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two ampeg 810 horizontal stack question

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Greenman, Apr 26, 2009.


  1. Greenman

    Greenman

    Dec 17, 2005
    Ontario Canada
    I heard ampeg 810 cabs have individual chambers horizontally for two drivers. Would stacking them horizontal be beneficial?

    Just curious as I have seen more and more using for backline.
     
  2. BurningSkies

    BurningSkies CRAZY BALDHEAD Supporting Member

    Feb 20, 2005
    Seweracuse, NY
    No. Horizontal speakers are bad. Do a quick search for the term comb filtering. It's why linear arrays work best. You've already got two by two pairs in an 8x10, so you've already got a bit of a fight happening.
     
  3. Kings Of leon stack the 2 8x10's like this... they sound good enough to me! Loads of people are doing it at the moment.
    Not just cos it looks cool?
     
  4. distrot

    distrot

    Mar 26, 2007
    i've done it both ways and I just prefer side by side....for tone alone
     
  5. Gearhead17

    Gearhead17 Supporting Member

    May 4, 2006
    Roselle, IL
    Regardless of how a band stacks them on stage, you have no way to figure out if the sound from the bass player is the result of what you see on stage. There very well could be a different rig off stage and the cabinets are stacked horizontal for the "coolness of it". Many times those large 810's on stage stacked uniquely are not even on. With the cab stacked horizontal, there are more speakers hitting the floor and you will get more coupling of frequencies below 100hz. I don't think it will be favorable and the midrange frequencies that used to be hitting your ears are going to be hitting the floor and/or shooting at your kness - good luck on hearing your self well.

    Try it! See what happens. If it sucks, just put them side by side and rock on! I don't know what you need two 810e's for....but have fun!
     
  6. iplaybasstexas

    iplaybasstexas

    Apr 5, 2008
    DFW
    vertical cab alignment allows for a better dispertion of sound also.
     
  7. JimmyM

    JimmyM

    Apr 11, 2005
    Apopka, FL
    Endorsing: Ampeg Amps, EMG Pickups
    There probably is no appreciable difference between putting two SVT cabs side by side and stacking them horizontally. And you can't really stack them vertically without rigging, so if you use two, I'd say it doesn't matter. As for whether you need two or not, that's for each player to decide. I wouldn't go telling the Kings of Leon's bassist that he's screwing his sound by using two ;)

    But it certainly matters if you use one. Always vertical, never horizontal is my rule.
     
  8. rbonner

    rbonner

    Sep 25, 2008
    Comb filtering... Super large PA arrays suffer from this effect. VERY LARGE MID AND HIGH FREQUENCY ARRAYS

    In my opinion it is total BS you'd suffer much from it with an AMPEG 810 whether horizontal or vertical. NOBODY from the beginning of rock stacks has complained of comb filtering with bass rigs and big guitar stacks have been doing it for decades.

    The PRO's on here say, Bob you don't know what you are talking about. Patooie. I have stacked the 810 and 215 in different layouts and they all make a massive blast.

    Now OK yes the 810 has 4 horizontal 2 X 10 enclosures. If you stand two 810's next to each other you approximately have 4 boxes high and two boxes wide making about a 4 X 4 foot speaker mass.

    If you lay the speakers over. Which is a real PITA to stack up BTW. You have 4 boxes wide and two boxes high. Making a 4 X 4 foot speaker mass. I haven't noticed a bit of difference. I agree with Jimmy about not laying a single 810 on its side.

    I tried stacking the cabs three high and two wide and had a really scary setup. Played it and it sounded loud.

    I now have my cabs lined up across wise now. 4 feet high and 6 cabs wide with the two 215's in the center. I feel a lot safer without having any scaffolding and the rig sounds the same.

    I wouldn't worry my pretty little head about comb filtering in a bass rig. Especially just two cabs. These guys saying its better to stand your 2 X 10 vertical than horizontal, yes I agree but you are looking at 2 speakers. With a pair of 810's you have 16. There's a huge difference in rig there and its like comparing a YUGO with an EXCURSION.

