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Discussion in 'Basses [BG]' started by nonsqtr, Mar 26, 2004.
Has anyone compared this with the Bart 3-way preamp? What are your thoughts?
I think that you've already read my opinions on this but to repeat myself I don't like the obp-3 at all. It's noisy and it adds too much high end to the original signal. I greatly prefer the Demeter 3 band that Roscoe now offers.
I've got the Aggie in my ash bodied/green quilt maple topped LG-3005 that has an ebony fingerboard. I've got the Bart in my ash body/myrtle top with purpleheart fingerboard LG-3005. The one with the bart weems to be an all around better bass. Just offers more and different useable tones. In my case the aggie is darker and muddier on the low end. I don't mind, as that goes with the metal band I play that bass with. It almost has a compressed tone which is probably due to the ebony as well. I would NOT order another bass with the aggie preamp.. I like it in that bass, and for the puropse of that bass, it's great. But for all around tone, and use.. I'd pick the bart every time!!! I often wonder what the bart would sound like in place of the aggie... but I never wonder what the aggie would sound like in place of the bart. Unlike emjazz, I don't find the aggie as too much high end, or noisy. They are both super quiet. But with the difference in woods, comes some difference in tone. And.. now we have to add the Demeter into the debate (thanks emjazz) ... maybe I'll throw that in, in place of the aggie, and see what happens.
I'm not ussually a Bart fan, but I love the setup Keith uses in the Roscoe's. Not sure of the exact preamp and which pickups, but its killer.
I'm with emjazz on the Agi pre, just not my thing!
I've played a number of Demeter's with Bart's and never have really cared for that setup either. I have a Benavente now that just came in with Barts and Demeter and I'm looking for a Bart preamp to go in it in place of the Demeter. To me I'm not happy with the two together. Maybe its the type of Bart pickups these are. I was just going to turn it into all Bart stuff!
Emjazz, which pickups do you have in the Roscoe?
I'm with Brian on this one. I'm not normally a huge fan of a Bart set-up, but it just seems to work so well in Roscoes. I would probably never consider owning a bass with a complete Bart electronics package for myself (based on the type of tone that I like, personally), but would definately do so in a Roscoe. For comparison, I have a couple of Roscoes on the way that will have the Demeter pres in them, but haven't opted for the Aggie preamp as of yet. Based on my conversations with Keith, if you're looking for that super-phat, P-bass on steroids tone, then the Bart system would be great. However, if you're more of a "modern" style player who likes a cleaner, snappier, tone for slapping, etc., then the Demeter seems to be doing a great job. I apparently allows more of the natural voice of the wood to speak through and doesn't color the tone nearly as much as the Bart system does. I'll be able to provide some first-hand experience soon.
On a slight sidenote, the Barts in Roscoes come wired in series (as with most basses I think). Has anyone tried changing them to parallel or adding a switch for the pickups? I was thinking of a 3-way switch for series, parallel and single coil with the 2 outermost coils.
There has been pretty good discussion regarding different Roscoe preamps, but I haven't seen too much regarding pickups (JB touched on it briefly in the 'modify your Roscoe thread'). I have the wiring schematic for the different coil tap options, and I was getting ready to fire up the soldering iron....
I did that back some time ago in the Benavente I'm thinking about pulling the demeter out of.
Parrelel gives you a fatter sound and more bottom where series gives you a little more output and more midrange.
Any one have a couple of Bart preamps around??
Can anyone explain how to change the wiring from series to parallel? Thanks.
I'll chime in and say I prefer the Bart to the Aggie as well, not only in the Roscoes , but all around-
i recently acquired a Zon fretless with a Bart system and it sounds phenomenal, i keep wondering what the fretteds sound like, i should know soon enough, but the tone is clear and HUGE.. i played Biker Aggie'd Roscoe and while it was fine, i do prefer the Bart... to me , Barts sound so different in basses, I know they are built to certain specs, but the Barts on an MTD sound totally different than the Barts on say, an Elrick or a Zon...
