Psst... Ready to join TalkBass and start posting, make new friends, sell your gear, and more?  Register your free account in 30 seconds.

Schroeder 1210 and tube amp? V4bh or YBA200

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by junglebike, Dec 3, 2005.


  1. junglebike

    junglebike Supporting Member

    Feb 14, 2003
    San Diego, CA
    Currently use my 1210 with an Acoustic Image Focus. I've always loved the SVT tone, but I can't hack the weight of an SVT stack. The Schroeder, with its high 102dB efficiency, seems like an ideal candidate for pairing with a small tube amp. I don't play too loud, and big gigs always have PA support.

    I've heard very good things about the V4bh head, with the exception of headroom constraints (100W). Anyone tried this pairing? Theoretically, it should be the same volume as a 300W tube amp through a (too lazy to do the math...) probably 98-ish dB cab, which is right around normal. An SVT 810 is 100dB.

    Regardless, anyone actually done this? I'd love to find a good V4bh for around $500 used. Otherwise, there's the YBA200, which I'm sure would have enough power, but I really dig the Ampeg tube tone, so I'd rather stick with them.

    Thoughts?
     
  2. James Hart

    James Hart

    Feb 1, 2002
    toms_river.nj.us
    Endorsing Artist: see profile
    I played my old Sunn Sceptre (pair of 6550) throught my 1210 and it sounded killer. Not nearly loud enough clean to sit with a drummer for my taste, but could have been usable in a mellow setting.
     
  3. junglebike

    junglebike Supporting Member

    Feb 14, 2003
    San Diego, CA
    Pair of 6550s put out 100W, right? Shoot, maybe I need 200W... I don't know the amp, but I assume you were distorting the power tubes, not the pre, at that point?
     
  4. Passinwind

    Passinwind I Know Nothing Supporting Member

    I tried a V4B with 4 6550s through my 1210. I could maybe get by on some rock or blues gigs with it, but the clean headroom was definitely lacking for my taste. I was having trouble getting enough headroom from my Focus too for a while though. I'd suggest you try a tube based compressor with your Focus, and maybe a separate preamp as well. Compared to carrying around a V4, this would still be a pretty small rig.

    I built my own preamp, and added a Symetrix (solid state) compressor, running into the EFX return. The Focus is much nicer for BG now, at least for what I need. I'm definitely not of the Ampeg school though. :cool:
     
  5. James Hart

    James Hart

    Feb 1, 2002
    toms_river.nj.us
    Endorsing Artist: see profile
    me either, my first rig was fliptop.... I hated it

    Yeah, the 2x6550 was rated by Sunn @ 60 watts but really puts out closer to 100. Playing 5 and 6 strings setting the volume above 3 or 4, I was already stressing the limits of the power tubes. If you listen to sound clips from "the 0x" hear on TB... he bought the Sunn from me and gets the most outragous power tube distorted bass tones this side of a John Wetton recording! Too bad that isn't the kinda tone I could get away with using :bassist:
     
  6. Passinwind

    Passinwind I Know Nothing Supporting Member

    LOL, the B-15N was my first rig too, only I had a Radio Shack speaker in a homemade cab.

    The V4B made some great distorted sounds through the Schro, if I needed that vibe it'd be cool. I gotta bust out my scary homebrewed toOb preamp and record some distorted tracks one of these days. :cool:
     
  7. Larry Kaye

    Larry Kaye Retailer: Schroeder Cabinets

    Mar 23, 2000
    Cleveland, OH
    at the music store. There's a Yorkville thread in the amps section that has a "complete as you're gonna get from trying out in the store!!!" review.

    In short, I thought it really sounded good and there was plenty of room to not overdrive the head into fuzz tone by staying under 12 o'clock on the preamp, yet and using the resonance control set as high? as possible to dampin the speakers and not let any extra cone flubbing occur.