    I'll be very happy when the COMB FILTERING rumor dies right next to the BASS IS 30 FEET OUT...

    Oh and yes the big bands use monitors on the side for their guitar techs as big speaker arrays are directional. That's why you get the seats out front.

    BOB
     
  9. *begins slow clap*

    +10000000


    For years, and years, and years... so many great tones have come from what people are now considering to be "improper" speaker set ups. I just don't buy it at all. Or at least, I don't buy that it's as big as a deal as some people make it out to be. My setup should sound absolutely horrible according to some, a 6-6 1/2 foot wide, 4-4 1/2 foot tall wall of speakers... I hear some changes in the sound when moving side to side in front of my rig, but nothing serious, certainly nothing any different than the sound change you get when you move around in front of a single speaker. And once you get farther away where the crowd will be, it doesn't matter at all.


    To the OP. I say if it sounds good... do it... if it sounds bad, change something. Just please don't let all this overblown talk about comb filtering stop you from TRYING a speaker setup. And anyways, I can't imagine that two 8x10's stacked on their sides would sound any different than if they are standing next to each other. Now, a single 8x10 on it's side, as others have said, would more than likely sound terrible.
     
  10. MotorTed

    MotorTed

    Apr 16, 2006
    CT, USA
     
  11. rbonner

    rbonner

    Sep 25, 2008
    I just read through that other topic, I was taking a break from TB during the time that was going on.

    I'm sure Bill will come along and lay down the same diatribe he did with the other thread. I just don't think it makes a hill of beans difference with Bass Guitar with under one thousand 10" speakers. :D

    SEMPER AMPLIO,
    BOB
     
  12. dannster

    dannster

    Aug 20, 2000
    Seattle,WA
    I've layed my cabs on their side over the years and never heard anyone EVER call me out on my "array" being wrong. It just isn't that big a deal.
    Just like putting a cab upside down will not break the speakers.

    Its only when you get to sound reinforcement in really big venues that this thinking needs to be addressed. imho.
     
  13. billfitzmaurice

    billfitzmaurice Commercial User

    Sep 15, 2004
    New Hampshire
    Owner, Bill Fitzmaurice Loudspeaker Design
    Two stacked horizontal or two side by side will give identical results. If you're thinking of laying one cab down horizontally rather than upright the midrange dispersion angle will be halved.
    That's because 99.9% of them have no clue what comb filtering is, let alone what causes it. But even the most technically ignorant guitar'd players know what beaming is, because they hear it every time they move two feet to either side of their cab. What they don't know is what causes it; if they did side by side drivers would be gone faster than you can say 'vertical array of tens'.
     
  14. JimmyM

    JimmyM

    Apr 11, 2005
    Apopka, FL
    Endorsing: Ampeg Amps, EMG Pickups
    Well, if you're happy with your rig as it is, rock it. If you're running into the PA, it's definitely more important that the PA be acoustically sound than your rig. But you see a lot of people complaining that they're not getting what they want out of their rigs, and the physics of audio reproduction don't magically change just because it's your special happenin' rig. So if you're not getting what you want, you can use those laws of audio physics to correct potential deficiencies.

    Or not. I use an SVT cab, which is definitely not the definition of "correct audio reproduction," but it works for me because I'm not all that concerned about highs being prominent. But if you have an SVT cab and you're not happy with the low amount of high end you're getting, you'll have a better idea of what to look for in your next cab. Or if you have non matching cabs and you have trouble hearing certain notes, you'll know that you may have a phasing problem, or things of that nature.

    Doesn't mean you have to give up your favorite gear, or play out of a 3-way cab, or have a "sterile sound." To me, learning about audio being done right means knowing how to get MY sound as efficiently as I can. I'm not seeing the downside when you look at it that way.
     

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