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Question about Neck Pocket Gap

Discussion in 'Basses [BG]' started by Wasabi1264, Oct 9, 2004.


  1. Wasabi1264

    Wasabi1264

    Oct 3, 2004
    President: MusicDojo.com
    My Warrior bolt-on sounds and plays pretty well. I had sent it in, and they set it up, and I had noticed prior to sending it in that the truss rod area of the neck was sort of sunk too far into the body gap (where the neck goes). I believe they tried to fix this cosmetic flaw by not bolting the neck tight enough, so that the truss rod area now matches the surface of the body.

    Once I got it back, I noticed that the gap between the neck and body actually is pretty substantial on the treble side. I can literally slide something the thickness of a CD into the gap.

    The bass still sounds good, so is that the bottom line? If it sounds fine, should I not worry about the gap?

    I must say, I love the sound and playability of Warriors, but their construction attention to detail leaves a lot to be desired.

    Thanks!
     
  2. Rhythmalism

    Rhythmalism

    Sep 25, 2004
    As long as it's stable and playable. Shimming it up or whatever they did is alright I suppose, but it would bug me too :D.
     
  3. Tfunked

    Tfunked

    Dec 30, 2003
    From a high $$$ bass like that I would expect better :confused:
     
  4. Wasabi1264

    Wasabi1264

    Oct 3, 2004
    President: MusicDojo.com
    Agreed, and when I confronted them about it, they said "Well, they're handmade." But I've never seen another handmade bass have those problems, and if $150 Squiers can get it right, I'd expect better! It's very disappointing, because the bass sounds and plays incredibly, but every time I look down at the fingerboard, I'm like..."Dang!" The neck pocket gap is really unacceptable to me, because if you need a tight gap to transfer vibes to the body, it just seems weird that they'd be okay with that.

    I'm going to likely buy another bass, but I'm sure I'm going to take a bath on this one if I sell it.

    Bottom line on Warriors, if you get a good one, great, but don't buy it o accept a custom order until you've given it a very thorough once-over.
     
  5. xyllion

    xyllion Commercial User

    Jan 14, 2003
    San Jose, CA, USA
    Owner, Looperlative Audio Products
    Did you buy this new through them or an authorized dealer? If so, I wouldn't stop complaining until they either fixed it or refunded your money. The hand-made argument is bogus! I have a jazz-style bass with a custom neck, and at no place is there a gap any thicker than a business card. I have never personally dealt with Warrior. So, I wish you the best of luck in getting repairs made.
     
  6. Wasabi1264

    Wasabi1264

    Oct 3, 2004
    President: MusicDojo.com
    I bought it new through them at the NAMM show. It had a few NAMM dings on it, but it sounded so good, I thought I could deal with the cosmetic flaws. I sent it back to them to get a bunch of stuff done...faulty mid control (they switched out the preamp), minor neck dings that they sanded out, but one thing was that one of the neck screws just wasn't in straight. Additionally, the neck was kind of countersunk pretty low in the neck pocket. Now, the joint has a big gap, but the top of the neck is more even with the body surface. I'm not sure whether the guy re-setting it up was going for cosmetic effect or what, or if he was trying to make the bass more playable.

    Anyway, the bummer is that I've already spent a bunch shipping the bass to them, and had been without it for about a month already.

    I agree I should be able to get this dealt with, but it's hard to deal with JD, because he's so over-sensitive. I need another person there to deal with. Like I said, if you get a good one, these basses totally kill, but their quality control stinks.
     
  7. xyllion

    xyllion Commercial User

    Jan 14, 2003
    San Jose, CA, USA
    Owner, Looperlative Audio Products
    This really amazes me for a bass that was taken to NAMM. Usually builders like to take their best product to show.

    As for JD being over-sensitive, that is his problem and not yours. Tell them point blank that you are not happy, that you have spent a ton on shipping, and that you have been without this bass for a large amount of time. Ask for a refund. There is no reason that you should be forced to take a huge loss because his ego is getting in the way.
     
  8. That's a poor excuse. It simply means they either did not take the time to measure and cut correctly or don't have the skills. IME, there aren't that many "hand made" bass luthiers that consistently have high enough standards to get these details right. I've been disappointed with many high price "hand made" basses with construction that was not great.

    Fortunately, there are enough that get both the construction details and the tone/playability right to give us great options.
     
  9. Wasabi1264

    Wasabi1264

    Oct 3, 2004
    President: MusicDojo.com
    The other problem is that I'm so anal about construction stuff that I needed to find an equally fussy luthier, and Warrior is not it. I think they concentrate on other things. For example, they had this super expensive ($5K) bass with the same mis-aligned dots!

    I do think Nordstrand will be the guy to build the bass for me. Bummer that probably two birthdays will go by before I get my hands on the bass! ;-)
     
  10. embellisher

    embellisher Holy Ghost filled Bass Player Staff Member Supporting Member

    Carey will definitely be it!

    Like Jeff, I have seen a few 'handmade' basses, some of them by top name luthiers, that have 'issues' that make me look at them and say 'this costs $XXXX, and has this kind of fit/finish issues?'

    I have seen a couple of basses that list for over $4000 that had uneven pickup routes or a gap around the pickup that was so large it looked as if it originally had larger pickups in it.

