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Sadowsky UV70 vs. Atelier Z (Ash/Maple 70's syle Jazz)

Discussion in 'Basses [BG]' started by Modern Growl, Nov 28, 2006.


  1. I've had some recent threads that were similar to this, but not a straight duke out so here it goes. Which one would you go with?

    I would configure the Sadowsky to have the same features as the Atelier Z, i.e. passive tone roll off, true single coils.

    I've read that some say the Atelier Z is a bit more "aggressive". Could anyone expound?
    I believe the heavier body of the Atelier will give a tighter, more classic 70's tone, but is it going to be too compressed sounding vs. the Sadowsky? Are the Atelier's full sounding?
    I like a full tone, and play finger style more then slap, but I do want as much 70's growl & grind as possible without sounding compressed.
    HELP!
     
  2. Hello again!

    Ok, this is relatively simple. Go to itunes or somewhere and listen to 3 or 4 Marcus Miller tunes... find some fingerstyle and slap.... THAT will be very close to the sound of the Atelier.

    I have not heard the Sadowsky with single coils, so can't help you there, but every bone in my body thinks it will be a relatively subtle difference from the stock pickups. Therefore, you can go on to BassTasters and check out the Sadowsky J clips... they won't be identical, but will be close enough to what you would hear from the UV70 with SC's to give you an idea.

    My guess is, you would be much better off with the Sadowsky for the tone and playing style you are describing.

    Edit: I know I'm always posting on the threads regarding this issue... but I've become quite fanatic about the 70's J sound!!!!
     
  3. Kjung, I appreciate you always chiming in. It seems we hear the same so I usually know exactly where your coming from.
     
  4. vision

    vision It's all about the groove! Supporting Member

    Feb 25, 2005
    Ann Arbor, MI
    Endorsing Artist: MTD Basses, La Bella Strings, and 64 Audio IEMs
    +1...if you play fingerstyle alot more than slap, and you like more of a "full" tone, I think the Sadowsky will be a better match for you.
     
  5. Are the Sadowsky's still growly and aggressive? I mean, they ARE a 70's Jazz, right?
     
  6. IMO and IME, I would call them a modern take on the 70's Jazz, versus the 'old school' 70's Jazz on Steroids thing' that the Atelier and Celinder do.

    Again, to me, the Sadowsky UV70 is MUCH more 'Sadowsky' than 'pure 70's Jazz'. This is not a bad thing IMO:D... I would call it a 'refined' growl and aggression versus the 'over the top' sound of the Celinder type 'truer' version of the 'souped up' 70's J.

    I don't even know if what I'm saying makes sense:D I guess the best way to describe the Celinder (and by assumption, the Atelier) is they sound like taking the best 1977 Fender Jazz ever made, and putting in a top of the line preamp and upgraded hardware... they REALLY sound like a souped up Fender J. The amazing thing about the Celinder is that the pickups are actually humcancelling... and sound more 'single coil' than some single coils I've heard.. all the while being totally quiet (however, that would be another topic:D ). The Sadowsky UV70 sounds like a relatively minor tweak of the standard Sadowsky J... again, wonderful in its own way... very punchy with nice upper mid growl and grunt, and that very nice Sadowsky treble response that is very unique to my ear.

    The good news is, there is a 7 day 'no questions asked' return policy on the Sadowsky basses, as long as you don't take the protective film, etc. off the pickguard and back cover.... very little risk.
     
  7. still 7 days, even if you add true single coils and a VTC?
     
  8. I'm almost sure of it, but of course, I would check prior to order. The 7 day trial is good on even the most 'tricked out' NYC models, so I would assume you would be good on a relatively simple Metro mod!
     
  9. vision

    vision It's all about the groove! Supporting Member

    Feb 25, 2005
    Ann Arbor, MI
    Endorsing Artist: MTD Basses, La Bella Strings, and 64 Audio IEMs
    More GAS...:scowl: This subject is worth it's own thread - I had no idea those were humcancelling!
     
