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Pedalboard setup

Discussion in 'Effects [BG]' started by asands, Mar 19, 2017.


  1. asands

    asands Supporting Member

    Feb 1, 2011
    Troy Missouri
    First real post in effects, woo!

    Ok, so currently running a traditional setup of an amp (tone hammer) into cabs after my pedalboard which is small and consists of a boss tuner >Darkglass vintage micro tubes> Dunlop 105q bass Wah(which ill swap for the mini version soon). Im wanting to pickup a powered monitor so I can ditch my head/cabs rig. Thinking I'll most likely go with an EV ZLX 15p and use it as a wedge at the front of the stage. Really just want to cut weight and space and get a more accurate representation of my tone from the FOH without going to in ears. Probably also add a line 6 wireless into the mix.

    I wanna swap out the VMT for a VMT deluxe or ultra but still have the wah after for best sound. So ideal setup would be Line 6 G10 > Boss Tuner> VMT deluxe> Wah > powered monitor. How could I do that while still being able to send a DI line to the FOH board and personal monitor and have the signal with the wah in it since the VMT would now be my DI as well?

    What am I missing?

    Thanks for reading the long winded post and for any suggestions.
     
  2. Pacodelivery

    Pacodelivery Supporting Member

    May 25, 2014
    Baltimore
    You could just get a DI box instead of the Deluxe or ultra, and put it after your wah
     
    Gearhead17 and asands like this.
  3. Seanbassplayer

    Seanbassplayer Supporting Member

    Oct 14, 2016
    I have the EV ZLX12P and bought it for the same reason (wedge) and wasn't exactly what I had hoped for as it got a bit farty and enclosure vibrated a weird type resonance. The 15 may be different but wanted to share my experience with the 12. I would
    Recommend the QSC K series powered monitors as I did try one in store K12 and sounded amazing and quite different than the EV ZLZ12P. My chain at the time was p bass korg tuner Mesa subway di.. def not the subway making it do that as I tried it through the QSC and was fine. I also tried it with my b7K with same results.
     
    HolmeBass and asands like this.
  4. asands

    asands Supporting Member

    Feb 1, 2011
    Troy Missouri
    I was thinking about that. I like the idea of the EQ settings and the attack and grunt switches on those models but I could always do another DI after the wah anyway with the Deluxe.

    I've never owned just a straight DI box but I assume it would have a parallel out to run to a wedge right?
     
  5. asands

    asands Supporting Member

    Feb 1, 2011
    Troy Missouri

    Hmm.... I do like the QSC but they're pretty pricey. Did you end up using that setup?
     
  6. Pacodelivery

    Pacodelivery Supporting Member

    May 25, 2014
    Baltimore
    I'm not actually sure of this but it's my impression that all DI boxes have two outputs one balanced and one that's just the original signal
     
    asands likes this.
  7. Seanbassplayer

    Seanbassplayer Supporting Member

    Oct 14, 2016
    IMG_5698.PNG
    I ended up keeping the ZLX12P and use it at home with my gf and she uses it for a vocal practise monitor. I ended up getting a Traynor SB115 combo and put it on an amp stand and use as a monitor set it neutral/flat p bass>pitchblack tuner> Idiotbox Blowerbox>Smallsound Bigsound mini(on way and here tomorrow:)>Empress Compressor>B7K to SB115 input and send di to PA/Mixer.
     
    Alex O and asands like this.
  8. asands

    asands Supporting Member

    Feb 1, 2011
    Troy Missouri

    That's a sweet little setup!

    Two questions arise after seeing that; what benefit did you get running the compression pre B7k. Two, have you used the pitch black in daytime gigs? Is it actually readable?
     
  9. Seanbassplayer

    Seanbassplayer Supporting Member

    Oct 14, 2016
    I was recommended by a few TB B7K users as well as Doug from Darkglass saying put it before as it adds a magic sauce to the B7K which it def does imho. I've yet to try after but gotta keep B7k at the end atm for the di output.As for pitchblack I can read it with sun glaring on it so it works with my eyes lol
     
    asands likes this.
  10. asands

    asands Supporting Member

    Feb 1, 2011
    Troy Missouri
    Good stuff! I would guess it would help a VMT as well. I'll have to send them a message and see, thanks for all the great info!
     
    Seanbassplayer likes this.
  11. Seanbassplayer

    Seanbassplayer Supporting Member

    Oct 14, 2016
    I would think the VMT would have the same results. Np anytime, Cheers!
     
    asands likes this.
  12. Dave W

    Dave W Supporting Member

    Mar 1, 2007
    White Plains
    Yes, a standard DI like a Countryman Type 85 or Radial JDI would have a parallel output to send to whatever you want.

