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Discussion in 'Off Topic [BG]' started by Bob Clayton, May 10, 2003.

  1. Bob Clayton

    Bob Clayton Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Aug 14, 2001
    Philly Suburbs
    ok, i have a term paper due, no big deal, im almost done...the book is 1984 by George Orwell...

    and the last subtopic i have to write about is
    "At the end, explain why the last line is totally believable"

    now the problem.....there is the end of the story...but there is also and "Afterword" where Erich Fromm talks about the book...

    do you think that i have to write about the last line of the story? or the afterword?"

    please everyone answer....this is really important...

  2. The story. The afterword might be different depending on the edition of the book.

    Look at the last line of the story and see if it's something that a question would be asked about.
  3. FretNoMore

    FretNoMore * Cooking with GAS *

    Jan 25, 2002
    The frozen north
    It makes most sense to me that they mean the last line of the actual story. If you can't ask someone, you could always put a note in your paper that says you interpret the question to mean the last line of the story, not the afterword, and then go ahead to analyse that last line. At least that way you'd get some bonus point for trying even if the interpretation of the task proves false.
  4. Bob Clayton

    Bob Clayton Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Aug 14, 2001
    Philly Suburbs
    i never thought that the afterword might be different...

    looking at the last line it is something that could be asked about....

    so i think ill go with that

    thanks yottskry & Anders Östberg

  5. What's the last line of the book again?
  6. "....And they all lived happily ever after...."
  7. lol :spit: :p
  8. Bob Clayton

    Bob Clayton Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Aug 14, 2001
    Philly Suburbs
    "He loved Big Brother"

  9. Oh right! How could I forget that? :meh:

    I remember reading that and feeling more creeped out that I've ever felt.
  10. rllefebv


    Oct 17, 2000
    Newberg, Oregon
    "He loved Big Brother"... typical reaction of the tortured for the torturer... Kind of an off shoot of the Stockholm Syndrome where the hostages begin to identify and sympathize with the hostage takers. When someone holds the power of life or death over another, (or pain and the cessation of pain), that person takes on God-like attributes. Allowing the hostage to continue living is seen as a favor... To subject Winston to his greatest fear and then allow him to escape having his face eaten by rats by denouncing his love for Julia casts Big Brother in the Savior's role...

    Strictly my interpretation. Let the flaming begin...

  11. Bob Clayton

    Bob Clayton Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Aug 14, 2001
    Philly Suburbs
    rob that is a great interpretation, do you care if i use some of that for my paper?

  12. 1984 is an amazing book. On the last line, I agree with what Rob said, he loves Big Brother because he has in effect nothing else. Winston and Julia have grown apart, and it is such melancholy at the end for him to 'love' Big Brother, instead of Julia.

    I don't really agree with the 'typical reaction of the tortured to the torturer,' surely it is completely the opposite reaction of the tortured to the torturer? Yet with Winston coming to this somewhat strange conclusion, Big Brother's society is almost seemingly condoned by Orwell's persona, leaving the reader in a confused sense at the end of the book, or creeped out as Gunnar Por said.

    Just my opinion bp13 and Rob, dont wanna get into an argument or anything ;)
  13. No, this is actually a known syndrome. Hostages have been known to defend their capturers and display affection for them. I don't know the details, but like robert said it has to do with the feeling that you owe everything to this person because they "saved" you.

    While I agree that Winston's feelings could be a manifestation of the Stockholm syndrome I always felt that after the torture he'd been brainwashed and now feels nothing but love for Big Brother. I can't really explain it, it's just a feeling that the book left me with.

    I don't remember the exact ending so Orwell might have said this plainly in the end, but I felt that Winston was thinking those words walking down a hallway as a goverment agent was about to shoot him in the head and the last feeling he had was of profound love for Big Brother.
  14. rllefebv


    Oct 17, 2000
    Newberg, Oregon
    bass87... absolutely no offense taken! That's what discussion is all about!!

    Like Gunnar says... Stockholm Syndrome is well documented with hostage situations, and there are numerous cases of torture victims coming to, if not love their torturer, then at least have a case of pseudo-worship... Sick, but so is torture.

    A well known technique is for the torturer to express regret at having to inflict pain, in essence putting the burden on the victim for causing the pain to continue. Many times, this will begin to break the will of the victim to the point where the physical pain is secondary to the thought of disappointing the torturer... many child-abuse victims reside here...

    Both Gunnar and bass87 have awesome interpretations... mine is just a little different... Been about a half dozen years since I read this, so it's probably due for a re-reading! Do you ever find that?? Books that you didn't really dig when you had to read them are really good when you read them because you want to?? I just helped my daughter with 'The Grapes of Wrath' and it was way better than I remember!

    Bassplayer13... I think you should take whatever you can from anyone who posts in this thread... It's all research, right?? :)

  15. Yeah, take it all bp. :)

    I know what you mean robert, I just finished reading Njals Saga, an Icelandic saga from when the country was colonized, and it's much better now that I'm reading it for fun than when I read it for school.
  16. I agree with what you're saying, I'd just never heard of Stockholm syndrome before! ;)

    I've found also when I have to read books for school I find them less enjoyable. I've had to read Lord of the Flies for GCSE, and didn't enjoy it the first time. But having come back to it recently, I've found it's an amazing book! And I didn't have to read 1984 for school, so I think that's maybe why I enjoyed it so much.
  17. Im a sock

    Im a sock

    Dec 23, 2002
    Central MA
    that book is absolutly amazing. It's fun to read 1984 and then huxley's Brave New World. The huge amount of paralells is crazy.

    Highly recommended by Im a Sock.