Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Tash, Mar 11, 2005.

  1. Tash


    Feb 13, 2005
    Bel Air Maryland
    Getting ready to pull the trigger. What does everyone think of this rig?:

    GK 1001RB II - $600 (quote from Riks as of last week, shipping free)
    Avatar 210 and 115 Neo, both 8ohms - $556 total shipped.

    total cost: $1156, only $156 over my initial budget.

    Reasoning: I had the chance to test drive a 1001RB II this past weekend. I really dug the clarity of the tone. My preference tends strongly towards what most would term "sterile" or "dead". As I've stated before: "go hit the low B on a piano as hard as you can...I want to sound as close to this as possible. The 1001RB got pretty close driving an Ampeg 810 cab. The cab is out of the question though for cost and portability reasons.

    I looked at the GK cab offerings and like the RBH line a lot, but their power handling isn't enough to take the full 700 watts without going with a 410 and a 115. I really wanted to stick with a 210 and 115 sized cab combo, but that would mean scaling down to the 700RB II

    I want the extra power of the 1001RB (headroom, must have headroom!) but can't afford the cost or extra size of a GK 410 and 115 rig.

    However the Avatar cabs are speced to 900 watts and are cheaper. I'll miss out on the front panel biamping for the horn, but since I mainly play in the same rooms once I find the right level for the horn on the Avatars I should know right where to leave it, and since I never play with distortion of any kind I'm not worried about overdriving them trying to get grit in my low end (the main reason for biamping).

    When I have more money I'll consider getting a full GK cab setup for gigs, leaving the avatars at my drummer's house and just carting the head in between. But for now I think this seems like a great solution.

    Are there any flaws in my logic that pop out to anyone?
  2. The 1001RB-II with the 210RBH and 115RBH is a good match. Another GK option is the 1001 with a Neo 212 You could later on add another 212 or a 112 or the 115. I use the 112 with the 115. The Neo will give you the kind of clarity you want too.
  3. bigbeefdog

    bigbeefdog Who let the dogs in?

    Jul 7, 2003
    Mandeville, LA
    Nope. None. That sounds like a killer rig, and it'd be hard to do better buying new (edit - price-wise, that is).

    The only comment I'd toss out is that you could, if you wanted to, pick up a pre/power setup instead of the GK for similar money.... but if you've tried the GK and like the tone, you're ahead of the game there....
  4. It's always good to go over budget ;)
  5. Selta


    Feb 6, 2002
    Pacific Northwet
    Total fanboi of: Fractal Audio, AudiKinesis Cabs, Dingwall basses
    It's actually ideal to have more wattage available than the cabs are rated for. Headroom is your friend. This also goes from the logic that you wont be putting out the full wattage from the amp constantly, so your speakers aren't seeing the wattage at the ohm, cos it depends on your settings, A LOT.

  6. Tash


    Feb 13, 2005
    Bel Air Maryland
    Hmmm something to consider. I'd always thought and operated under the assumption that you wanted headroom at the CAB end of the chain, because you don't want max power from your head to fry your cabs.

    Double checking it actually looks like I had confused the SBX and RBH series power ratings. Its the SBX cabs that aren't spec'd for the full output of the 1001RB-II (at least using a 210 and 115).

    Looking at the price of the RBH and Neo cabs again I think I'll stick with the Avatars. When I have more money and decide I need a second set of cabs I'll revist the GK line. I'm putting more than I planned into the rig already, mainly because I liked what heard from the head so much.

    Thanks for the input though Daniel.
  7. Richard Lindsey

    Richard Lindsey

    Mar 25, 2000
    Metro NYC
    Ideally you probably want headroom everywhere (unless you want distortion)--that is, you want more than enough amp to do any job you need to do, and you want cabs that can easily handle any amount of power you're likely to throw at them (which may not be the full rated power of the amp).

    Having amps rated for more watts than the cab can handle does *not* give you headroom. It has nothing to do with it. You get headroom by having an amp bigger than necessary to do the jobs that need doing; cab power handling is relatively immaterial (as long as it's enough). If you're going to a quiet gig in a 12 seat coffeehouse, and you bring an 800 W amp, you'll have plenty of headroom, because that's way more amp than the job needs--but you will have *exactly* the same amount of headroom with a 1200 W cab of efficiency X as you would with an otherwise identical 500 W cab of efficiency X. You do not get one iota more headroom with the lower rated cab, because cab power handling has no direct relation to headroom. If anything you'd get less headroom, because if you had to turn up much for whatever reason, there could conceivably be a situation in which you start distressing the lower rated cab at levels that wouldn't bother the higher rated cab.

    All that said, you very often *can* use amps that put out more than the rated power of the cab, but in this case, the benefit has nothing to do with the lesser power handling of the cab and everything to do with having more power than you need for the job at hand. This is often a practical strategy, because these days watts are cheap.

    ADDENDUM: Oh yeah, w/ regard to the initial post (sorry for the digression), for my tastes (and YMMV), the new-ish Carvin B1500 is a more happening amp than the GK, with more power (700 W at 8 ohms, 1250 at 4, and 1900 at 2) and a nicer tone. I own one and like it. Carvin sells them in packages with their new BRX series of 2-12 and 4-10 cabs (not the Redline speakers), which I haven't heard but would guess from word of mouth to be at the least comparable with Avatar and conceivably better.
  8. Tash


    Feb 13, 2005
    Bel Air Maryland
    However I'd be back to needing a two full size cabs to handle that much power, the 212 cabinet alone can't do it. That puts me well above what I want to pay, as well as being more difficult to move (I can fit a single full size cab in my car with ease and have enough room for my bass and a 210 sized cab in the back with my head riding shotgun. More than this and I'd need a different vehicle).
  9. Special_Ed


    Oct 3, 2004
    I don't like your set up (otherwise I would have bought the items you listed)

    You should get a Bag End 410 cab used for 450 and a yorkville 800 watt head new for 650.
  10. Tash


    Feb 13, 2005
    Bel Air Maryland
    Care to elaborate as to why those items would work better?
  11. Looks like a nice rig.You might want to look at just the Avatar 410 neo by itself too.It only weighs 15lbs.more than the neo 15 and is the same size.The 410 goes very deep and will match the overall volume of the 210+15.I've been gigging my 410 neo for a few months and itdoes eveything I want it to do and is plenty loud.The cabs you picked would be pretty cool too.
  12. Jack


    Sep 6, 2003
    Newcastle, UK
    Yup, I would try the 410 as well. But saying that, I can almost be sure that I would like the 210+115 better. :)