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Using Bergie HT+EX...need something bigger?

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by CaptainWally, Jan 23, 2006.


  1. CaptainWally

    CaptainWally Supporting Member

    Oct 21, 2000
    Sandy Eggo, CA
    Greetings,

    I'm currently using an Ashdown ABM500 with the Bergie HT+EX stack. Great setup. I've been playing small to medium venues, and this rig is great for that application. However, we have some larger clubs coming up, and I'm wondering if I need more horsepower for those dates. I'm concerned because I'm running my Ashdown at ~60% in medium clubs, so that doesn't leave much headroom.

    For those in the Bay area: the rig worked well at the Rio and Edinburgh Castle...the Popscene required PA support. We're playing the Blank Club in San Jose next weekend and I'm not sure what I'll need there.

    I still have an SWR Gol Jr that I can pair with a Bergie and that should give me more volume, but the tone is probably not as sweet. I'm considering going with a stand alone, but it needs to be something I can fit in a sedan (no hatchback). I'm not super worried about weight since most of the time I'll be able to just use the little stack.

    I'd love to get a 322 or an NV610, though I've never heard the latter.

    Anyway, just looking for general thoughts and opinions. Poon, if you're out there -- you'd be a good source of opinion on this one since you're local.
     
  2. SCT1422

    SCT1422 Supporting Member

    I went from your current setup to using the new HT-210S and EX-112S cabs which I'm loving.... Very similar to the HT-322 which they are a modular version of... I think your setup will be find in the bigger rooms with PA support.. You may want to call Jim though... Steve..
     
  3. GRoberts

    GRoberts Supporting Member

    Jan 7, 2003
    Tucson, AZ USA
    CaptWally - As you may recall, I own an Ashdown ABM500 and a Bergie HT/EX 112 Mini-stack. (My main gig rig 99% of the time) I also own a Bergantino HT322. Bottom line for me was that when I needed a bigger sound that was fuller and fatter, I discovered the Mini-Bergs were just a bit too tight and focused. The HT322 gets the nod for my outdoor gigs where I need more fullness and depth. The HT322 blosoms in alrge venues more than the pair of baby Berg 112's. Not to dimish how amazing those Mini-Bergs are. They impress me gig after gig. But there are situations where they just don't move enough air.

    It's not that I run out of power or headroom with the Mini-Bergie HT/EX stack, it's that in larger venue's and outdoors, the mini Berg's are more directional sounding and they don't blossom as well as the HT322. The same amp head (Ashdown ABM500) with the Bergie HT322 is a match made in heaven in my personal experience. It kicks major booty. No headroom problems at stupid loud volume either. I used this rig on a large stage at our fairgrounds last spring and I had it louder than ever, but it never broke a sweat and never clipped that I could hear. I've used the Ashdown ABM500 with bergie HT322 in a classic rock band, Jazz, Blues, Funk, R&B, you name it. It sounds great (loud). the Mioni Bergs sound better in intimate settings and close up. The HT322 doesn't sound it's best until I hit a certain volume level and then it just Smokes! (That's a good *smokes* by the way!) Hope that helps.
    Gary

     
  4. winston

    winston Supporting Member

    May 2, 2000
    Berkeley, CA
    Captain Wally--you might want to make a trip up to Basses-Electric & Acoustic in Sacramento. http://www.basses-electric-acoustic.com/pages/1/index.htm

    Last time I was there a few weeks ago Juan had an NV610, HT322 and the HT210S/HT112S...plus the luscious new IP series and a bunch of Aguilar and Schroeder suff (among others).
     
  5. CaptainWally

    CaptainWally Supporting Member

    Oct 21, 2000
    Sandy Eggo, CA
    Hey guys,

    Thanks for the replies. I definitely needed PA support big time on Saturday's gig. That's fine, but it continues to raise questions about the volume capabilities of the Bergie mini-stack.

    The 210S+112S are interesting. A couple of concerns: They look a bit inefficient, esp. the 112. Does the Ashdown x500 have enough power to drive them? Does the 11" depth bug you when trying to stack w/ your amp on top? I'm pretty sure this pair would out of my budget (~$1300?), though I bet they are sweet.

    Roscoe5, you've got me hooked on the idea of a 322, but the nv-610 sounds tempting too. Just the usual concerns about size and weight since I just have a small sedan.

    I should check out that shop in Sacramento. Just can't seem to find a free day to make the trip. And I'm afraid what I might do with my wallet in a place like that ;-)

    I can't see myself doing the IP cabinets since I already own an amp I like and I'm sure that stuff is (justifiably) expensive.

    Maybe I can hope I'll always have PA support in cases where the BMS won't cut the mustard.
     
  6. GRoberts

    GRoberts Supporting Member

    Jan 7, 2003
    Tucson, AZ USA
    FWIW - I compared a 322 to a 610 and preferred the depth and bigger sound of the 322. I also liked the sparkle of the tweeter which can be turned off. the IP cabs are very expensive, and as you mentioned, most likely worth it. But with the IP Series, you might still want to use a preamp. Gary
     
  7. jokerjkny

    jokerjkny

    Jan 19, 2002
    NY / NJ / PA
    425 and be dont with it. use the pair for smaller shows, and pull out big wally when you need the guns of navarone.
     
  8. SCT1422

    SCT1422 Supporting Member

    The HT's 210S and 112S do a great job and should be loud enough.. There basically a smaller version of the 322... The 11" depth is not a problem at all and I have plenty of headroom for most gigs.. I've also been thinking of checking out the 425 as well or I may get another 322... For the gig I do know my current setup is fine... Steve..
     