  10. albass111

    albass111

    Feb 13, 2006
    Los Angeles, CA
    And with the Atelier Z's you have to watch out for 12+ pounds!
     
  11. From what Joel at the Groove Shoppe states, the newer ones are between 10-11 pounds, as are most Celinder Updates. Unfortunately, I've come to realize that much of the true '70's J on steroid' classic sound comes from a large, dense, relatively heavy piece of ash!

    However, you make a good point... it's imperative to talk about weight with the retailer when considering a Celinder or Atelier that attempts to model the late 70's Fender J. While the weight of the body is key, there is no reason that 10 1/2 or 11 pounds won't get you there wonderfully. Anything heavier than that begins to be a problem on the gig for most.
     
  12. BartmanPDX

    BartmanPDX Supporting Member

    I'm extremely happy with my Metro UV70, and I swapped out the HCs for single coils, which did improve the sound IMHO, making it sound more like a classic '70s Fender, though with five strings. For reference, the Sadowsky single coils are most like the Seymour Duncan Antiquity IIs (though with a minor difference).

    Haven't heard the Atelier, but I've always been a believer that pickups and electronics influence sound to a greater degree than minor differences in construction, particularly if the woods used are similar and pickup locations are similar.

    Bottom line -- either one is probably an exceptional choice you'd be more than happy with.
     
  13. gruuv

    gruuv

    Jan 23, 2004
    Tennessee
    I have to respectfully disagree with Ken and Jason on the Sadowsky being a better fit for what you're describing. Having owned both an Atelier Z and several Sadowsky's (NYC and Metro) and most recently a Sadowsky Tokyo (full size body, BadAss bridge) the Atelier was BY FAR the most 70's sounding of them all. That thing absolutely nailed that tone. I play 98% fingerstyle, mine did not have a passive tone option. It was full, extremely punchy, growly... and could be many other things based upon varying my right hand technique. I've posted this in another thread but it was one of the most responsive/sensitive to touch basses I've ever owned.

    Don't get me wrong, the Sadowsky's are amazing instruments and I have not tried a UV70 model. I also realize that a 70's pickup placement makes a difference, as do single coils. But, in my opinion, the heavy ash of the Atelier Z's make the biggest difference in achieving that tone. There is a depth and punch to it that light swamp just won't do - in my opinion of course. ;) But, to me, the Sadowsky's do something different. I agree with Ken completely that they are more of a "modern jazz tone" as opposed to the classic "70's jazz on steroids" tone of the Atelier/Celinder Update basses.
     
  14. Thanks!
    Question: Does the Atelier Z sound overly tight, to the point of being compressed?
     
  15. I actually think we are agreeing. The Atelier and Celinder totally cop the 'real 70's J Bass thing'. I'm just not sure that is what ModernGrowl really wants. I totally agree with you that the UV70 does not cop that vibe at all (although it still sounds great). It just seems that the Atelier/Celinder Update models are just made to slap. If I was primarily a rock oriented finger style player, the UV70 and the general Sadowsky tone would work better for me, I think.

    However... +10000... if you want the Marcus Miller thing... it's the Atelier and Celinder all the way... period (and maybe the Sadowsky Tokyo which are no longer made).
     
  16. vision

    vision It's all about the groove! Supporting Member

    Feb 25, 2005
    Ann Arbor, MI
    Endorsing Artist: MTD Basses, La Bella Strings, and 64 Audio IEMs
    +1...we definitely all agree about the Atelier Z's...they are true 70's jazz basses. It all comes down to what you're looking for. For me, even playing fingerstyle I prefer the 70's jazz "Marcus" tone to the more warm, fat 60's tone. I am not a rock player at all, most of what I do is either R&B/soul or funk/jazz. Celinders and Atelier Z's are heads and shoulders above everything else when it comes to getting that authentic 70's tone.
     
