Truss rod length with pics

Discussion in 'Luthier's Corner' started by bobdabilder, Nov 19, 2020.

  1. Building a 6 string to replace my 6 string. Truss rod is 24 inch. Neck will be 35 scale 24 fret which leaves a little over 2.5 inches from end of truss rod to end of neck. I can't find any 25 inch truss rods that are not custom (if you do, let me know) Question is: is this too much dead space with this layup or will it be strong enough? Do I put carbon fiber in the heel as well? Discuss away.
    Edit: maple, bloodwood, wenge.
    Thanks all. neck.jpg neck2.jpg
     
    Beej likes this.
  2. Arie X

    Arie X

    Oct 19, 2015
    it'll be fine. the tr is more of an regulator of the middle of the neck relief rather than a stiffener. depending upon where the fretboard ends, you could possibly swap ends and adjust from the body -ala MM instead of the head stock if you wanted. trouble with too stiff a neck imo/ime is that they are harder to adjust and feel like rocks.
     
    bobdabilder likes this.
  3. GMC

    GMC Supporting Member

    Jan 1, 2006
    Wiltshire, UK
    You have a 7 piece laminated neck that includes wenge...it will be more than stiff enough. You don’t want to make the neck over stiff and strangle the tone.
     
    bobdabilder likes this.
  4. rwkeating

    rwkeating

    Oct 1, 2014
    Chicago
    none
    If I am remembering correctly ... I've read here that LMI (Luthiers Mercantile Exchange) does custom length versions of their truss rods at no extra charge. Might be worth contacting them to see if that is true ... and then please report back here :thumbsup:
     
    Gilmourisgod likes this.
  5. They do, but price of admission is high.
     
    rwkeating likes this.
  6. Beej

    Beej

    Feb 10, 2007
    Vancouver Island
    Well, if 40 bucks is high. :smug:
     
  7. rudy4444

    rudy4444

    Mar 13, 2012
    Central Illinois
    The other popular option ends up being higher than that if you factor in the need for the specialty router bit that's very difficult to source other than StewMac and the shipping charge. Those two items add $27 to the cost of a single rod.

    Most of us probably already own the specialty router bit, so it's really only $10 difference, about the cost of the shipping charge. It is cool that LMI makes them any length you want if you're willing to wait an extra couple weeks to get them.

    I do like the Stew Mac Hot Rod but it would make so much sense if they manufactured them to fit a standard 1/4" slot. If they made them that way then you also have no need of a larger area for the adjustment end.

    I've been using the LMI rods because you can install them in a through routed channel so they are easily removable and/or replaceable in the future. We all know what dealing with a broken truss rod entails. :)
     
  8. dwizum

    dwizum

    Dec 21, 2018
    I'm assuming this is a bolt on neck. Where do the bolts land relative to the end of the truss rod?
     
  9. Bolts will miss the tr ;)
    Neck pocket length will be about 4.5 inches. I may do a build thread on this one.
     
  10. I've been using bbg trussrods. 20 bucks. 24 inches long. 1/4 inch and 3/8 bit gets it done. Also removable if planned properly. Not wanting to go custom hence its in the op. Agree with you on stew mac.
     
  11. rwkeating

    rwkeating

    Oct 1, 2014
    Chicago
    none
    I had the grand idea of going to the source :)
    Truss rod single action, custom length
    Looks like it is under $20 for a custom length for this type of truss rod. It say it is only single action though so depending on your needs ... there ya go.
     
  12. dwizum

    dwizum

    Dec 21, 2018
    Do a thread!

    Sounds like the end of the truss rod will be past the neck pocket anyways, so I really can't see how there would be any difference. For a bolt on neck I just generally aim for having the truss rod past the first bolts, I figure there's really no point in having truss rod through the bolted-down portion of the neck.
     
