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Swr I.O.D. verses Eden Navagator

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by FunkySpoo, Sep 19, 2002.


  1. FunkySpoo

    FunkySpoo Supporting Member

    Feb 6, 2002
    Like the title says which do you all like better and why? I'm open to other suggestions but these are the ones I'm seriously looking at.
     
  2. AMJBASS

    AMJBASS Supporting Member

    Jan 8, 2002
    Ontario, Canada
    That is a hard one! Both are superb pre-amps. I would be happy with either, but I did purchase the IOD and I don't regret it at all.

    I would say that the SWR is clearer, more articulate than the Eden, but it does not have semi parametric control, or compression(though you can get tube compression out of it). The SWR has the ability to mix all tube(via dual EL84's), with the classic SWR circuit. The EQ is not drastic. It will compensate for room acoustics. I feel it is more natural than the Eden, but it won't cut through the band quite as well(depending on the style of music).

    Both are great.:)
     
  3. Hello , I have both an EDEN Navagator and a SWR Gand Prix Preamps. I can honestly say I love them both, I use the SWR for practice and studio work, the Eden see's most live shows. The SWR has basic controls and ease of operation, the Eden is bit more articulate in controls along with compression and other bells & whistles. I feel that the SWR is bit more "Cleaner" than the Eden but, you can get almost any sound from the Navagaor due to it's versatility. I seem to get more bottom and low end crunch from the Navagator. I Power them with QSC PL224's & Carver PT1250's for live stuff...I would play thru both and make your decision as to which sound is for you. I could'nt make up my mind and bought both! ...yes....I'm an idiot!...but I finally found the sound I was looking for.
     
  4. FunkySpoo

    FunkySpoo Supporting Member

    Feb 6, 2002
    Thanks guys, anybody else have any words of wisdom? Any other suggestions for pre-amps that I may be overlooking?
    BTW I'm using a MM SR5 and two EA vl210's and play in a blues/jump/swing band. Very seldom do any studio work and only gig about twice a month.
    I hope that info helps with suggesting pre-amps. Thanks again.
     
  5. The current production SWR Interstellar Overdrive will do everything the (discontinued) Grand Prix does, plus the IOD has a built in grind (Drive).

    The IOD only puts out 0.775v at maximum, so know this before using it to drive a power amp such as a big QSC that requires 1.7v to reach full amplification. I get around this by using Rane signal processing (crossover and EQ) which allow me to boost the IOD signal higher than 0.775 volts.
     
  6. FunkySpoo

    FunkySpoo Supporting Member

    Feb 6, 2002
    I'm glad you brought this up about I.O.D.. I recently e-mailed SWR about it's output voltage and the need for QSC amps to have 1 to 1.2 volts, (according to Bob Lee of QSC) input to drive them to their max output. This is a copy of SWR's reply.


    The output voltage (on both 1/4" and XLR outputs) for the I.O.D.
    is 700 millivolts - or .7 volts - at an input of 140 millivolts at a
    frequency of 100 hz. 140 millivolts is a good test input voltage, but many
    instruments have consistently higher output than that, which would put the
    output voltage well into the desired range for the QSC. In other words, it
    should be fine.

    Is this fine? I have no idea. Also I'll be buying my QSC PLX 1602 from Lord Valve and he does some mod to the PLX so that the SWR can drive the PLX to it's max output. Judging from SWR's responce to my e-mail, does this mod still need to be done? Thanks again for all your help
     
  7. AMJBASS

    AMJBASS Supporting Member

    Jan 8, 2002
    Ontario, Canada
    The modification does have to be done. I get twice as much volume out of my Mesa Walkabout than I did with my IOD/QSC setup. I was always clipping the power amp. I now use the IOD through the FX loop on my Mesa when I want the "SWR sound", and I plug into the pre-amp.
     
  8. I got the same answer back from SWR.

    The DiMarzio Ultra Jazz put out 250mV, and the other DM bass pickups are less, typically 150 ~ 175mV. Note the DM pickups are typically higher output than the Fender. So, the maximum IOD output when driven by a typical passive Fender bass is 0.775 volts, or less.

    0.775v is *not* enough balls to drive even a QSC 1202 which has the most sensitivity (1.0v) of the PLX line.

    Unless my math is off, the IOD provides about 5.5x voltage gain. A PLX requiring 1.7 volts input will need pickups putting out 0.300v with the IOD turned all the way up. I suspect running the IOD wide open will introduce distortion and other crappy tone in the signal.

    I own the IOD and get around this by using Rane signal processing (crossover and EQ) which has greater than unity gain, so I can boost my signal to fully drive my PLX 3002 amps. My Fender RB5 was a very low output passive bass and required a lot of assistance... much more than a standard J bass. My P was the loudest of my passive Fenders.

    IMO, an excellent solution for passive basses is using a John East stompbox. This is the external version of his J-Retro active preamp, and both are killer products. The Dude is the US importer for these, and the quality is A-1. I own a J-Retro and can attest to fine construction and quality components used in the East products.

    Link to Dude Pit Stomp Boxes
     
  9. FunkySpoo

    FunkySpoo Supporting Member

    Feb 6, 2002
    Thanks bgavin. Do you know anything about the modification that Lord Valve does to the PLX so that it can be driven by the IOD. If not I'm going to be calling him today to ask him directly and I'll post his reply here.
     
  10. jasonbraatz

    jasonbraatz

    Oct 18, 2000
    Oakland, CA
    i'd take the IOD any day of the week.

    it may not have parametric EQ - but it doesn't need it

    it's got TONE



    my only gripe is that it doesn't have a pregain knob. :(
     
  11. BigBohn

    BigBohn

    Sep 29, 2001
    WPB, Florida
    I've been lovin my Navigator for a year or so now. Great preamp. Good solid slap and jazz tone. Ballsy rock and metal tone too. It does it all.

    The IOD was my primary choice before the Eden, but due to ordering problems, I went with the Nav that I fell in love with on the showroom floor.

    Both are very acceptable to me.
     
  12. Lord Valve is authorized to do the change. It is a resistor change made to barrel type resistors on an internal board.

    QSC and LV probably charge $25 or less for the job. If you order the amp new from LV, you can get his very good pricing plus avoiding additional two-way shipping charges from shipping the amp back to QSC for factory modification.
     
  13. ldiezman

    ldiezman

    Jul 11, 2001
    Nashville
    I agree with Warwick5s... this thing is a tone monster..

    I don't care much about the pregain knob though.. I get everything I need out of this amp. Its perfect for me.. and I don't have problems being loud through my DCM1500 either.. always loud :D
     
  14. FunkySpoo

    FunkySpoo Supporting Member

    Feb 6, 2002
    Well I went ahead and ordered the PLX 1602 from L.V.. It should be here by the weekend. L.V. charges 49 for the mod, but that still beats shipping it back and forth to get it done. Even with the mod charge his price still beats everybody elses price by alot.
    Thanks for everybodies help. you guys really rock :) :) :)