    Personally I too use the Focus, the four pound magic cigar box, and although it may not overall sound as "rich" as the YBA200 and probably other tube heads you could get in the 300 watt+- range or maybe even the Ampeg V4, it's still ballsy. I wouldn't trade the Focus for the YBA200 but if I had the money, i'd get a copy of both. I'm sure that in certain types of rooms, there will definitely be an advantage in having one instead of the other. You can always use the YBA as your "standard" head, and for an extra 4 or 5 pound schlepp (ei....nothing) have both heads in case one either blows up or plain obviously sounds "better" on a given job.

    As far as volume, I feel the Focus has more, but like I said, haven't tried the YBA on a gig, or the Focus at a guitar store, so.....not too much help here I guess :meh:

    LKaye
     
  8. junglebike

    junglebike Supporting Member

    Feb 14, 2003
    San Diego, CA
    Thanks a lot, Larry -- very helpful.

    I'm kind of thinking that I'd want to keep my Focus for clean gigs and use the V4BH for blues and rock dirty stuff. I'd certainly not get a 100W SVT clone for its clean tone! That'd be a pretty versatile setup; the Focus and V4 are pretty much opposite amps in all respects.

    I guess I'm thinking -- if I keep the Focus, I'd probably prefer the V4B over the YBA200, just 'cause I love the dirty SVT tone and don't really need clean headroom. I guess I could also slave the V4 into the focus powering a second cab... hmm...
     
  9. James Hart

    James Hart

    Feb 1, 2002
    toms_river.nj.us
    Endorsing Artist: see profile
    How about a Tonebone or other stomp box / small case tube pre in front of your 4lbs head.

    I REALLY LOVE my 400 watt tube beast, but do miss the portability of my old AMP BH-260... gigging the Focus must be great when it comes time to pack up and go home.
     
  10. Chef

    Chef Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    May 23, 2004
    Columbia MO
    Staff Reviewer; Bass Gear Magazine
    I like my old blackfaced fender bassman thru my 1210, but (obviously) it's not very loud at 35 watts;)
    I'm really curious if the yba200 would be loud enough, and clean enough for me. I don't mind "warm," but I don't dig "unclean," if that makes sense...

    I can hear you saying "well that old fender ain't gonna be real clean," but I had it rebuilt with all new parts, and am running 12au7's in the prestage, not 12ax7's....so while it doesn't get real loud, what the volumes it's good at it sounds nice. Good studio head;)
     
  11. Larry Kaye

    Larry Kaye Retailer: Schroeder Cabinets

    Mar 23, 2000
    Cleveland, OH
    If you keep the gain, at least again with my bass, which is an active 18 volt Bartolini preamp, at under 12:00, there was no distortion. For me if the resonance control was addtionally kept close to all the way "up" or "on" or "whatever", to control the speaker travel, you could get substantial volume (which is close to if not equal to, if not slightly more .... didn't have a meter to measure it....just these old ears) to the Focus, with the master at 2 or 3 o'clock and a little more available before overdriving the speakers. Mind you, I've never had the Focus totally cranked on the master volume. The "highest" I've had the amp was at 11:00 on the gain, and 1:00 on the Master volume. This past weekend I had the gain at 9:00 and the master at 1:00 and it was ballsy and loud as heck in a medium sized lounge.

    Now I know this isn't a real scientific a/b comparison because the YBA200 sounds totally different than the Focus does. The YBA has much more sensitive and useable tone controls than the Focus. The YBA is definitely going to "challenge" the limits of the 1210 more often than the Focus , not from an overall volume standpoint but from how much "tone" it can take with the volume.

    I've always liked the "dry sterility" of a solid state head and even are "liking" it more without a tube front end. I not only like the Focus after we're done playing, but every time I pack my car, unload at a club or hotel, schlepp to the stage from the street and the process in reverse. The amp is plenty loud with the Schroeder cabinets for any of the gigs I play. but I'm curious as others are....it seems there's a real good sized crowd who use an all tube amp...mesa 400+, SVT'er'
    s, maybe others too now that the affordable YBA200 is gaining in popularity, and some vintage tube headers that I'd certainly like to hear from, especially if they have either a 1210 or 410.

    I hope this is helpful rambling.

    Lkaye