  13. Will do. Thanks for input.
     
  14. Will measure my routs. That rod needs 1/2 inch depth for the anchor. Thanks for looking it up.
     
    rwkeating likes this.
  15. MotorCityMinion

    MotorCityMinion

    Jun 15, 2017
    It's an interesting concept, something I've never considered or noticed though as a casual player. I have Modulus Graphite Bassstar Neck, bolt on, with no trussrod, a neck thru multi laminated P-bass, and owned 3 previous neck thru basses and have never noticed a strangled tone. Not saying it's not a thing. Now I've have something else to think about. I've always gravitated towards a solid build, perhaps a little heavier than what modern players want, the stiffer the better, and listen/look for note clarity when unplugged.
     
  16. Arie X

    Arie X

    Oct 19, 2015
    i certainly do like a T-rod. it's purpose it to like Gibson used to say in the past, "regulate the instrument". Having a rod gives you much finer control over relief vs. pesky humidity and environmental variables. Without one and confronted with the possibility of making a substantial adjustment, i hardly think that working the frets or pulling the frets and planing the board is the way to go. Now one might say "i have 3 meters of CF in my neck and 2 meters of Titanium and no truss rod and everything is ok" that may be true, but wood moves no matter what, and you might not notice and that's ok, but for those that do notice, a t-rod is an invaluable item to have imo.
     
    Beej likes this.
  17. Arie X

    Arie X

    Oct 19, 2015
    i rarely ever say a bad word about SM, but those shenanigans with the "custom" router bit are indicative of either thoughtless rod design, or vendor lock-in, or both. it's not even a normal metric equivalent either. yeah, you can source a 7/32" bit and "bump" the slot wider, but that's more work and has potential risk.
     
    Beej and rwkeating like this.
  18. Beej

    Beej

    Feb 10, 2007
    Vancouver Island
    I can't imagine its anything other than pure profiteering. :angel:
     
    rwkeating and bobdabilder like this.
  19. rudy4444

    rudy4444

    Mar 13, 2012
    Central Illinois
    All true, but the reason I like the single 1/4" channel route, other than the simplicity, is that there is no need to remove any more material than absolutely necessary. Any widening of the truss rod area at the headstock end further weakens an area already susceptible to accidental fractures and breakage.

    The LMI rods are the only rods that I know of that don't require a larger pocket for the adjustment end. It is necessary to check them to make sure the welds don't protrude. It's usually necessary to file the welds down a bit to make sure they are flat. For what they cost I'd like to see them not require this, but it is what it is. :D

    Here's an example of a recent slot head build I did to show the 1/4" channel and truss rod being "installed". In this case you can see there just isn't a lot of room to widen the truss channel to use another type of rod. I'm glad LMI makes them available and the extra few bucks is worth it to me.

    wyLgH7C.jpg
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2020
  20. thisSNsucks

    thisSNsucks I build Grosbeak Guitars and Basses Supporting Member Commercial User

    Dec 19, 2004
    Yonkers, NY
    Grosbeak Guitars
    Truss rods. Yeah that length should be ok.

    I could go on for a while about truss rods but do a little digging.

    StewMac low profile rods are VERY similar if not the exact same as some of the rods you can find on Bitterrootguitars.com. We're talking red VS blue tubing being the only real visible difference.
    Bitterroot also sells rods that are VERY similar if not the exact same as some of the rods available at BestBassGear.com.
    I believe all those rods are supplied from the same manufacturer, probably Korean made.
    I have not had any issues with any of those rods.

    You can check the TDPRI forum for reviews on the bitterroot rods, they get high praise.

    The Stewmac Hot rod seems to be their own design but I have seen some offshore sellers on eBay with similar offerings, who knows if they're knock offs or if thats their actual supplier. I have had one Hot Rod come to me with the welded adjustment nut already broken off, and often the rods from stewmac come in rusty, I usually clean them up with my Dremel and a buffing wheel.

    WD music also sells rods that are identical to one of the versions on Bitterroot. I myself have used the ones from WD music and have had zero issues. Theres a boutique guitar builder in NYC who's using them on +$2k builds, so they're solid.

    LMI sells basically the identical dual action truss rod in design to what wd and bitterroot have but those are made in Japan and are high quality as well.

    The most boutique rods of them all are the ones from Allied Lutherie. They have a few different styles and are all USA made as far as I know.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2020