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question: crazy onboard preamp/EQ setup

Discussion in 'Pickups & Electronics [BG]' started by bongomania, Nov 30, 2005.

  1. Nov 30, 2005 #1
    bongomania

    bongomania Supporting Member Commercial User

    Oct 17, 2005
    PDX, OR
    owner, OVNIFX and OVNILabs
    Hi,
    I'm talking with Matt at FBB Custom about a custom bass, and it's time for me to decide what onboard electronics I want. The pickups will probably be Bartolini P/J passives, and Matt's initial preamp recommendation is a Bartolini 3-band.

    I will be using this bass mostly for soul and reggae, but I do jam with a metal band occasionally, so I want to be able to boost the mids on those occasions. The classic soul/reggae sound is a passive P, but an active setup with a kick to the mids would suit the metal deal better. I play fingerstyle, no pick, and I don't slap a whole lot.

    I don't really want a crapload of knobs and switches on this bass. So I'm thinking what if he were to setup the controls like:

    passive vol/vol/tone knobs
    active mid knob, with switch for range of mids, and a switch for passive bypass

    That's still four knobs and two switches. And am I crazy to have an onboard preamp and DISABLE the high boost/cut and low boost/cut functions? Would I be better off just building the bass passive and kicking in an outboard preamp/eq pedal when I want the metal tone?

    Or is there an onboard preamp in existence that suits this sort of purpose better than the Bart 3-band?
    Thanks!
     
  2. Nov 30, 2005 #2
    PilbaraBass

    PilbaraBass

    Jul 19, 2004
    Gladstone, QLD, Australia
    this one should be simple...you can go passive bass V/V/T with an outboard preamp (that's what I'd do)...

    but it would be quite simple to have a passive V/V/T with an onboard 3 band (what you were describing was very similar to an Aguilar OBP-3).

    Basically you feed the signal from the V/V/T to the OBP-3 and have the OBP-3 bypassible...simple really

    I use a gain-only preamp on my strap and use it to drive the cable from my passive V/V/T bass...I'm working on a new DI box, with a 3-band tone control, and this will still be fed from the gain-only preamp. both the pre and the DI box are homebuilt projects.
     
  3. Nov 30, 2005 #3
    i_got_a_mohawk

    i_got_a_mohawk

    Feb 9, 2005
    Edinburgh & Dundee, Scotland
    How about

    Volume/Volume (stacked)
    Tone
    Mid/Mid shift (stacked)

    that would make it seem less oppressing, with 3 dials and 1 switch instead of 4 and 2?
     
  4. Dec 1, 2005 #4
    bongomania

    bongomania Supporting Member Commercial User

    Oct 17, 2005
    PDX, OR
    owner, OVNIFX and OVNILabs
    >Bump<

    Anybody else?
     
  5. Dec 1, 2005 #5
    mahrous

    mahrous

    Aug 13, 2005
    Egypt
    i might not have understood your entire dilemma. but i believe Pilbara nailed most of it.

    many basses were made with that idea in mind. Active/Passive bass.
    i believe all active preamps can be equiped with an On/Off switch for a Passive Bypass option.
     
  6. Dec 1, 2005 #6
    Jazz Ad

    Jazz Ad Mi la ré sol

    Mar 16, 2002
    Langueux, Brittany, France
    I'd go with passive P/J and a parallel/series switch.
    It works for me at least.
     
  7. Dec 4, 2005 #7
    dadodetres

    dadodetres

    Dec 19, 2004
    URUGUAY
    why dont you keep the passive bass with the tone control, and use an EQ pedal for dialing the metal-y sound?
     
  8. Dec 4, 2005 #8
    bongomania

    bongomania Supporting Member Commercial User

    Oct 17, 2005
    PDX, OR
    owner, OVNIFX and OVNILabs
    So, what I ended up choosing was a modified Audere preamp with a tone selector switch, active/passive switch, passive treble rolloff knob, and no EQ. I'll use an outboard EQ if needed. Thanks guys!
     
