Rig not cutting through

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Peter McFerrin, Mar 2, 2003.

  1. My band, Bombard the Headquarters, played its first show tonight. Our lineup is organ, baritone sax, bass and drums. I brought out my gig rig: EBS Fafner head, two Aguilar GS112 cabinets. I used both of my FBB basses tonight.

    Even though I had the drive on 3, the gain on 6, and the master on 5, I could barely hear my rig over the drums--and I could barely hear any highs, even with the tweeters on normal (and the Fafner's a very bright amp).

    One possibility was that sound dispersion might have been harmed by setting up in a corner, but the GS112s just might not be cutting it in a loud jazz/funk/rock band. I know it wasn't the organ eating up my frequency space, because I could barely hear it on my side of the stage. Your thoughts?
  2. - mids bumped on the fafner?
    - aggies on ground or elevated? maybe angle towards ear next gig?
    - any feedback how you sounded past the stage - you may have been fine in the room.
  3. I was loud in the room but didn't have much crispness.

    Aggies were on the ground. I think I might want to keep one on the ground but invest in an amp stand for the other.

    I'll definitely need to bump the Fafner's mids. Normally with the neck pickup on my FBB soloed and the drive up at 3 or 4, it cuts through just fine, but the GS112s are a bit light in the low midrange.
  4. jokerjkny


    Jan 19, 2002
    NY / NJ / PA
    Hey Pete,

    i feel you with the bad onstage mix. i deal with it often.

    what was your EQ like? like alot of guys and myself, we get caught up in that's *my* sound, and its hard to deviate from changing it, especially in a live performance.

    when i have a problematic room, usually a nice big ol' bump in the low mids allows me to ride above a frequency chewing left hand of the keyboardist or and overly boomy bass drum, while a nice goose of the treble knob gives me def against the extra bass pumped out from whomever.

    but what really helps me is to cut out the lowest lows. sounds sacrilegious, but it works, and i find myself to be tighter sounding, rather than this boomie mess.

    to be honest, tho, when it comes to mixes or situations with a instrumentally dense packed low end, i usually reach for my cabs with 10's. 12's sometimes dont cut thru as nicely as i'd like. if i'm in a smaller, lower watt gig, then i'll break out my Bergie 1x12, which fills up the low end, but still gives me waaay more articulation than any 15" i've used.
  5. I was EQed dead flat with a touch of compression. Methinks some more low mids might help.

    Honestly, though, if I continue to have trouble, I may just sell one GS112 and go back to using a 4x10. My back is quivering in horror as I type that...
  6. Or paired 2x10s, yeah.
  7. jasonbraatz


    Oct 18, 2000
    Oakland, CA
    add some bridge pickup?
  8. jokerjkny


    Jan 19, 2002
    NY / NJ / PA

    i think you just need some creative EQ'ing that's all. no need to go back to that monster, tho it'd prolly rock.

    a bud recommended me to his gf's drum/bass gig with just me, an acoustic drummer, vocalist, and the programmer/DJ/bandleader, and at first, i was all, "holy crap, what the hell am i doing here?"

    but DJ'man wanted the organic feel for the groove, so i stuck it out with my old Demeter/GS112, and merely did the low middy bump with nice dallop of highs, and it turned out to be a pretty cool gig.
  9. Possible, but this thing sounds like a Stingray on PCP with the neck PU soloed.

    I'm gonna try some creative EQ--maybe a bump at 400Hz or so, some more grit, a bit of compression, and a little Brightness dialed in.
  10. ldiezman


    Jul 11, 2001
    and you have a problem with this why???

    Have you asked how it sounded from people in the crowd? Maybe you were hearing slightly muddy bass but the audience was hearing it crisply..
  11. Audience was hearing it a bit muddy, too. I was barely hearing anything.
  12. - another not very elegant suggestion before you buy an amp stand - stack your aggies on a milkcrate and see what that does for ya
  13. rok51


    Sep 2, 2002
    Crawfordville, FL
    In a roundabout way, thanks for the post...it has given me pause as I was considering a pair of GS112s or the new Avatar compact cabs in a bid to lighten my load. Let us know if bumping the mids takes care of problem cutting through.

  14. secretdonkey


    Oct 9, 2002
    Austin, TX
    I bet those cabs sound great but I know I wouldn't dream of trying to get by with just 2 12s for a gig like that. Yes, you're talking to a guy who brought out two 4x10 cabs to play a small room Friday night... but on the other hand I'm also the guy who heard himself so well he kept asking incredulously if he was too loud (everyone insisted I wasn't), and the guy who got a boatload of compliments on his sound that night.

    Sorry, but I have to vote for the 4x10 (It can be any brand you want, if that's any consolation). :( ;)
  15. Andrew Jones

    Andrew Jones Banned

    Feb 28, 2001
    Northampton Mass
    Any time I set up for a gig with no PA for me Ill set up my tone. With 2 berg 112's im allways cuting mid some (these cabs have very defining mid). then I walk out as far as my cord will allow and check bass.

    Then when the band starts if Ihave a hard time hearing my self( after ive turned up enough to start to feel guilty) I start putting back in those mids untill I'm back!

  16. Mike Dimin

    Mike Dimin

    Dec 11, 1999
    Clinician: EA, Zon, Boomerang, TI. Author "The Art of Solo Bass"
    It might not be the 12's but it very well might be the Aguilar GS112's. The aguilar sound is very round and bottomy without a lot of midrange punch. The Aguilar GS112 just don't do it for me.

  17. Yeah, I'm beginning to think that. I should have known better--the time I heard the GS112s, and fell in love with them, was when they were being powered by an DB359, which is a fat, mid-rich head.

    I'm not sure what my next step will be. I'll try the EQing.
  18. P. Aaron

    P. Aaron Supporting Member

    Look at all that one can learn in one session about: a hall, the stage set-up, amp placement, instrument, and amp characteristics, and the incredible value of getting a sound check.

    The only offering I have is that, if the rig is on the floor of a stage, that's worth low end, or Bass Boost. Whether you want it or not. Put it on a stand, it gets thinner (whether that's good or not). If your setting up on a concrete floor of a dance hall, or basement, it's all amp for the low end.

    I always bring a long cord, and during soundcheck, walk out away from the stage and get an idea of what it all sounds like. Not just my tone mind you, but the whole mix.

    If the band sounds great overall, I don't give a rats' behind what I sound like.
  19. Definitely, PAaron. Our soundcheck was mighty weak--the crowd was getting antsy.

    I should have asked for more bass and keys in my monitor.