To 410/115RBH or Not to 410/115RBH? That is the Question

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by ChadHidsley, Aug 8, 2013.

  1. ChadHidsley


    Jul 26, 2012
    Hey Guys,

    I am high considering looking into this rig:

    The only rig I ever dreamed of was a 410/115 RBH, I have a 1001RB myself that I use every now and then and I have a chance to get these two cabs for 500-600...It would be an ideal rig with the 1001

    A lot of things come into my rambling head when im deciding on this: it looks to be an older model series RBH, would it hold up for years and years?...can I use my pedal board with biamp?....BUT most I really need it?????

    I was hoping to sell my 1001rb since it sees no use and Right now, I don't play in a band, let alone live...having this rig would be mostly for an awesome factor/I-have-a-sweet-rig-just-in-case

    What are your guys' thoughts?

    Do I A: Complete my 1001rb with a ass-kicking rig for under $1000
    or B: sell my 1001rb, get a practice amp, and accept the fact I cant blast a massive rig and wont play live
  2. CL400Peavey

    CL400Peavey Supporting Member

    Nov 7, 2011
    Grand Rapids Michigan
    Pass on the 410 + 115 combo IMHO. Two 410's or two 115's is the way to go.
  3. BawanaRik


    Mar 6, 2012
    New Jersey
    Unless you really need this kind of power I'd wait until the deal of a life time comes along.

    You already have the 1001. That's enough power for anyone with any connection to sanity. Putting that through a quality 410 will make enough noise to ensure tinnitus and possible even deafness.

    Talk to some of the older guys here. When you hit sixty you want to be able to hear.
  4. I played through both these cabs using a GK Fusion 550 at Sam ash.
    Amazed how great it sounded.

    Using pros and cons, it led me to a GK NEO 4x12 cab instead.
    Deciding factor - I love 12's better plus it is it's own dolly. To each their own.

    My thoughts about this, if you did buy them, you can always use one left at a studio/ practice room while the other is put to use for shows.
  5. Do you need it? Not likely, unless you seriously commit to get your sh*t together, learn to play and go out and find a band/act.
    It would be serious overkill for rehearsing at home with your stereo. Your neighbours won't thank you, that's for sure.
  6. RickenBoogie


    Jul 22, 2007
    Dallas, TX
    I would also pass on a 410/115 pairing. Popular? Yes. But not a good combination at all. Just get the 410 and rock that. Get a 2nd matching 410 if you do ever gig.
  7. Neuroman

    Neuroman BHPD - Forget about me. Save yourselves! Supporting Member

    Oct 17, 2013
    Sunol, CA
    I have been reading a common story line about completing a GK full stack with a 115 which is way oversimplified. It seems like people are just repeating what they heard because it sounded like the right thing to say. Here is the way to look at it from my perspective based upon significant experience using both RBH full stack setups:

    The 50Hz to 19kHz frequency response in the large Paragon 15B400-8, Cast Frame, 15 " Woofer serves to smooth out the low end and sounds amazing when matched with the sharp hard attack of the 4 X 10 cabinet at other than extremely high power settings.

    A common misperception which the "story line" appropriately addresses is that a single 15" or 18" woofer will provide lower frequency response than achieved through a 4X10 series cabinet. This may be true for the lower end 4 X 10 cabs but is not the case when matched with the GK 410 RBH. Rather, what it does is smooth out the tone of the low end spectrum. It is really cool when the gain is set to create strong growl with a full stack and the 4 X 10 cabinet is attacking the lows and the 1 X15 smooths and rounds out some of the tone at the lower mid end. This does not make it a "mistake" or "bad" or anything else like the story line claims. Rather, it makes it distinct and needs to be compared with what you are looking for.

    The 115RBH is a 400watt cabinet which is often being matched with an 800 watt 4 X 10 cabinet. What this means is that it functions best and provides the most beneficial smoothing effect when the venue size requires average or lower loads from your amp head. If you are looking for maximum volume punch to compete against a difficult guitar, key board and drum mix, then you would be better off having another 4 X 10 rather than this 1 X 15 in my view. In that circumstance having a 400 watt single woofer is "a weak link" as the "story line" describes. The problem is that the common story line on this issue takes this goal as an universal assumption. In reality, it really comes down to what you are looking to do with your sound and the type of bands and venues in which you play. You may want to have the ability to smooth out and broaden your mid to low tone to fit your situation or style of play. In this case, the 410 and 115 stack can be a real nice option.
  8. BassmanPaul

    BassmanPaul Gold Supporting Member

    Aug 25, 2007
    Toronto Ontario Canada
    Sorry Neuroman, your post is full of misconceptions and myths. Just to take ONE factor into account as you brought it up: The 4x10 has 800W rating. The 15 400W rating. Running them from the same amp having both 8Ω impedance, the 15 will run out of excursion at about half that of the 4x10. In its usual position atop the stack, the much more efficient 4x10 will overpower the contribution of the 15. Furthermore as the 15 is being drowned out, it's cries of pain are too leading to its eventual demise. If you MUST use this poor pairing, at least stack the 15 on the top so you can actually hear it.

    Chad just get the 4x10 alone. If you find it insufficient for your needs, get a second identical 4x10.

    I would also agree with the good CL's comment on the 15. Try one if you can. If you like it better than the 4x10 then buy two and be away to the races.

