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Reiner Amplification Megathread

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by kd5uwl, Sep 7, 2014.


  1. kd5uwl

    kd5uwl

    Jun 7, 2012
    I'm interested in hearing more thoughts from TB-ers concerning JGR's forthcoming Wrecking Ball amp.

    For me, I'd like to hear more from those that have played it that this thing can outdo an SVT.

    Also interested in any and all other discussion concerning the amp.
     
    JGR and bassasaurus like this.
  2. eyeballkid

    eyeballkid Supporting Member

    Jul 19, 2009
    Haven't played it, but Im one of the lucky ones with an original jgr preamp. Gotta say, I've never been the least bit interested in class d designs until I saw Jonathan was working on one. And DAMN! That's enticing.

    My big questions would be more about the interaction with the power module than about the finer points of the preamp as I know from experience that Jonathan really works to nail a good, thick, lively, and responsive front end, and even once he does he keeps working to refine it further.
    I know the signal from his pre's is quite strong to really drive a power amp and im wondering how class d designs respond to that. Does it respond with the same hammer low end that a normal solid state would give or does it have limitations that alter the final sound at higher peaks and volume? I'm guessing after my experience in Jonathan's lab that it's been brutally tested to his extreme (and I mean extreme) paces and passes muster, but I gotta wonder as I dont know enough about class d to hazard a real guess.
     
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2014
  3. JimmyM

    JimmyM Supporting Member

    Apr 11, 2005
    Apopka, FL
    Endorsing: Ampeg Amps, EMG Pickups
    Gustav is quite talented, and as far as volume, I believe it could outdo an SVT. Tonally, though, that's in the ear of the beholder, and I've yet to hear anything that gets me as excited as the tone of an SVT going through an 810 cab.
     
  4. BassyBill

    BassyBill The smooth moderator... Gold Supporting Member

    Mar 12, 2005
    West Midlands UK
    Yes, from what I understand, this amp will be commercially available. It sounds like a product that will appeal to a lot of players to check out and I'm sure it will generate a lot of discussion. I shall be very interested to read more - thanks for starting this new thread.
     
    Sharknose79 and BurningSkies like this.
  5. JGR

    JGR The "G" is for Gustav Supporting Member Commercial User

    Jun 29, 2006
    Maryland
    President, CEO, CFO, CIO, Chief Engineer, Technician, Janitor - Reiner Amplification
    I think it's the "feel" component of a tube poweramp that is what is so appealing - with the lower damping of most tube power sections (compared to SS), you get a nice bass bump around the resonant frequency of the speaker in the box - a SS amp will lack bass in comparison which is why you may want to bump somewhere in the 75 to 80 Hz range to bring back that feel with a typical SS amp. In a tube power amp, the amplifier and speaker are very interactive, and the resonant peaks of the speaker are not critically damped like SS, and as such get amplified. This gives the pleasing qualities to the low and high end that we often associate with tube power. That's why a tube amp plus high-efficiency, low Xmax speakers works so well - the damping component helps compensate for the low end, and the higher efficiency gives you the desired output - like chocolate and peanut butter. It's also why the sealed box works so well with tube amps and is often preferred.

    To exploit the best of both worlds, I've been planning on building an amp with a small but robust tube power section driving a proper reactive load and then tapping a signal from that and re-amplifying with SS. That captures the tube feel with SS volume capabilities. The ICE module opens up a lot of possibilities for a fairly compact, integrated unit. In the mean time, it just depends on where your tastes lie - I love tube, SS, and hybrid, so I'm not really skewed one way or another.
     
  6. speyer

    speyer Supporting Member

    I look forward to seeing the finished product and price point of this amp. So far, it sounds and looks really, really good. I haven't owned any of JGR's other products but I am equally interested all of them. I'll be lurking.
     