  9. Dec 6, 2005 #9
    PilbaraBass

    PilbaraBass

    Jul 19, 2004
    Gladstone, QLD, Australia
    give us a review when you've put it all together. how does the tone selector switch work (what's its function)?
     
  10. Dec 6, 2005 #10
    Audere

    Audere Supporting Member Commercial User

    Apr 7, 2005
    South Beach, OR
    Owner: Audere Audio
    If I may answer this one...

    The switch, which we call a Z-Mode switch, changes the loading on the pickups which changes the fundamentals of your pickup's frequency response.
     
  11. Dec 6, 2005 #11
    bongomania

    bongomania Supporting Member Commercial User

    Oct 17, 2005
    PDX, OR
    owner, OVNIFX and OVNILabs
    That's the ticket! I only referred to it as a "tone selector" because that was easier than starting right off with a Z-mode explanation. Everyone, check it out: http://www.audereaudio.com/
    I am very excited to try this system out, and I will certainly post a review at that time. Unfortunately, Matt only just got started building my bass (custom job from the ground up) so it will be a few months before I get my hands on it.
     
  12. Dec 8, 2005 #12
    Tim__x

    Tim__x

    Aug 13, 2002
    Alberta, Canada
    :meh: I don't mean to be rude, but why are you trying to patent that? It appears to be a switchable RC network and a switchable resistance in parallel with the pickup. I don't see anything new.
     
  13. Dec 8, 2005 #13
    Audere

    Audere Supporting Member Commercial User

    Apr 7, 2005
    South Beach, OR
    Owner: Audere Audio
    No offense taken.

    I believe you would be correct - what you described could fall under prior art...

    As you probably know - it is standard professional practice to not disclose what is and is not patentable about a circuit until the patent, or more likely patent application, is published by the patent office.
     
  14. Dec 8, 2005 #14
    Tim__x

    Tim__x

    Aug 13, 2002
    Alberta, Canada
    I understand.
    It sounds like a frustrating position to be in, you can't explain why it deserves patent protection if you want to keep all your IP rights unchallenged, but not explaining it makes it look like you've got nothing.

    Do have any guess as to when your application will be published? Though still skeptical I am quite curious..
     
  15. Dec 8, 2005 #15
    bongomania

    bongomania Supporting Member Commercial User

    Oct 17, 2005
    PDX, OR
    owner, OVNIFX and OVNILabs
    Of course there is the terrible dark shadow of the "Acmeswitch" thread looming over this product and discussion. I had read all 65+ pages of that thread before Matt told me about the Z-Mode preamp, and I was struck by the similarities...

    But, I thought about it and decided that the odds were pretty good that changes in the impedance relationship between pickups and preamp would in fact change the tone. And I liked the idea of changing the tonal qualities of the pickups rather than simply boosting or cutting 3 EQ bands. And, I thought it would be an interesting gamble!
     
  16. Dec 8, 2005 #16
    Tim__x

    Tim__x

    Aug 13, 2002
    Alberta, Canada
    The difference between this and the Acme/Accuswitch, is that the Ac**switch promised something new that happened to be impossible, this Z-Mode thing promises something old that is very possible (every bass with a passive tone control does it).

    I don't doubt that Audere's product works, I merely doubt it's originality.
     
  17. Dec 8, 2005 #17
    Audere

    Audere Supporting Member Commercial User

    Apr 7, 2005
    South Beach, OR
    Owner: Audere Audio
    The US patent office will decide if I have a reasonable set of claims at some point. They are not exactly speedy at times.

    bongomania - Not to worry, you'll like it.

    Tim__x - If you REALLY want to ??? Maybe you will find reading a couple of my past patents interesting to see if they are original :eyebrow: .
    The IP in these patents is the property of Tektronix. http://patft.uspto.gov/netahtml/srchnum.htm
    5,412,579 Slow Display Method for Digital Oscilloscope with Fast Acquisition System
    5,053,757 Touch Panel with Adaptive Noise Reduction