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Two lessons learned and two questions

Discussion in 'Off Topic [BG]' started by kegbarnacle, Dec 4, 2005.


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  1. kegbarnacle

    kegbarnacle

    Nov 18, 2003
    Phoenix
    Last friday at about 10:41 am my house was broken into. I know the time because they pushed the scan button on my scanner, which scanned a blank page and stored the time.

    It could have been a lot worse. They only stole my (non 360) xbox, three basses, an old digital camera, some other stuff. They didn't vandalize or break anything. They didn't clean me out.

    Of the basses, they took a Ibanez soundgear that was my first bass. It really had only sentimental value. They took a Galveston 12 string that I got used for practically nothing. The only one that pisses me off was a Zolla bass. Don't know much about the brand, I got it at a guitar show for $400. It was a sweet bass though.

    They left my Spector euro, Warwick Corvette, Alembic F1-X, Fender Jazz, and a frankenbass I totally rebuilt.

    They left a scooter at my place. Judging by what they stole, and the scooter, I'm guessing they're about 15 years old.

    The lessons: I should have taken down the serial #'s. Been saying that for a long time. Lesson #2: I have to give credit to the police. The cop was there taking prints until about 2:30 am. We got a lot of prints. I cynically assumed that they wouldn't even come out, I'd just file a report on the phone, and that would be that. Great guy.

    The questions: I have an self storage unit I rent that I could store my remaining basses in until I get an alarm installed. I'll be working from home most of the week in case Larry, Moe, and Curly come back for seconds, but I probably won't be there the whole time. I'd rather have my basses in the storage unit for a week or so, but it's not temperature controlled - I live in phoenix. The lows will probably be 40 degrees, the highs probably about 73. Will that be bad for basses?

    Second question: I know the law says it's acceptable to defend yourself, house, etc, from an intruder. If the person is in fact a minor, can I legally shoot this person (people) if they do come back for seconds? They probably won't, but if they do, they're not going to be leaving quite as happy.
     
  2. i *think* Arizona has a "Make My Day" law...Which means if somebody is breaking into your house, you have a right to shoot them. If they're 10 year old kids, that would be problematic, but if they are older teenagers, IMHO you have every right to defend yourself.
     
  3. Masher88

    Masher88 Believe in absurdities and you commit atrocities

    May 7, 2005
    Cleveland, OH
    I think you can only shoot them if they are posing an immenent threat to you or your family, but I wouldn't blame you if you do happen to be "cleaning" your gun and it "goes off accidentally" in the direction of some punk stealing your bass! I'm usually a pretty left wing guy, but if someone has the nuts to come into my house and take my stuff...I really don't think the law should punish me for defending the things I work hard for. I do think you can beat the kids senseless and you won't get in trouble from Johnny Law. As long as they don't die! I'm no lawyer, though. These days a criminal could probably win an assault caseagainst you if you bust him up while he breaks into you place. Lawyers are messed up.
     
  4. As for defending your home in such a situation, assuming that these are 15-year kids, I wouldn't count on them necesarily being armed/dangerous if you're worried about them coming back. If this is the case,and you catch them in the act, chances are that catching them alone will be enough to get them to run away and (probably) not come back. If not or if they're armed, I doubt they'd stick around or come back later if you make it clear that you have a loaded firearm. (no need to fire.)

    Disclaimer: I've never been in your situation, and am talking out of my arse.
     
  5. kegbarnacle

    kegbarnacle

    Nov 18, 2003
    Phoenix
    Well, I'm not usually a violent person. But steal my basses and it's a different story.

    I think that's a fairly remote possibility anyhow.

    I'm more concerned about storing basses at 40-75 degree variations.

    thanks
     
  6. If you do shoot, shoot to kill. I don't say this to be heartless or to sound crazy, but it's going to be a much, much bigger deal if they walk away with a gunshot wound. You're likely to end up in court with a lawsuit or criminal charges pressed against you, even if they're the ones breaking in, if you don't kill them. Other things that might seem obvious are important: Don't shoot them in the back, if they're running away, etc. At that point you'll get charged with murder (unless they're armed?- the laws get so complicated)


    What people have said is right, though. The threat of a loaded firearm has in my family's experience been capable of chasing off undesirables on more than one occasion. Only once did it actually need to be brandished.
     
  7. Aaron Saunders

    Aaron Saunders

    Apr 27, 2002
    Ontario
    You could play it safe and load your gun(s) with rock salt. Won't kill 'em, but it'll hurt like nothing else...and they won't be going anywhere for a little while after that.
     
  8. Munjibunga

    Munjibunga Total Hyper-Elite Member Gold Supporting Member

    May 6, 2000
    San Diego (when not at Groom Lake)
    Independent Contractor to Bass San Diego
    In California, if someone breaks and enters your house while you are there, you can assume your life is in danger and shoot them. But, as others have indicated, if they turn out to be kids, you're going to be in a mess, particularly with the ensuing civil case against you.
     
