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Speakerguys help! B&C 2x12"

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by jock, Oct 3, 2005.


  1. jock

    jock

    Jun 7, 2000
    Stockholm, Sweden
    I can get a great price on two B&C 12HPL64 speakers. And as Im looking to build a lightweight 2x12 cab this is really good timing.
    Do you think these speakers will work with a 4-string?
    Im gonna put these in a 79 liter cab tuned to 52 Hz.

    First I was aiming for the Beyma 12LW30/N drivers but they are twice the price. :bawl:

    Tell me your thoughts on this project.

    http://www.bcspeakers.com/index.php?sez=1&categoria=2&id_descrizione=44&prodotto=44
     
  2. burk48237

    burk48237 Supporting Member

    Nov 22, 2004
    Oak Park, MI
    Don at Low Down Sound offers B & C as his "upgraded" drivers. I have one of his 2 X 10 neos with a selenium tweeter and it rocks. I have a 2X 12 on order, the ones I've heard are just solid and punchy with plenty of power handling. I believe B & C are the drivers that Epiphani uses. If you build the right box they will be very cool.
     
  3. jock

    jock

    Jun 7, 2000
    Stockholm, Sweden
    Thanks. I remember reading that now that you mention it.
    Do you know if LDS use stock B&C drivers in their 2x12 cabs? Or do they custom order them?
    What are the specs on the 2x12 you have on order?
     
  4. MikeBass

    MikeBass Supporting Member

    Nov 4, 2003
    Ferndale MI.
    Artist: Xotic Basses/AccuGroove
    I have a LDS 212.
    Don is spec'ing stock speakers right now, but I know he is looking at custom ones as well.
    If I remember, I think mine are prototype 12's, but then again, I'm a bit different as I usually end up with prototype cabs from Don to beat up a bit ;). Sorta like the unofficial "tester" for LDS cabs. I'll ask Don about my speakers again, as my cab took a few different turns in the developing process.
    I will tell you this, it's MUCH more that just grabbing a spec off the net for a box, throwing it together and dropping speakers into it.
    My cab is a prototype based off of Don's personal cab (mine is just a bit deeper than his) that I used on a few gigs.
    When I get a chance, I need to write a review of my 212 and post it up.
    And yes, Epifani uses custom spec'd (I assume they are custom) B&C drivers.
    B&C holds high and tight tolerances (tighter than some other large US builders BTW) and builds a great speaker.
     
  5. jock

    jock

    Jun 7, 2000
    Stockholm, Sweden
    Thanks. This is not the first box I´ve ever built. Ive done two different 1x12" cabs with great result IMO. I use WinISD to model the box.
    The mentioned 79 liter 52 Hzis the SBB4 alignment according to WinISD BTW.

    Here in Sweden it really pays to build yourself as we dont have a big bass market and hence the rediculous prices.
     
  6. Mika

    Mika Guest

    Nov 29, 2002
    I modded a Rocktron SE-112 guitar cab a while ago and replaced the stock driver with a 12HPL64. Its internal volume is roughly half of your 2x12" project and the tuning is also about 52 Hz if I remember correctly.

    It's a loud and punchy cab with surprisingly good clarity for a single 12". Absolutely great for onstage monitoring. It's definitely not a low end monster, though, but will reproduce a 4-string very nicely.

    You'll probably get a little more booty out of the 2x12". I definitely recommend the 12HPL64!

    How good exactly is the price?
     
  7. jock

    jock

    Jun 7, 2000
    Stockholm, Sweden
    Perfect! Thanks!
    It´s mainly for use at rehersals and as my bassmonitor on stage. We never play without PA (fingers crossed).
    Did it take a lot of power to sound good?
     
  8. rpatter

    rpatter Supporting Member

    Sep 18, 2004
    Round Rock, TX
    So Mike, how do you like the tweeter in that cab? I remember you saying that you preferred the tweet in the Epifani.

    Ralf

     
  9. jock

    jock

    Jun 7, 2000
    Stockholm, Sweden
    €110. At least I think that is good. Have you seen better?
     
