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Rabbath

Discussion in 'Jazz Technique [DB]' started by Rob Sleeper, Mar 27, 2006.


  1. Rob Sleeper

    Rob Sleeper

    Oct 13, 2005
    Chicago
    Hi everyone,

    When your playing using Francois Rabbath's technique, do need to have the bent endpin or does it just make things easier having it?

    Thanks,
    Rob
     
  2. BGreaney

    BGreaney Guest

    Mar 7, 2005
    having the bent endpin doesn't just make Rabbath's method easier...it does make it more comfortable to stand with a bent endpin in general. However, it's definitely not something that works for everybody...
     
  3. Rob Sleeper

    Rob Sleeper

    Oct 13, 2005
    Chicago
    Thanks
    With Rabbath's technique does it feel like your sitting when you play? Is there any pressure you use with your thumb? The reason being is when I first saw rabbath in a pic on google I was fooled becuase I thought that he was using a stool. Other than that I think his technique is awesome for solo work.

    Rob
     
  4. Rob Sleeper

    Rob Sleeper

    Oct 13, 2005
    Chicago
    Quick question- Do you guys think his techniqe is practical for orchestral work? (symphonies, chamber ensembles)
     
  5. prelims222

    prelims222

    Sep 20, 2004
    Southeast US
    I tried Ben Joella's bass a few months ago - he has an eggpin - I nearly dropped it. It definitely shifts the weight of the instrument and does relieve a lot of the need to 'control' the bass into position. I don't know if its necessary or not to really get the gist of Rabbath's technique. What seems more important is holding the bass in a manner that gives you more equalized access to all the strings with both arms.

    I see no reason his technique wouldn't be practical for orchestral playing.
     
  6. danthebassman

    danthebassman

    May 11, 2005
    I recently got the bent endpin installed on my bass and I can honestly say it WILL improve your technique and sound. My teacher installed the endpin at the same time I did and there is already a very noticable improvement in his sound and ease of movement(he was already an unbelievable player).The endpin helps since your bow is postioned directly above the strings allowing gravity to do all the work. As for orchestra playing, it has been very helpful but creates a small problem when you need to share a stand or play in a cramped space since the bass takes up quite a bit more room.
     
  7. jgbass

    jgbass Guest

    Dec 17, 2003
    I have had the bent endpin since last October. Its for me.

    I started a thread entitled: So, who is studying Rabbath, about 10 days ago, and if you do a search you will find info you requested on that thread.
     
  8. mcnaire2004

    mcnaire2004

    Jan 17, 2006
    everywhere
    Mabe instead of installing a bent endpin maybe make a piece to put at the endpin that is already bent?
     
  9. JoeyNaeger

    JoeyNaeger Guest Commercial User

    Jun 24, 2005
    Houston, TX
    Bass Specialist, Lisle Violin Shop
    This may be of interest to some of you who want to try the laborie end pin. My bass teacher and I were able to fashion a couple of psuedo bent endpins by bending some 10 mm stainles steal round bar with a map gas torch. Then we cut threads on the end to screw one of those rubber things that come on the goetz endpins. Here's a picture.
    DSCN0255.

    I wouldn't recomend this a permanent fix, but it served me well untill I could get my bass to Robertson's. If you have a particularly heavy bass, this may also not be a good idea for you.
     
  10. BGreaney

    BGreaney Guest

    Mar 7, 2005
    I think if you go about doing things Rabbath's way, it's no different from doing it any other method you might apply to your playing. I mean, whether you hold the bow with your foot or with your hand, the bottom line is that you need to play the notes. Personally, I'm not a fan of standing for a 2 hour concert, but that's just me.
     
  11. Only if you can get it in tune. While Rabbath's left hand technique is very efficient, it tends to create shifting and intonation problems, perhaps because it is less experimented with than it should be. How can I endorse a technique as "practical for orchestral work" when even the innovator and inventor of the technique cannot fully pull it off? Listen to Rabbath's playing. His intonation, for lack of a better word, is terrible. I'm not trying to impose any disrespect towards him (in fact, I admire his willingness to experiment and invent), however I do think that he is wrong in exchanging technical efficiency for intonation.

    In other words, try it out and if you can't get it perfectly in tune, then it isn't suitable or practical for orchestral work.
     
  12. mje

    mje

    Aug 1, 2002
    Southeast Michigan
    I'm a little concerned that your endplin design puts too much stress on the socket in a direction it's not designed to take. Maybe the resident luthiers could comment.
     
  13. JoeyNaeger

    JoeyNaeger Guest Commercial User

    Jun 24, 2005
    Houston, TX
    Bass Specialist, Lisle Violin Shop
    Like I said, I wouldn't use it as a permanent fix but it worked ok for experimenting. As for Rabbath's technique being ok for orchestra work...Me and basically every bass player in the Houston area seems to use the George Vance and Rabbath books. I wouldn't say the Rabbath fingering system has hampered my ability to play orchestral music at all. I will say that Rabbath's right hand technique, while fantastic, isn't terribly useful for playing orchestral literature. As always, YMMV.
     
  14. prelims222

    prelims222

    Sep 20, 2004
    Southeast US
    Actually - I'd say his RH technique is a good start for learning to use a bow and w/ orchestral playing. It's very simple and he explains some CLUTCH information right away (esp. about the role of the fingers 'following' the movements of the arm, not creating their own little movements). Rabbath's concern obviously isn't with the orchestral sound and thats fine - its at least concerned with making a good and consistent sound. It wouldn't be too hard to get to an orchestral sound from that point.

    That said - the problem with anyone's technique is that the learners must always keep in mind that the technique they use will be slightly different. Rabbath has HUGE hands. For him to have the bow balanced in his hand the way he does, his index finger comes out quite far. For most people that distance is a long stretch and wouldn't feel so great but for him its probably comfortable.
     
  15. JoeyNaeger

    JoeyNaeger Guest Commercial User

    Jun 24, 2005
    Houston, TX
    Bass Specialist, Lisle Violin Shop
    You're quite right, I should have been more specific. I was mainly pointing out that playing the way Rabbath does and getting his sound wouldn't be best for heavier orchestral literature. Several aspects of his technique can and have been adapted to accomodate heavier playing.
     

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