... so I got assaulted by a loony this morning ...

Discussion in 'Off Topic [BG]' started by WillPlay4Food, Jan 4, 2005.

  1. DigMe


    Aug 10, 2002
    Waco, TX
    That's true. However "imminent danger" is open to debate and in the end it all depends on whether the DA and then the jury agrees about the imminent danger thing.

    That does happen to a lot of good people who were put in a bad situation but it is far from guaranteed that all of that will happen. There are many, many cases in which a person was forced into a defensive shooting and was not arrested and the DA did not pursue charges and therefore they did not have to go before a grand jury. Mainly it's all in the hands of the DA and often it has to do with his personal agenda. I'm guessing that your instructor friend tells that to all of his students so they will be prepared for the worst possible consequences. I surely hope that he doesn't really believe that every single defensive shooting ends in an arrest and an apperance before a grand jury. Like you said though...none of that matters so much if you are alive when you would have been dead.

    brad cook
  2. WillPlay4Food

    WillPlay4Food Now With More Metal! Supporting Member

    Apr 9, 2002
    Orbiting HQ
    I used to know someone who killed a guy in self-defense. He spent 14 days in jail (he was booked on murder charges) until a witness came up and corraborated his self-defense story. Every time he was ID'ed by a cop from that day forward he always came back as 'arrested for murder'.
  3. Razor


    Sep 22, 2002
    Around North Dallas..it's pretty much the norm that even persons involved in "justified" shootings will still be filed on as it was a homicide. THEN....the person goes before the Grand Jury to get either "NO BILLED" or "TRUE BILLED".

    Even Officers who are involved shootings are filed on and named as suspects in the taking of life however once the facts are presented it's normally "NO BILLED".

    It's just a formality/way of passing the buck to the Grand Jury. It's pretty standard around here.
  4. DigMe


    Aug 10, 2002
    Waco, TX
    It would make sense that the instructor guy would say that then since he appears to also be in the Dallas or north Dallas area. Do you arrest the person who was justified even if it looks like a clearcut case of a justified shooting? I think this practice is more common in big cities where DAs and policemen don't have as much time to spend on looking into these cases and whatnot. That really sucks though that some thug could be headed to your baby's room with a shotgun and you shoot him and then get arrested and still have to go before a grand jury.

    I think there was a case in Houston a couple of months back where a shop owner chased some robbers out and down the street and was having a driving gunfight with them and was not charged with anything! The guy's an idiot for sure but he got off lucky I think. There is some law that has some wording about using deadly force if it's the only way to retrieve stolen property and there is no hope of getting it back otherwise. I don't have my gun laws booklet handy right here though.

    brad cook
  5. Rav


    Dec 29, 2004
    Aurora, IL

    Maybe I should have been a bit more specific. In the Dallas area they always arrest you for homicide as razor stated even if your a police officer shooting in the line of duty. And you always go before the grand jury. The grand jury decides if it goes to trial or not.

    If its clearly a justified shooting you get to go about your way same day after some questioning booking and writing up your statements. This would include officer involved shootings or blatant self defense like home invasion robbery ( or generally anytime you shoot someone you don't know in your own house in the middle of the night )

    If its even slightly suspect why you shot them your going to go to jail for certain until you bail yourself out or go before the grand jury. I stated this because of the topic story about being attacked mid day for no apparent reason not on your property and without a witness or a second weapon present. In these circumstances your going to the pokey trust me.

    There are more justifications for other reasons than I listed previously I was just listing the ones that pertained to the assult topic. If I remember right in texas they are as follows.

    Justifyable uses of lethal force

    1) Protecting your own life from imminent danger

    2) Protecting someone elses life from imminent danger or bodily harm ( this includes stopping a rape in progress not necessarily a prevention of death but prevents harm )

    3) Prevention of Arson ( have to shoot them before they light the fire and not after, hard one to prove )

    4) Protection of personal property

    5) Criminal Mischief in the night. ( arguably the most controversial CHL law in the country, Basically justifies killing people rustling your cattle or destroying your property on your land between sundown and sunup - VERY HARD to justify in practice be prepared to go to the graybar hotel if you use this one )

    Again getting arested doesnt mean your going to have to go to trial for murder it just means a grand jury has to find your actions justified under the law for you to get cleared. Regardless of their personal beliefs if they think you followed the laws of the state your going to be cleared of charges.

    Since someone mentioned pepper spray or mace earlier I might also point out that using pepper spray or mace in texas is considered use of "force" and you are also subject to arrest for assault for using it even if your the defender. And you might have to go to grand jury in a similar manner for having used it.

    All of this is a counterbalance to the right to carry weapons and use force granted under texas law. Its a check system just to keep people with guns and other weapons in line and make sure they only use them when absolutely necessary.

    It doesn't change the fact that its inherintly a bad idea to attempt to rob or attack someone in texas. Statistically you run about a 10% chance of getting shot if you try it.

  6. Razor


    Sep 22, 2002
    Brad..you're talking about the increased element included in the Theft statute. Basically gives Texas homeowners the right to exercise deadly force if someone is stealing property during nighttime hours. And yep...it's still law amazing enough. One of the few elements that allows deadly force with regard to a property crime.

    As for the arrest/no arrest issue...I can't see someone, who the Police can tell was justified, being arrested. Most of the time the person would go to jail because very few occurances are justified. But if it's a clean shoot they're not physically going to jail however they will be, what we call, "Filed On" meaning they will have charges prepared against them for the offense and it will be sent to the DA's office for review. Like I said, this is what happens even to Law Enforcement Officials. Basically a technical way to say, "Hold on, we're gonna keep you in one spot and do our investigation...but we're not gonna rule anything out to soon so if something develops and you actually did something wrong..well we've already got you listed as the suspect. If it comes back and you're clear..well that's good too." :p
  7. aaron f.

    aaron f.

    Oct 21, 2000
    The best places to hit someone, should the need arise:
    1) the throat (Trachea)
    2) base of the skull
    3) up and under the ribs (diaphragm and liver region)

    these apply both to unarmed self defense and defence with a weapon.

    and obviously the balls, thats a no brainer
  8. Razor


    Sep 22, 2002
    Try and remember people...if you gotta' throw down with somebody (meaning it's the ONLY alternative you have) you want to strike someone the least amount of times possible. This keeps you from getting busy and winded. If you gotta' do it..try and make it 1-2 hits max and hit as hard as you possibly can..

    This aint love-makin'...could mean your life.
  9. Primary

    Primary TB Assistant

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