  17. gruuv

    gruuv

    Jan 23, 2004
    Tennessee
    Hey Ken,

    Yeah, you're right. I guess I should've just explained that, while the Atelier does do that Marcus thang all day, it also had a fantastic, full and punchy fingerstyle tone as well. But, you are right, we do agree in everything a far as the way we hear the two basses. I just didn't want him to discount the Z's thinking it was "just a slap bass." Although I know that's not what you and Jason are saying.

    Not at all. . . well, not to me. Mine sounded very full, and open. I prefer an open tone to one that is more compressed and the Atelier was a very open and at the same time full and punchy bass. Mine had a Bart pre as well, which I was not too wild about. I've heard that Mas's Atelier pre is much more desirable... but I ran it passive and it was amazing. It sounds a bit like I'm giving you a "this bass can do it all" sales pitch, and I don't mean to do that. It's definitely got its own sound, the 70's jazz sound. A friend of mine, our keyboard player at church, commented (within 2 minutes of hearing the Atelier the day I first played it), "That sounds more like my dad's 70's Fender than any other bass I've ever heard. Only, it sounds 'deeper'." I've bought and sold a lot of basses, and while I've not regretted selling any of the Sadowsky's, fantastic as they were, the Atelier I REALLY regret having let go. I really wish I'd dropped a different pre into it and kept it - it was truly remarkable.

    I'd advise you to e-mail Joel (or David for that matter) from the Groove Shoppe. Those guys carry Atelier's and I believe Joel owns a gigs with a Sadowsky as well. Despite being a dealer, he will absolutely not try to sell you on one if he doesn't think it will fit what you're looking for. As a matter of fact, he talked me out of buying a particular piece of equipment ($2000 equipment I might add) that I was planning to buy from them after we discussed what I was looking for. Anyway, they know those basses, and Mas well.

    Good luck!
     
  18. +1 90% of my playing is fingerstyle, and the Celinder works pretty well for that also! The key is 'authentic 70's tone' versus 'Sadowsky tone'.... hard to desribe in words. They are so, so different... but both great.
     
  19. vision

    vision It's all about the groove! Supporting Member

    Feb 25, 2005
    Ann Arbor, MI
    Endorsing Artist: MTD Basses, La Bella Strings, and 64 Audio IEMs
    +1…I’m right around that same ratio. When I’m at home and just fooling around, I slap more. Also when I’m at a music store trying out a bass (for me, I can hear more of the tone of the bass when slapping than when playing fingerstyle. When I play fingerstyle I always sound like “me”, because so much of it has to do with the way I pluck the strings – when I play slap the tone it’s a bit more the bass that I’m playing.) But on the gig, I play fingerstyle around 90% of the time. I only slap when a song really calls for it.

    Yep, it is really hard to describe the difference between a Sadowsky "modern jazz" and a Atelier/Celinder "70's jazz on steroids"...maybe it's because alot of people think that "on steroids" = "modern". There's a difference. They both sound like jazz basses, but the Sadowsky sound is more "smooth" or "refined" while the Atelier/Celinder sound is more "raw". The problem is that when you put words to it, it makes the difference sound more extreme than it really is. Once again, they all sound like jazz basses. The differences are within one tone family.
     
  20. Nino Valenti

    Nino Valenti Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 2, 2001
    Staten Island NYC
    Builder: Valenti Basses
    IMO, asking these kinds of subjective questions never really helps. Again, IMO and IME.

    I owned a really nice Atelier Z 5 string J bass. It sounded great in my bands setting.

    I've owned a UV70 4 string with the HC's and SC's in it. It sounded great in my bands setting.

    I've owned other NYC, Metro, Tokyo Basses. They sounded great in my bands setting.

    For me to try to give a comparison would be futile because I didn't own all the basses at the same time. Even if I did own them at the same time, my definition of aggressive, tighter, more classic 70's tone, compressed sounding, full sounding, etc, may be different then what you expecting them to mean.

    The only real way to know what a bass is going to sound like is to play it. IMO, either bass you buy, I don't think you'll be disappointed.
     

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