Passive MusicMan with passive preamp

Discussion in 'Pickups & Electronics [BG]' started by ObeyDaRiffness, May 20, 2019.

  1. ObeyDaRiffness

    ObeyDaRiffness

    Sep 25, 2016
    Hi all, I had this idea for an MM/P hybrid, sick and twisted I know, but is it electronically feasible?

    EDIT: What I'm trying to do here is finding passive setups that kinda work the same way as a preamp by selective cutting (apparent "bass boost" to the single coil sound by cutting just one of the coils' treble and midrange in series, bass "tightening" + apparent "mid boost" by putting one of the two coils slightly out of phase with the other one at the expense of some bass on that coil in parallel, a ToneStyler instead of a standard tone control, which retains much more mids and has a nice slight boost (resonant peak induced by the capacitor) right at the cutoff frequency of every position)
    You've got your series humbucker, your parallel humbucker, your single coil (which in this is split and oriented like reverse p split coil), and every sound in between thanks to the spin-a-split (at 8 or 7 you've got a softer, more polite vintage sounding humbucker, at 2 or 3 a single coil sound with a bit more body and mids), then you've got OMG mode like on the G&L L1000, which is basically a "single coil with bass boost" sound, by connecting in series the preferred coil (reverse P) with just the low end of the other coil, huge and thunderous yet still plenty of clarity and the spin-a-split allows you to adjust the amount of low end from 1 to 10, therefore basically making it like a bass "boost knob" for the single coil sound. Then the rickenbacker style cap mod, which is loved by many as it gives back mids to parallel mode at the expense of some bass on parallel wired dual pickup basses, so why would it not work on a parallel humbucker? You connect the cap to only one of the two coils, which loses all bass and when wired with the other pickup the two arent perfectly in phase with each other, so, you lose SOME bass and get a lot of mids back from the scoop created by the parallel wiring, but without losing its glassiness and clarity. It's instant metal sound basically. For some genres you gotta pull some low end out and rely on mids. It's been done by Rickenbacker since the 4001 and many people do it on all sprts of 2 pickup basses. We're talking about the two coils of a humbucker here, but it should work about the same way.
    So.
    You want the glassy highs and full lows of a parallel humbucker for most of the show but need some extra mids and grit at some point? Turn on the rick cap.
    You need the single coil for most of the show and need some extra clank and harmonic content for some very in your face pieces? Put the coils in parallel with the ric cap on and the spin-a-split at 0 and start rolling up until you like it.
    You use the hot series mode most of the time for aggressive music and need something sweeter and a litttle open but the single coil is downright too brittle for the music you play? Run the coils in series with the spin-a-split at 2 or 3 for a slightly thicker, yet unmistakably in the single coil ballpark sound.
    Use the classic spanky and dynamic sounding single coil or parallel most of the times, but need an extra push in the lows for a riff or a chorus? Turn on the OMG mode, start rolling the spin-a-split til where you like it.
    You pull the spin-a split knob to activate either of the "special sound" you need, the OMG mode or the Rick mode, depending on where the 2-position near slider switch is set. The one in place of the output jack takes the spin-a-split and capacitors completely out, so you can just set them for what you need (you can choose between standard spin-a-split, OMG mode, Rick zing), leave it like that and then switch between your "regular" meat and potatoes sound and that specific setup whenever you need just with the flick of a switch near your tone pot, and perhaps another one on the three way slider switch. Sounds pretty useful to me.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: May 21, 2019
  2. bass40hz

    bass40hz Cigar smoker, scotch drinker, American Patriot Supporting Member

    Aug 13, 2014
    Richlands, NC
    Get the SIMS quad coil pickups like in the Spector Rudy Sarzo signature...they can be split, HB or sc all in one housing selectable with a 3 pos toggle. They already have it figured out very well, although it is an active setup.
    Rock on.
     
  3. ObeyDaRiffness

    ObeyDaRiffness

    Sep 25, 2016
    The wiring options don't concern me at all, what I'm wondering is if my "Passive Preamp" will work?
     
  4. bass40hz

    bass40hz Cigar smoker, scotch drinker, American Patriot Supporting Member

    Aug 13, 2014
    Richlands, NC
    I am not an expert but I would guess not with the SIMS pups. They are active. Good luck in your quest Rock on
     
  5. walterw

    walterw Supportive Fender Commercial User

    Feb 20, 2009
    alpha-music.com
    what you'd have is the opposite of a preamp! the more caps and filters and stuff you add to tweak this frequency or that frequency the weaker the overall sound gets.

    by the same token, the more coils you pile onto a bass the more they start to kind of interfere with each other, you start losing punch and clarity.

    think of a passive bass like a bicycle, anything that adds "weight" or "friction" will just slow you down.
     