Here is the link to the Bartolini support page: Bart Schematics
Click on the link under 'Passive Bass Wirings/Switching' called 'Dual coil pickups with 4 conductor cable'
I was just down stairs wiring up a series/parallel sw in the G&L bass that I just installed an OBP3 in earlier this week. Both my Roscoe fretted and fretless currently have the Bart 3-band installed. I tried the Demeter for a couple of weeks in the fretted and the longer I keep it in the more I missed the versatility and sound of the Bart. IMO the Bart has much more boost and cut in all bands than the Demeter. If you're going for a flat sound with some limited EQ, go with the Demeter. The bass is slightly more focused but it's very limited in the Mid-range and treble area's. I prefer the Bart.
As for the Aguilar OBP3, the unit I installed in the G&L is very quite. It sounds more similar to the Bart than the Demeter and I would suspect that it would sound nice in a Roscoe. However, based on the short period of time I've played around with the Aguilar, I still prefer the Bart. Mainly better control of the Mid range. It's hard to compare how the Aguilar sounds in the G&L (G&L P/U's) to how it would sound in the Roscoe (Bart's) but if you're worring about it being noisy, no need to fret. It's not noisy at all. I suspect that any noise problems players have incountered with the Aguilar are due to improper installation/poor shielding.
Hi everyone, thanks for the input! There seems to be a consensus here. I just got a Roscoe with the 2-way Aggie electronics. It's not bad, but I find myself missing the midrange control. I like the Bart preamp, but may go ahead and try the Demeter first. Also, thanks for that coil switching link, that's very helpful, I may try some of those tricks too. Ah, the never ending search for versatility and perfect tone!
I have the Barts that came with the bass.
That's exactly what I love about the Demeter in my bass. It doesn't color the sound of the bass as much as the Bartolini preamp. Putting in the Demeter was like unclogging the tone. It's true that the preamp doesn't cut or boost as much as the Bart but how much of that do you really need? As always it's just a personal preference.
Trust me, it wasn't the bass that I had the Aguilar in. Have you ever seen the shielding or wiring that Carey Nordstrand does? It's flawless. I've been told by builders that Aguilar's preamps are always a gamble. You can get some that are dead quiet and others in the same bunch that will be terribly loud. Sometimes you'll even get one that just doesn't work out of the box. If the one's that I heard were quiet I still wouldn't have liked them. Just not for me is all. I really like their 2 band however. I wish that Aguilar had just added a mid cut/boost to their 2 band pre. That would've been killin!
I will admit that my experience with Aguilar pre's are limited to the one installation but not much can go wrong inside the epoxied module. I still would suspect most problems would occur in the installation. I've installed dozens of preamps and any problems that I've had (except one; a bad Bart NBIBT and Bill replaced that module) have always been linked to components outside the content of the preamp.
The Demeter was an easy install but the prewired harness created a rats nest in the control cavity. Aparently the stranded wire used is also fairly brittle as I had 2 wires break loose from the PCB while trying to make my mind up as to whether to install the Mid micro sw. (I did move the harnessing around some while experimenting with the Mid sw but this can be expected expecially when the included documentation didn't even mention the Mid Sw). The PCB module is heat shrinked and determining where the broken wires needed to be resolded was somewhat difficult. I had to cut away the heatshrink to repair the pre. To complicate matters, Demeter will not supply a wiring diagram (claims one doesn't exist) and failed to return phone calls (they did reply on an email but the reply was vague and really didn't answer the intent of my questions.
The Tone is subjective and I'll admit that I've used the Bart pre's for about 16 years and have gotten real comfortable with their sound. I'll see where Roscoe's experiments with the Demeter go and if a Mid switch can be worked out with a Push-pull pot I may try one again later. I'll also always wonder if I changed the sound of the pre when I installed the concentric 50K pot for the Bass/Mid controls.
I just ordered the Demter 3-band pre for my Roscoe fretted bass. It will have stacked bass and treble controls (100K) and the midrange swicth. I asked them to put a push-pull switch in for the midrange switch, but they didn't want to special order the pot, so I'll probably add it myself. I don't want to drill any additional holes in the bass at this time. Getting this thing ordered was a frustrating experience. I don't know how anyone can stay in business so long when they are so disorganized. The upside is that they apologized and pushed my order through in one day and it shipped yesterday. I haven't even payed for it yet!
Yup, Demeter is definately a difficult company to deal with. Hopefully you'll enjoy the preamp in your bass as much as I do to warrant your frustration.