    Keep us informed on your decisions and good luck to you Sir. :D

    Edit: P.S. Do a search on the subject of mixing driver sizes. There's a plethora of information on the site as this subject comes up every other day or so.
  9. I'm sure the auction has been won by now.
  10. JEDBass

    JEDBass Supporting Member

    Mar 10, 2009
    West Hartford, CT
    I used to own the 1001RB as well as the 410RBH and the 210RBH (both 8 ohm) a while back. I only ran them at the same time once. As you can imagine, the balance of volume was off since both cabs were getting the same wattage, but it wasn't awful by any means. However, it was so loud that I really couldn't effectively get my tone without making everyone deaf. That said, I consider a better option than adding the 115.

    Personally, I used the 210 for smaller gigs and the 410 for the bigger ones, but most often just used the 410 since it had casters and made it much easier to move. Those cabs aren't exactly featherweights.
  11. BassmanPaul

    BassmanPaul Gold Supporting Member

    Aug 25, 2007
    Toronto Ontario Canada
    Damn! I've opined in a Zombie thread again!!!! :crying:
  12. Neuroman

    Neuroman BHPD - Forget about me. Save yourselves! Supporting Member

    Oct 17, 2013
    Sunol, CA
    Sorry to disappoint you Paul. Just sharing my opinion based upon my experience.
  13. Neuroman

    Neuroman BHPD - Forget about me. Save yourselves! Supporting Member

    Oct 17, 2013
    Sunol, CA
    It is a zombie as originally formed, but this issue pops up in searches all the time so it is worth putting our two cents in to help people out dealing with the issue contemporaneously with their search.
  14. Neuroman

    Neuroman BHPD - Forget about me. Save yourselves! Supporting Member

    Oct 17, 2013
    Sunol, CA
    I hadn't realized that actual experience using the two stack configurations in gigs and side by side comparisons with same settings in my garage constituted "myth" and "misconception" on TB. I guess my ears deceived me and I should have just consulted with Paul to tell me what I was hearing.

    I'll try to do better next time.:meh:
  15. CL400Peavey

    CL400Peavey Supporting Member

    Nov 7, 2011
    Grand Rapids Michigan
    Not that I disagree with Paul, but I think you are taking this a little too personal.
  16. +1 Question to anyone's personal experience is have you played matching cabs, two 115's and two 410's so you have a comparison to the "mixed" combo? 2nd question; How much of the "better" is getting the more low end heavy 410 off the floor coupling and closer to your ears than your knees?
  17. BassmanPaul

    BassmanPaul Gold Supporting Member

    Aug 25, 2007
    Toronto Ontario Canada
    You're new here so I'll reply to you with courtesy.

    You have to realize that this subject comes up every few days. Many of us are tired of trying to defeat this popular but poor pairing. If you care to, do the same search as I advised the OP to do. It is covered in great depth.

    There is nothing wrong with experience. It is, after all, how we all learned when starting out. Just like most of us, I started out making it up as I went along. i did learn a lot but stuff began to gel when I went to Engineer school. Since then I've learned a lot more. My experience covers fifty years of Bass aPlayin' and around forty as an Engineer. Gawd! That's seems like a loooong time - even to me. :(

    May I wish you well and if you like what a 4x10 + 1x15 does for you more power to you. Just keep an eye/ear on the 15. It will always be a weak link in your system
  18. Ajapses

    Ajapses Supporting Member

    Sep 28, 2013
    Cleveland, TN
    Can't figure out Madden football
    I very much appreciate the level of technical knowledge of some of the participants - which makes sense with most bass players having the middle name "Anal". But we should try to keep a little perspective.

    Being one of the old dudes, I come from a time Ozzy was a kid, Led Zeppelin was a warmup for Grand Funk Railroad, and Hendrix was alive. We didn't make the music of our parents and so much the better if it was extra obnoxious. We pushed under sized amps and small cabs over the limit, even just for practice. The music wasn't always pretty, but it was our music. And we played it with attitude. I for one remember those days as some of the best.

    Today,I have the exact stack in question. If I should be so lucky to play a gig where it's maxed out, here's hoping that 15" explodes in flames. Now that would be a story to tell the grand kids
  19. Neuroman

    Neuroman BHPD - Forget about me. Save yourselves! Supporting Member

    Oct 17, 2013
    Sunol, CA
    I have two 410's but only one 115 so I have only done half of what you are asking. I never even thought of doing two 115's. I wonder what that would sound like. Have you tried it?

    As far as the placement, that is always a challenge for me. I think I have a great tone, then I use my 30 ft cable so I can walk out in front of the stage a bit and it sounds completely different and not nearly as defined. Generally, the bigger the venue and louder I have to play, the two 410's is better. The smaller stuff, I like the sound with the 115 on bottom but, in truth, I don't need it. I just like how it seems to smooth the growl.

    I have always done the side by side comparing in my garage which does not provide a very good venue effect but at least both set ups are in the same conditions. Not really sure about your last question because in both setups I have a 410 on the top. So, the 410 is always up at ear level. It is whether another 410 is at the knees or a 115. I am going to try it with the 115 on top and see. Perhaps I may not like it as much.

    At the end of day the key is that you do get a different tone with each setup and one seems better at higher volumes (the two 410's)and the other at lower (the 410 and 115). At that point it is not about engineering, rather, it is about tone. I don't care about the engineering when I get what I want from the amp and cabs in terms of tone. The volumes I would have to be cranking for the engineering limits to be tested on these cabs just doesn't happen.

    Thanks for the questions. You have given me food for thought and something else to try.
  20. slade


    Apr 5, 2001
    ignore the engineers and mathematicians- if you dig it go for it. Me, I have matching cabs- but I've heard incredible players sound great with mixed cabs. I say go for it, especially now knowing that it's not as fail safe as just buying two matching cabs. Risk is fun- life is short.