  6. Scoops

    Scoops Why do we use base 10 when we only have 8 fingers Supporting Member

    Oct 22, 2013
    Sugar Creek, Wisc
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but you can't boost mids in a passive circuit. You can only cut frquencies.

    Boosting anything will require active circuit
     
    GilmourD and Wfrance3 like this.
  7. ObeyDaRiffness

    ObeyDaRiffness

    Sep 25, 2016
    I'm not interested in SIMS pickups. I want this to work with a Nordstrand quad coil music man pickup.

    Well yes but sometimes you need to slow down, plus everything is completely bypassable. You've got your series humbucker, your parallel humbucker, your single coil (which in this is split and oriented like reverse p split coil), and every sound in between thanks to the spin-a-split (at 8 or 7 you've got a soft, vintage sounding humbucker at 2 or 3 a single coil sound with a bit more body and mids, then you've got OMG mode, which is basically a "single coil with bass boost" sound, huge and thunderous yet still plenty of clarity and the spin-a-split allows you to adjust the amount of low end from 1 to 10, therefore basically being like a bass boost for the single coil. Then the rickenbacker style cap mod, which is loved by many as it gives back mids to parallel mode at the expense of some bass on parallel wired dual pickup basses, so why would it not work on a parallel humbucker?. It is as close to a preamp as you can get in passive, only you can't actuay boost, just cut.
    You want the glassy highs and full lows of a parallel humbucker for most of the show but need some extra mids and grit? Turn on the rick cap.
    You need the single coil for most of the show and need some extra clank and harmonic content for some very in your face pieces? Put the coils in parallel with the ric cap on and the spin-a-split at 0 and start rolling up until you like it.
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2019
  8. ObeyDaRiffness

    ObeyDaRiffness

    Sep 25, 2016
    Of course you can't. The apparent "mid boost" the rick cap seems to give happens because the P coils get slightly out of phase with the reverse P ones so the mid cancellation that usually occurs in any set of coils wired in parallel gets much less prominent, at the expense of some bass.
     
  9. cnltb

    cnltb

    May 28, 2005
    Passive MusicMan with passive preamp
    A passive pre amp?
    How does that work?
     
  10. Ampslut

    Ampslut

    May 15, 2017
    Barrackville WV
    I don't think that there is anything like a passive preamp in existence.
     
  11. alpho

    alpho

    Mar 10, 2017
    Tucson, AZ
    A normal tone control is a passive filter. A preamp is an active filter.
     
  12. You should build it and report back with audio samples! :thumbsup:
     
  13. Wfrance3

    Wfrance3 Supporting Member

    May 29, 2014
    Tulsa, OK
    To me this seems pretty convoluted, but If it works for your needs and the wiring is not beyond your tackle, definitely do it. I agree with others who beat me to it; you can't boost passively. I would, at most say you can change freq to provide a tone more apt to cut-through, but not actually boost in any form or fashion.
     
  14. tpaul

    tpaul Supporting Member

    Mar 19, 2011
    Vermont
    What the heck is a passive preamp?
     
  15. Ric5

    Ric5 Inactive

    Jan 29, 2008
    Colorado
    I like 5, 8, 10, and 12 string basses
    Sounds interesting
     
  16. Passive MusicMan with passive filtering and switching

    ... might be more accurate.
     
    diegom likes this.
  17. Ric5

    Ric5 Inactive

    Jan 29, 2008
    Colorado
    I like 5, 8, 10, and 12 string basses
    I have 2 stingray clone basses where the fat pickup is wired with a 4 band Audere preamp so the balance control sweeps rear single coil, parallel humbucker, front single coil.

    View attachment 3422273
     
  18. toomanyslurpees

    toomanyslurpees

    Jan 21, 2009
    The musicman pickup was designed with the musicman preamp in mind, it will work without the preamp but whether it works well is a matter that would be up to personal tastes I’m sure...
     
  19. It’s interesting. I have wired the “spin a split” on tone controls, in fact, I set up a friends T40 recently that needed some wiring touched up, but I’m not sure it will work the same on a volume control. However, I’m willing to be proven wrong on that. I also say, go for it and wire it up. Post a video demo and wiring diagram when it’s all done.
     
  20. fermata

    fermata Guest

    Nov 10, 2015