  9. Wally
    I haven't had my NV215 very long but it truly reminds me of a Berg mini Stack (BMS) on a bigger/louder/deeper scale for sure, with way more projection. Sounds great with a DB750 too.
     
  10. CaptainWally

    CaptainWally Supporting Member

    Oct 21, 2000
    Sandy Eggo, CA
    Cheers, guys.

    I'd love to do the NV thing, but I don't have a station wagon or an SUV.

    I doubt those would fit in a midsize sedan would they? I think there is a slight chance I could get a 322 in the front seat of a car, no?

    Also, can you still get the NV215 and 425? Thought they were gone.
     
  11. tombowlus

    tombowlus If it sounds good, it is good Gold Supporting Member

    Apr 3, 2003
    North central Ohio
    Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
    You've got a number of great options:

    HT210S/EX112S (HT322 in two smaller boxes)
    HT112S/EX112S (bigger sounding version of Mini Stack)
    HT210/HT115 (both discontinued, but awesome cabs)
    HT322 (awesome, balanced sound; blooms a bit more than Mini Stack)
    NV610 (punch/cut city!)
    NV215 (very tight, low, deep, more high end for NV line)
    NV425 (most of 215 lows, most of 610's punch)
    IP112/EX112 (notably louder than Mini Stack with your amp, and tone like you've never heard)
    IP212 (more of the same; awesome for fingerstyle)
    IP310 (see above; great for slap/pop)

    I think that the biggest eye opener of the bunch might be the IP112/EX112 compared to the HT112/EX112, but any of the above would serve you well, IMHO.

    Tom.
     
  12. tombowlus

    tombowlus If it sounds good, it is good Gold Supporting Member

    Apr 3, 2003
    North central Ohio
    Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
    They are no longer offered, but there might be a few more out there somewhere.

    Tom.
     
  13. SteveC

    SteveC Supporting Member

    Nov 12, 2004
    North Dakota
    If you are going through a PA the stage rig is just for monitor needs. If the two Bergies aren't enough, your bands stage volume is too loud - IMHO.
     
  14. CaptainWally

    CaptainWally Supporting Member

    Oct 21, 2000
    Sandy Eggo, CA
    Cheers, Tom! Unfortunately, I've got a constraints which discount most of those choices (budget + transportability).

    I agree, but sometimes we are indeed too loud :meh:

    I'm also worried about cases where I'm playing similar venues to what I've been playing and there isn't an oppotunity for PA support. Hopefully, that won't ever be an issue but it's definitely possible.
     
  15. metron

    metron Fluffy does not agree

    Sep 12, 2003
    Lakewood Colorado
    Suprise! I had a Subaru WRX not long ago which is a sub-compact. Small rear door for sure. I was able to fit the NV 610 in the backseat quite easily. And by myself no less. Oddly enough the boxy size of my smaller HT 210/115 cabs made it much more difficult to get them into the backseat. I would definitely not have been able to fit the 322 where the NV 610 did.
     
  16. CaptainWally

    CaptainWally Supporting Member

    Oct 21, 2000
    Sandy Eggo, CA
    Must be the smaller depth of the 610? I need to check out an NV610. Thanks!

    :hyper: :hyper: :hyper: :hyper:

    do you miss the tweeter? i play with a pick sometimes and need some raw high end gank...can i get it out of the NV?
     
  17. metron

    metron Fluffy does not agree

    Sep 12, 2003
    Lakewood Colorado
    Yeah it is the smaller depth. I dont miss the tweeter at all. In fact with tweet cabs I was always cutting lots of treble. I find that without one I can actually boost treble where I see fit. I love playing through the NV with a pick. I like the seamless sound the NV cabs have as opposed to those with passive crossovers. Its more natural sounding to me. Not everyone can do without a tweeter though. Personally I dont really care for much sonic information past 10kHz with bass. Give one a try if you can!
     
  18. tombowlus

    tombowlus If it sounds good, it is good Gold Supporting Member

    Apr 3, 2003
    North central Ohio
    Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
    And keep in mind that if you can find one, the NV215 has a 6" midrange driver that is very smooth and accurate up to 7 kHz. I find that it adds a lot of high end information/clarity relative to the NV610 or NV425.

    Tom.
     
  19. CaptainWally

    CaptainWally Supporting Member

    Oct 21, 2000
    Sandy Eggo, CA
    I don't get it...how could be so much louder? More wattage?
    Is it the same cab? Please PM me ~price if you can for one of those bad boys so I can fall outta my chair ;)
     
  20. tombowlus

    tombowlus If it sounds good, it is good Gold Supporting Member

    Apr 3, 2003
    North central Ohio
    Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
    Well, I don't think it's just a wattage thing, because my WWU has more watts, but the IP amp was still perceivably louder. I was using one of the prototypes to power two HT112's (one of which had its tweeter turned off). It didn't have the "correct" program, but one of the demo programs that Jim and I were checking out was pretty close. So, I A/B'd it against the WWU, and the IP amp seemed a good bit louder and more forceful. Why? Well, first off it was programmed (sort of) to fill in the natural valleys and trim the natural peaks, so right off the bat, it was pushing a very full-sounding, punchy signal, and doing so in a relatively efficient manner (not wasting amp power to fill in the holes, nor overly boosting certain frequencies). The frequency specific compression really helps, too, I think.

    Getting back to the original question of filling up a large stage, I think that part of the reason that the IP setup would do better is due to the fact that its tone will be more full/punchy/balanced, and will have an easier time filling up that space. So, my guess is that it's not just an SPL's thing.

    Keep in mind, this is my opinion only, and in truth, I have not A/B'd an HT112/EX112 to an IP112/EX112 on a large stage and in a live setting. So keep that in mind.

    Tom.