between 500Hz and 10kHz is better than 90dB down in raw, unweighted numbers.
I appreciate the in-depth answer! Good to know that I don't have to worry about it. I thought the tube might be damaged or something
Quick note for D800+ and D800 owners... If you need a REALLY solid case on the cheap - Harbor Freight has a coupon for the Apache 4800 case right now for $45!!! It's similar to Pelican and fits the D800+ perfectly, or the D800 with room for stuff. I love mine and its well worth the schlep if you need the protection.
4800 Weatherproof Protective Case - X-Large
@agedhorse what sold me on the Subway was doing sound for 2 bands where the D800 was their head. I took the DI, pre Eq. Loved it. I typically throw down a Radial or a Type 85. I almost never, ever use an on board DI. I was just real curious having had the Subway DI stomp pedal. I had to get the D800 after that.
So far the honeymoon is on!
The band that really pushed me over the top was Petty Fever an incredibly good Tom Petty tribute. Steve the bass player is just rock solid - the whole band is and tonally, the bass just sang. Some gratuitous pics below. I wanted something fitting for a Tom Petty show and for some reason, a carnival midway jumped out. Sid, my lighting partner lit the fuse ;-)
I own one of these and use it regularly for protecting my D800+. For some gigs, I will just use the bag, but if there is any chance of the head getting bumped in transit, I place the head+bag in the Apache case with only the foam for the lid. (Which I secured with flexible adhesive.)
$45 is a great price for the case!
Nice. That will work for my video projectors !
That's a DI that's designed by a pro audio guy for pro audio guys.
Yes well I spent a part of my day today playing with the D-800 DI and a U5. You nailed it brother!
So, this happened. I’m in.
Follow you home, did it?
Excuse me if it's a "dumb" question, but why are the sends of the FX loop in the subway DI pedals set to line level?
Wouldn't it be more convenient to be able to put some other bass pedals in the loop by using instrument level signals?
I recently went through this tough choice and ended up with the SW+ Preamp. Such a nice piece of kit. For me the SW+ was a little more finnicky to dial in, but once I did it just sat in the mix sooooo nice. (Nicely??)
A lot of my gigs are IEM but when I sub I use my normal rig. I always bring my small pedalboard to go direct to the FOH and then eq my stage tone with my amp so I don't affect (Effect??) the FOH. But I forgot to bring my small pedalboard with the SW+ to the gig! DOH! I mean, the DI out of the Genzler MG800 ain't no slouch. And it sounded great. But I DID miss the SW+. It just gets'er'dun.
Oh well....I got paid. But next time I won't forget.
The DI+ is not a tone shaping pedal; it is a preamp. Think of it like an amp; instrument input - [input level - eq - fx insert - output level ] - power amp.
If you use pedals, I recommend putting drive pedals before the DI+, and delays/modulations in the loop (yes in the loop they need to work with line level)
Also note that the mic level direct out is before the loop so does not contain loop fx , but the preamp out does contain fx.
Btw I absolutely love mine!