  10. Mika

    Mika Guest

    Nov 29, 2002
    I ran it with a SansAmp PBDDI and my DigiMod 500 at a few rehearsals and two gigs. The cab seemed to be quite efficient, so I didn't need to drive it very hard.
     
  11. Mika

    Mika Guest

    Nov 29, 2002
    Where?!? www.cadaudio.dk has the lowest price I've seen so far (118 €).
     
  12. jock

    jock

    Jun 7, 2000
    Stockholm, Sweden
    Some guy at german eBay sell them for €111 but cadaudio.dk looks and feels like a safer place to buy from to me. I just sent them a mail.
     
  13. Petebass

    Petebass

    Dec 22, 2002
    QLD Australia
    I'm at work right now and don't have access to my cab software. Good neo 12's for bass are hard to find among the "standard" speaker models. I've contemplated the B&C and the Beyma you mentioned... From memory, 52Hz is the B&C's resonant frequency, which means the 79 litres is more than likely an SBB4 alignment?

    When I was looking at that speakers, I was concerned by the relatively low wattage rating (200W), the relatively high tuning frequency, and the high -3dB point. From memory it was something like 80Hz?

    In theory, the Beyma speaker you mentioned has the same F3 problem. However in a recent thread, one TB'er said her was happy with the low frequency performance of the 12LW/30n, so I guess the -3dB point at 80Hz might not be an issue. However, the Beyma has a higher wattage rating (350w), and because it's Fs is 38 Hz, you can tune the cab lower and therefore eliminate potential problems with the speaker hitting x-max on the lower notes.

    From memory, the Beyma also performed quite well in the "maximum wattage limited by X-max" department. That's where the extra money goes. If you've got WinISD pro, use the "Maximum power" graph to compare the two speakers.

    In the end I couldn't decide. Both had potential but neither were perfect.

    I tried the Epi UL2x12 recently. It was quite nice. The net weight is 28kg. From my experience you can allow roughly 10 to 12Kg for the unloded cab, which means the 2x12 speakers weigh about 8kg's each. The speakers we're looking at only weigh 3.5Kg's. I guess there's something in that. Perhaps the neo 12's available to ordinary people like us are better suited for PA, and the bass speakers are reserved for OEM cataloges. I'm just guessing, but that's how it appears to me at this point in time.
     
  14. jock

    jock

    Jun 7, 2000
    Stockholm, Sweden
    Yes, the 52 Hz tuning is the SBB¤ alignment.

    So, what would you say is the best neo 12 out there for a 2x12 cab? I only want to build one cab and might wait till I can get what will really make me happy.
     
  15. Petebass

    Petebass

    Dec 22, 2002
    QLD Australia
    If I knew, I would have built it by now :) The search continues....... I'd love to have a look at Beyma and B&C's OEM offerings. I wish I knew enough about driver manufacture to get Eminence to make a killer neo 12 for bass.
     
  16. billfitzmaurice

    billfitzmaurice Commercial User

    Sep 15, 2004
    New Hampshire
    Owner, Bill Fitzmaurice Loudspeaker Design
    Wait until Winter NAMM.
     
  17. jock

    jock

    Jun 7, 2000
    Stockholm, Sweden
    What have you heard? :hyper:
     
  18. rpatter

    rpatter Supporting Member

    Sep 18, 2004
    Round Rock, TX
    Eminence has revamped their neo line and from what they are saying, the new neo drivers are an order of magnitude better than the Deltalites.

    Ralf
     
  19. Petebass

    Petebass

    Dec 22, 2002
    QLD Australia
    That's not hard to do. The Deltalite 10 speced up ok, but the 12 and 15 are nothing to write home about.

    Do we have T/S data for the revamped models yet?
     
  20. billfitzmaurice

    billfitzmaurice Commercial User

    Sep 15, 2004
    New Hampshire
    Owner, Bill Fitzmaurice Loudspeaker Design
    I can't reveal any details beyond that they expect to debut the new line at NAMM. I do know that the new drivers are going to have specs close to those of some of their more popular ferrite magnet models.