1. Please take 30 seconds to register your free account to remove most ads, post topics, make friends, earn reward points at our store, and more!  
    TalkBass.com has been uniting the low end since 1998.  Join us! :)

Sadowsky Metros: No Graphite Stiffening Rods and Thinner Headstocks?

Discussion in 'Basses [BG]' started by BigMikeW, Jun 3, 2005.

  1. BigMikeW

    BigMikeW Banned

    May 25, 2005
    Nashville, TN.
    Banned by TB Administration for refusal to account for funds
    ***After hearing from several people including Nino, a guy who talked to Kevin this weekend (Thanks Steve) and others I am not concerned about this at all anymore. I will say that I am probably still going to go with an NYC just for the weight. 9.25 - 9.5 is alright but 8 - 8.5 is a lot better. And, at 35 with a not so great back, I'd like to keep it as light as possible***

    I read on the Sadowsky website that a while back they increased the thickness of the NYC headstocks and stiffened the necks to provide for more sustain and to lessen deadspots.

    I know that graphite stiffening rods contribute greatly to both and help with the longevity of the neck.

    The Metro's, from my understanding, have thinner headstocks and no graphite stiffening rods. :( Why is this? This is making me lean more towards an NYC.

    Can anyone help me out on this? Just always looking for as much information as possible.
  2. Steve


    Aug 10, 2001
    I'm sure Mr. Sadowsky would be able to answer any questions you have relating to specific construction methods far more reliably than I but....

    The metro necks are built to the "Old" NYC spec. Thinner head stock, no graphite.

    Same neck as is on my NYC VJ5 that was made in '00.

    It's a nice neck...
  3. Fuzzbass

    Fuzzbass P5 with overdrive Supporting Member

    As above I don't want to answer for Mr. Sadowsky, but it seems likely to me that the main reason is to keep the Metro basses as affordable as they are.

    FWIW some players prefer the sound of basses that don't have stiffening bars in the neck. Yes, the likelihood of dead spots does increase, and longevity might decrease, but the counterpoint is that stiffening bars change the overall tone of the instrument: it allegedly becomes less resonant. So, the dead spots (etc) are accepted as "taking the bad with the good", "warts and all", or whatever cliché you want to use. :)

    I have no idea whether Metros sound different from Sadowsky NYC basses. Perhaps others can comment.
  4. BigMikeW

    BigMikeW Banned

    May 25, 2005
    Nashville, TN.
    Banned by TB Administration for refusal to account for funds
    I have never heard anything negative about graphite stiffening rods. Roger puts them in the NYC's. I am just wondering, other than saving money on production costswhich is fine, why they made the necks different then the NYC's.
  5. Fuzzbass

    Fuzzbass P5 with overdrive Supporting Member

    FYI, those who don't care for stiffening rods are those who prefer the sound of vintage Fenders, which only have the one truss rod. I don't doubt that stiffening bars add stability and tend to reduce dead spots, but I also don't doubt that they alter the tone of the neck. Roger Sadowsky is doing his own thing: he's not trying to imitate the vintage Fender sound. So, there's no reason for him not to use stiffening bars.

    Re your question: have you tried asking someone @Sadowsky?
  6. Nino Valenti

    Nino Valenti Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 2, 2001
    Staten Island NYC
    Builder: Valenti Basses
    Of my 4 NYC basses that I currently own, only one has graphite bars.

    The 3 that don't have graphite are as good as the graphite. I RARELY have to adjust any of the necks and they all sound.....

    .....well, they're Sadowsky's after all. :)
  7. Nino Valenti

    Nino Valenti Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 2, 2001
    Staten Island NYC
    Builder: Valenti Basses

    He usually answers emails 7 days a week.
  8. JimS

    JimS Supporting Member

    If it negatively affected the instrument, Roger would not use.
    Of this I am confident.
  9. Fuzzbass

    Fuzzbass P5 with overdrive Supporting Member

    I agree 100%. I should've been more careful not to put 'em in a negative light. IMO it's not a matter of better or worse... just different.
  10. hands5


    Jan 15, 2003
    good 'ol USA/Tampa fla.
    Maybe because this would make the Metro the same price as the NYC basses,whith these options ? All I can say that my Metro sounds and feels fine with out these mods. :)
  11. mgmadian


    Feb 4, 2002
    Austin, TX
    +1... like most established + reputable luthiers, I'd bet that Sadowsky Guitars would only add an option/feature if they felt it improved (or at least did not negatively affect) the sound/playability/overall quality of the instrument.

    MAJOR METAL HARVESTER OF SORROW Staff Member Supporting Member

    Roger makes a rock solid/sounding instrument.
  13. BigMikeW

    BigMikeW Banned

    May 25, 2005
    Nashville, TN.
    Banned by TB Administration for refusal to account for funds
    self bump - but for Roger's Reputation and My Clarification
  14. maurilio

    maurilio Musician - Owner Mo's Shop & MBD - Tech Nordstrand Supporting Member

    May 25, 2003
    Redlands, CA
    Endorsing artist: Nordstrand - Genzler Amplification - Sadowsky - Dunlops Strings - DR Strings
    this is interesting!
    I've read, somewhere, Roger was saying that he tried several options with and without (graph. rods) and he found no difference.... interesting!
    Probably, with the fact woods are going down in quality (!!!!!), he had to adapt to them!?!?
    Having got the opportunity to try/compare a NYC V4 (with graph. r. and th. heads.) and a Modern 24 "regular", and my own MS5....I couldn't tell any difference at all..... thay all sound great!

  15. gflowers

    gflowers Sadowsky Nut Supporting Member

    Nov 6, 2002
    Raleigh, NC
    From speaking with the folks at Sadowsky, I understand that the Metros are essentially the same instrument as the earlier NYC basses. My 97 NYC vintage 4 has the thinner, non-graphite reinforced neck and it has the regular alder body. My 03' NYC has the new thicker headstock, graphite bars and has the chambered alder body. They both sound great. That being said, if the Metros are essentially the same as my 97 NYC (which is still my favorite), I would have no concerns that the Metros can't compare to the NYC's.