  9. basspunk2005

    basspunk2005

    Jan 31, 2005
    England UK
    sorry to hear about that mate, I wouldnt know about the shooting etc all I know if in England you touch the burgluar chances are youll get done for assult. What to do is take the registration plate and codes from the scooter they left(assuming it has a number plate) and send that to the police. Also if they havnt allready check those for prints
     
  10. mikemulcahy

    mikemulcahy

    Jun 13, 2000
    The Abyss
    Get a big dog.


    Mike
     
  11. MJ5150

    MJ5150 Terrific Twister

    Apr 12, 2001
    Lacey, WA
    Three basses worth maybe $700 total, and that provokes you into the thought of killing people? Yikes!!

    :scowl:

    -Mike
     
  12. All I can say is you're really lucky that they took only some lower-value basses. I'd hate to have lost the Alembic. Be careful and protect your home. Also, make sure you can identify all of your basses using a serial number or something similar.
     
  13. syciprider

    syciprider Banned

    May 27, 2005
    Inland Empire
    Not necessarily true Munji. There has to exist a situation that any reasonable person can believe is threatening his life/safety/loved ones. If say you were lying in bed at night and the burglar is in the den taking your TV and making no attempt to enter your room, you could be held criminally liable if you went down there to confront and shoot him. My B&E plan is to stay in my bedroom, put my wife behind cover with her 357, call the cops, point my double barrelled 12 gauge at the door and wait.

    For Keg the Arizona guy, check your state laws on deadly force. Also, remember that while you could be cleared of any criminal charges after a "good shoot", the subsequent lawsuit by the survivors of those "angels" you blew away can ruin you.
     
  14. simpy1

    simpy1

    Mar 31, 2005
    New Zealand
    You're insane. You think someone taking some of your stuff is worth their death? Maybe it is a rational idea to find the root of the problem, rather than just shooting kids. No one bothers to find out why people are stealing in the first place (usually out of necessity), instead they just say "I need a .50 cal semi-auto to 'defend my family'...". Well that's ridiculous.

    It is downright SHAMEFUL that people are more worried about the legal implications of shooting teenagers than the actual process of KILLING SOMEONE over some material possessions.
     
  15. It's a bad idea to shoot them in the back.

    That's all I have to say.
     
  16. syciprider

    syciprider Banned

    May 27, 2005
    Inland Empire
    He's not advocating shooting kids. He's just saying, "If you shoot... then..."

    If you moved to SE L.A. or East San Diego and walk around there at night you will get ample opportunities to rationalize criminals. Let us know what you find out.
     
  17. AuG

    AuG

    May 22, 2005
    Fort Collins, CO
    Use rubber bullets. Maybe a bean bag round? Some type of non lethal (or maybe less lethal) defense?

    I'm surprised people even commit crimes in AZ anyway....what's the gun : people ration down there now? Oh and I know I'll probably take some flak for this too, so before you get all worked up please don't consider me to be a ruthless person for suggesting to leave a nice bruise rather than a hole in somebody. Hopefully whoever broke into kegs house would learn their lesson if an ounce bean bag hit 'em in the ass.

    jmo

    Aug
     
  18. Masher88

    Masher88 Believe in absurdities and you commit atrocities

    May 7, 2005
    Cleveland, OH
    It's not the dollar amount or even what they stole...it's the fact that now he's afraid to be in his own house. That feeling of safety and security in ones own home is priceless and will take a very long time to get back. i totally understand his feelings of being violated and wanting to take drastic measures. Those kids are just doing a little breaking and entering now...soon they go for grand theft auto or holding up stores...then they commit murder or something else. As you can see, I have no patience for criminals. I have to obey the law...so should everyone else!
     
  19. temp5897

    temp5897 Guest

    People come in and steal tvs and gear out of necessity? Sounds to me like you're a college boy right now, and a rather impressionable one at that. Or maybe not. "New Zealand" and all....still rather silly.
     
  20. That is absolutely NOT crazy, that's the only way to shoot.

    Don't shoot at someone unless you need and intend to kill them. Then always shoot to kill, center of mass in the head or chest. Its hard enough to hit what you're aiming at without aiming for little things.

    Say you're not justified in killing them, so you decide to try to wound them instead, miss and kill them by mistake, you're in a world of crap. And you've killed someone for no good reason.

    The safest way to go is don't kill someone unless your life is in danger. Kind of the moral thing to do also. Killing someone for simply taking your stuff out the front door can land you in jail in some states. So unless you're sure you're in one of those "Home is your castle" states, I wouldn't risk it. Hell, I think some states you have an obligation to try to avoid the robbers. You're supposed to flee, not confront them. Not sure the cops would be too interested in pressing the issue with an older bad guy, but kids?

    Randy
     



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