    Keep in mind that sending dirt through a DI without a speaker sim can result in ice pick high end. Same thing with the tweeter in the PA cab you're thinking about.

    Comp before or after is usually personal preference. If someone is using their B7K/VMTD/Ultra as a DI and wants all of their effects to be sent through it you really have no choice but to put it last in the chain.
     
    petrus61, asands and Seanbassplayer like this.
  13. Seanbassplayer

    Seanbassplayer Supporting Member

    Oct 14, 2016
    Yup the powered monitors/ full range speakers don't like the dirt although the blower box through my Mesa subway di didn't sound harsh at all. DSM Omnicabsim Deluxe is on my gas list and would work perfect for this situation as well or a Broughton HPF/LPF would do the trick too.
     
  14. kurth83

    kurth83

    Mar 28, 2016
    I use a DI as a splitter in the way you are talking about, to have two outputs, the FOH and an on-stage monitor (QSC K10 was my first, but switched to the cheaper and much lighter DBR-10 - 22 lbs - which you might want to check out).

    One thing I found was I needed a line isolator to keep the powered monitor from forming a ground loop with my pedal board, the 'thru" jack on DI's isn't isolated, same was true for a powered DI with two outputs, only the XLR port is isolated.

    It isn't cheap but does the trick nicely:

    Amazon.com: Palmer PAL-PLI01 Line Isolation Box 1 Channel: Musical Instruments
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2017
    Seanbassplayer and asands like this.
  15. asands

    asands Supporting Member

    Feb 1, 2011
    Troy Missouri

    Ok, this makes perfect sense about the high end! I had used a Sansamp BDDI but stopped going straight to the board with it because of this. I'm fairly new to using effects and dirt so I thought this was a symptom of the Sansamp. Ultimately I liked the VMT tone and controls better anyway especially with the Sansamp lacking a mid control.

    I would have never considered a loop issue.

    So stupid question, do folks who run in ears use a cab sim typically? I would think there must be guys using in ears with dirt, right?
     
  16. Seanbassplayer

    Seanbassplayer Supporting Member

    Oct 14, 2016
    I don't use or tried IEM but I think I've read it's the same thing and you still need some sort filter/cab sim or it'll be harsh sounding but someone with experience with IEM might be able to chime in and confirm.
     
  17. flip the order of the wah and the darkglass maybe? Or you could get a simple DI like a radial if you really want the wah after the DG.

    Personally I have a b7k ultra and didn't like how dry/direct it sounded when using it for a clean tone direct. There were other issues as well like the xlr being too hot when the volume was cranked on the b7k ultra in order to drive my power amp. but figured out I absolutely love it running it parallel with my sans amp RBI. The sans amp warms up the clean tone and adds depth to the dirty tone which is already pretty awesome to begin with.

    If you go with a pedalboard/direct based setup like this cabs are pretty subjective, depends on how much you are willing to spend and how picky you are because you're the main person who's going to hear it. I use a crown power amp and ampeg classic cabs mainly because they look cool but have been wanting to get a wedge style cab for acoustic gigs where I'm the only one with a cab onstage. Ive never heard of the powered speaker you mentioned. I'll have to look into it. Here's some of the floor wedge style options I've been looking at.
    IMG_2290.JPG

    Or an ampeg PN-210HLF
    IMG_2289.JPG
    Or in order to save some cash one of the new inexpensive ampeg combos that can kick back. IMG_2291.PNG
     
    Alex O, Seanbassplayer and asands like this.
  18. Dave W

    Dave W Supporting Member

    Mar 1, 2007
    White Plains
    It depends on the player, but yes.

    Lots of preamp/DI boxes have a built in speaker sim on the DI out.
    There are more and more cab sims it there now too. I have a Two Notes Torpedo CAB that I use as part of my recording rig or live rig depending on if I'm running direct or not.
     
    asands and Socobass like this.
  19. asands

    asands Supporting Member

    Feb 1, 2011
    Troy Missouri
    Wow, so it sounds like on top of the cost of a monitor setup I really need to get a cab sim and an isolation unit and the Ultra or deluxe... thinking for the cost of all that I could probably have Don at LDS build me a wedge cab with a mid driver and use the 3015 out of my current cab.

    Hmm... now I'm venturing into the Amps forum instead of effects. Whoops!

    Another question though about the Darkglass pedals. Does anyone find the tone of the deluxe to be that much superior to the VMT? I'm thinking that if I did a wedge cab I've already got quite an EQ setup in the Tone Hammer if I run the DI post (which I usually do anyway). Do the grunt and attack switches make big overall changes by the time the signal gets through FOH?
     
  20. asands

    asands Supporting Member

    Feb 1, 2011
    Troy Missouri
    Nephilmybass, who makes that blue wedge you posted?