    I find no 'charm' in a handmade bass that looks handmade. When you get into this price range, a bass should be perfect as far as woodwork and fretwork.

    I am not one to bash a builder, but this isn't the first time I have heard a story like this about something from this particular builder. I saw one in person that had terrible fretwork and visible sanding marks on the back, as well as dodgy pickup routes.
     
  11. pistoleroace

    pistoleroace

    Sep 13, 2002
    WI
    Honestly I'd have to say that after closely looking at 7-8 Warrior basses in a fairly local store, I was and would not be happy with the quality of construction. For the expense and "hand made" aspect, there are many other bass companies out there that are less or the same money, and better quality.

    Keep on them and don't let them beat you down until they fix the problems it has. There is nothing worse than shipping a bass back for repair becuase you have no idea what UPS does to you packages. I have been through this myself with a company of whom I bought two basses from and between them both, they have been back a total of 5 times, now that's a lot of shipping $$$ And the reason basically is, they either were not tested properly before shipping or they didn't fix the problem the first time it was in for repair. I could go on about the problems I have had but basically the last time I had a problem, I threatened to sue for the money back on the last one I bought and all the shipping charges incurred for shipping it back for repair. The company finally let me use their shipping account so they would pay for the shipping.

    Good luck, you may be in for a tough battle.
     
  12. +1

    I've not seen better attention to detail for any cost.
     
  13. Showdown

    Showdown Supporting Member

    Jan 21, 2002
    Honolulu, Hawaii
    If the bass plays and sounds incredible, what is the problem? Isn't the sound and playablilty what matters? I have basses with very tight neck pockets, and basses with gaps, and other than looks I don't see much difference sonically. I personally think too much is made of this issue, YMMV. I agree that an expensive bass should have better workmanship, but if you like the bass otherwise why worry about it?
     
  14. pistoleroace

    pistoleroace

    Sep 13, 2002
    WI

    But you didn't pay the large sum of money for it like he did. When I pay a lot of money for a bass (or anything for that matter) I expect better quality than a Fender Squire or the like.
     
  15. xyllion

    xyllion Commercial User

    Jan 14, 2003
    San Jose, CA, USA
    Owner, Looperlative Audio Products
    Yep, that is the point. When you spend as much as these basses cost new, you have every right to expect it to be built right. Worse yet is that these basses tend to have horrible resale values. So, if you don't like it and decide to sell the bass, then you literally lose thousands of dollars. There is just too much at stake for the builder to get away with sloppy work.
     
  16. I think craftsmanship issues are a indication of either a lack of skill or a lack of pride. If the bass sounds good with obvious craftsmanship issues, it make me wonder if they got there by skill or by luck. It also makes me wonder if there are other areas of the instrument that are compromised that I can't see that may (or may not) become a problem down the road.

    Jeff
     
  17. Aaron Saunders

    Aaron Saunders

    Apr 27, 2002
    Ontario
    The "Well, it's handmade" excuse is enough for me to say nuts to Warrior. Other successive replies in here haven't helped their case.

    Go with another builder -- I've never heard a complaint about Nordstrand's service or product, and every Nordstrand I've seen has been incredibly visually stunning. One particular SC5 with some sort of burl top was one of the backgrounds on my MSN windows for several months (until I reinstalled Win2k and couldn't be bothered to go through the process of setting up like, 14 backgrounds). Great basses!
     
  18. Wasabi1264

    Wasabi1264

    Oct 3, 2004
    President: MusicDojo.com
    Agreed. I'm definitely going with a Nordstrand. The two issues are:

    1. The wait. It's worth it, but a bummer all the same.

    2. I'm going to take a bath if I try to sell the Warrior. I can't in good conscience sell the thing to another buyer. I'll likely attempt to sell it back to Warrior themselves, taking a loss, but hopefully convincing them that their flaws are what's keeping me from a decent resale value. Yeah, I'm a weeny for not just saying "Give me back what I paid," but I honestly feel a bit intimidated, given I've had the bass for a while (since January).
     
  19. Obviously you can do what you want, but the sub-par construction of the instrument is what's making you sell it and the construction problem has been there since day 1. It seems you've been dealing with them for a while about the issue and it still isn't resolved. Their problem has become your problem. I would ask for all my money back if I were you and I would contact their local Better Business Bureau if they balk. Would you cheerfully take a loss if the engine on your brand new car blew up as you were driving home from the dealership?
     
  20. Sorry to hear about your experience but thanks for the Caveat. However, I remember Bass Player reviewed one of Rick Turner's basses and commented about the neck gap. Rick replied that he doesn't ascribe to the theory that the pocket has to be super tight, as long as the neck is firmly bolted to the body you'll get the tone and sustain you're after. Also, if you order parts from Warmoth, for example, they leave a bit of space to compensate for finish buildup.

    That said, a CD-sized gap is pretty big. I've got a couple of instruments with less-than-snug neck fit but nothing that size. This sounds more like Wish bass quality control. That "handmade" excuse is pretty lame.

    I have a Carvin kit bass with a gap on the treble side of the neck pocket. I put a thin maple shim in there. The bass sustains well and I haven't noticed any tonal issues.

    If it were my bass: Since the playability and sound are there, I would try to live with it. Unless there was a problem with the neck shifting.