    Stevorebob likes this.
  7. JGR

    JGR The "G" is for Gustav Supporting Member Commercial User

    Jun 29, 2006
    Maryland
    President, CEO, CFO, CIO, Chief Engineer, Technician, Janitor - Reiner Amplification
    I think so - the module I'm using doesn't have the greatest input sensitivity, so it takes some juice to properly drive it, but it's not unlike the requirement for the output section of a good standalone preamp which should have sufficient output to drive a range of power amps. So I optimized the driver section a bit so that it interacts properly with the transformer coupled input of the power module, and it drives it in a very pleasing way - probably gives a similar "tubey" attribute as a very popular hybrid tube head/combo. It's key because if everything isn't done right, you can loose punch and top end clarity - things can sound a bit lifeless and "vailed" if the signal is getting excessively loaded. It's also important to get things matched up so that you aren't hitting max output with the master on "2" or "10" at nominal settings - I've played with gain and master tapers so that you can easily drive to full clip with low gain settings and conversely have a bit of wiggle room if you are running at higher gain levels. So if my gain is low, say around 9 o'clock, the master will be at maybe 1 o'clock for full output. If the gain is way up there, the master might be around 9-10 o'clock for full output. All depending on bass output and playing technique of course, but point being, I think the whole range is pretty well dialed in. It's also important to have the range to allow for flexibility when boosting the EQ since there is a lot of boost available - I can introduce clipping by cranking even the higher frequencies. The preamp has a lot of headroom, so it allows a lot of the peaks/dynamics come through, and they can be huge - having a power amp that can handle them is what contributes to the feel/weight of the presentation, and also ties back to the above when we are talking about integration of the whole package.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2014
    TomB and Sharknose79 like this.
  8. JGR

    JGR The "G" is for Gustav Supporting Member Commercial User

    Jun 29, 2006
    Maryland
    President, CEO, CFO, CIO, Chief Engineer, Technician, Janitor - Reiner Amplification
    Thanks Bill.
     
    BassyBill likes this.
  9. Chef

    Chef Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    May 23, 2004
    Columbia MO
    Staff Reviewer; Bass Gear Magazine
    sub'd
     
  10. Jeff Scott

    Jeff Scott Rickenbacker guru.......... Supporting Member

    Apr 11, 2006
    I am looking forward to seeing what the final product will be like. :cool:
     
  11. silky smoove

    silky smoove Supporting Member

    May 19, 2004
    Seattle, WA
    I followed the previous thread from the beginning, and will be doing so here as well. I'm beyond excited about this amp.
     
  12. kringle77

    kringle77 Supporting Member

    Jul 30, 2004
    Massena NY
    So, you're the janitor at Reiner amplification. I just want to say that Im sorry.
     
  13. will33

    will33

    May 22, 2006
    austin,tx

    If he's the janitor, imagine how good the engineer must be.
     
  14. JGR

    JGR The "G" is for Gustav Supporting Member Commercial User

    Jun 29, 2006
    Maryland
    President, CEO, CFO, CIO, Chief Engineer, Technician, Janitor - Reiner Amplification
    Hey, somebody's gotta clean the mess up at the end of the day, and that somebody is me.
     
    DirtyDuke, Sid Fang, Winoman and 3 others like this.
  15. dukeorock

    dukeorock Owner BNA Audio Supporting Member Commercial User

    Mar 8, 2011
    Nashville, TN
    Authorized greenboy designs builder/Owner of BNA Audio
    Sub'd

    LOVE my 6SL7 pre and am watching this thread with much interest!

    Jonathan, do you have any pictures of the latest updated pre? Or perhaps, a video?
     
  16. Ukiah Bass

    Ukiah Bass Supporting Member

    May 10, 2006
    I'm kind of missing why the other thread ended and this one began, but I'm all for video/audio demos!
     
  17. eyeballkid

    eyeballkid Supporting Member

    Jul 19, 2009
    < waiting for the day my disclosures reads "Reiner Amplification Field Tester"
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2014
  18. Jared Lash

    Jared Lash Born under punches

    Aug 21, 2006
    Denver, CO
    Sub'd.

    I haven't even thought about buying another amp in months but I can't help checking out these threads. Such amazing stuff JGR.
     
    shaginwagin likes this.
  19. This amp is impressive. The video clips sound great. I like the transformer coupled power module concept. As a tube amp lover, that makes a hybrid amp a lot more appealing to me! It's great to see someone designing gear for a gritty rock tone with modern clarity and definition. Inspiring work JGR!
     
    BrBss and Jared Lash like this.
  20. silky smoove

    silky smoove Supporting Member

    May 19, 2004
    Seattle, WA
    Is the amp officially being called the Wrecking Ball? If so, I feel obligated to post a video of the song Wrecking Ball. I could post Myley Cyrus' version of it, but... Ron Jeremy's is better:
     
    dukeorock likes this.
  21. dukeorock

    dukeorock Owner BNA Audio Supporting Member Commercial User

    Mar 8, 2011
    Nashville, TN
    Authorized greenboy designs builder/Owner of BNA Audio
    I'll go ahead and point out that though I do have some endorsement deals, I paid full price for my Reiner Pre. Not an endorser if anything Jonathan makes. Just a big ol' fan :)
     

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