Virtual Dynamics - let's keep this one open, OK?

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Bassflute, Dec 28, 2007.

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  1. Bassflute


    Jun 24, 2006
    Endorsing Artist: MTD basses and strings; Bergantino Amps & Cabs
    Some people may be interested. I'm lending it to a guitarist with a really high-end boutique system and a 61 'strat' to get his take, then, once all this Christmas stuff is out of the way, I'll send it to Mr. Bowlus et al.

    Let's try and keep this one open, folks. If you don't like talking nicely about high-end cables, please go somewhere else.

  2. Why would you keep opening these threads... this is the third one. Even if there was a slight, subtle impact of a $500 power cord, what's the point? There would be many, many, many things you could spend $500 on that would have MUCH more impact on your sound. Just putting that money toward changing strings a little more often would have a much stronger impact on tone.

    Also, not sure why you would choose Tom Bowlus as a 'verification'. No offense to Tom, but wouldn't it make more sense to send to Fdeck, Figuredbass, or someone with a more EE background that could put it on the scope, etc.? I guess that would be mildly interesting.
  3. bongomania

    bongomania Commercial User

    Oct 17, 2005
    PDX, OR
    owner, OVNIFX and OVNILabs
    +1 to all of that. Tom's a great guy for many reasons, but he's no scientist.
  4. smakbass

    smakbass Smakkin basses for 25 years..

    Aug 6, 2002
    Vancouver Canada
    Id be curious to see what some tests would show too, is there chance that there is a slight voltage drop to the amplifier from normal powercables and that this alters tone?

    I am really clueless about tech specs and that sort of thing but I do know Cam and Peter and trust when they say they hear a difference.
  5. A9X

    A9X Inactive

    Dec 27, 2003
    No. This was covered in the previous thread, and the "potential" for difference would be even less in a lower powered guitar rig.
  6. smakbass

    smakbass Smakkin basses for 25 years..

    Aug 6, 2002
    Vancouver Canada
    Ah ok thanks...
  7. chucko58


    Jan 17, 2002
    Silicon Valley, CA, USA
    I paid for all my gear myself. Well, me and MasterCard.
    Do start another thread when you come up with verifiable physical evidence that these power cords actually work.
  8. Fealach

    Fealach Guest

    Apr 23, 2003
    Gone to a better place

    It's actually easy to verify that they work.

    If the amp comes on, they work. :)
  9. billfitzmaurice

    billfitzmaurice Commercial User

    Sep 15, 2004
    New Hampshire
    Owner, Bill Fitzmaurice Loudspeaker Design
    I think the shilling of snake oil is not appropriate here, and that no further mention of this product either pro or con should be made here save for verifiable double-blind testing of it by a reputable party.
  10. DanielleMuscato


    Jun 19, 2004
    Columbia, Missouri, USA
    Endorsing Artist, Schroeder Cabinets
    heehee :smug:

    In any case, Kelly Lee said the other thread would be unlocked when the reviews are in. I don't think we need two threads about the same topic unless there's something new to discuss - like the aforementioned reviews?...

    In the meantime, remember that Ford engineers said a V8 engine was *impossible* until Henry Ford said, "I don't care; make it work anyway." Theoretical physicists said the way light behaves was *impossible* despite seeing it behave that way, until Einstein came up with a theory that could incorporate both physics and the observed behavior. Splitting an atom was *impossible* until some nuclear physicists figured out how to do it. Landing a man on the moon was *impossible* until JFK announced we were doing it anyway. People laughed at the first solid-body guitars, calling them "planks" and saying they weren't real musical instruments.

    I'm not an engineer, but to the engineers and skeptics etc out there, please refrain from rolling your eyes or saying anything inflammatory unless *you've personally tested the cable and measured no difference.* Some people *have* tried the cable and said there is a positive one, so I'm thinking their opinion is the only valid one at this point, even if it's extremely biased (having just spent $300 on it and really, really wanting it to work).

    Again, I'm not saying that the cables work, or that they don't. As I stated before, and I agree with Bill, I'm not judging or even forming an opinion until 1) I've tried the cable myself or 2) I've heard double-blind sound samples. I'm simply saying, if you have no experience with it (first-hand or with sound samples), you can't reasonably say it doesn't work. It's one thing if you want to say, "Based on my extensive, professional knowledge of engineering, I see no way this could possibly make a difference in tone," but another thing entirely to say, "It is impossible for the power cable to make a difference in tone."

    Hope this helps,
  11. Kindness


    Oct 1, 2003
  12. Why does he keep opening these threads? I think it's pretty obvious that he's a paid shill. Three threads? Wasn't the response to the first two sufficient?

    After reading all of these threads, I believe Dave Muscato is one too. Saying something like "all you engineers and physicists keep your criticisms and rolleyes out of the thread" is ridiculous. I mean, let's not let those pesky laws of physics from stopping the sale of snake oil!

    My ignore list just doubled in size. Banner ads on this site are one thing, but advertising disguised as content is another.
  13. msquared


    Sep 19, 2004
    Kansas City
    You don't need either extensive or professional experience though. The concepts behind why it wouldn't change the tone are taught in first year electrical engineer classes.

    That's like saying you have to be Will Lee to explain why A is a fourth above E. I mean it is so confusing because you have to do that whole going from G to A thing but... come on.
  14. el_Kabong


    Jul 11, 2005
    Eric Johnson?
  15. Munjibunga

    Munjibunga Retired Member

    May 6, 2000
    San Diego (when not at Groom Lake)
    Independent Contractor to Bass San Diego
    Snake oil, indeed.
  16. el_Kabong


    Jul 11, 2005
    I'm not sure why anyone would buy a $500 power cable and then send it around to people for 'verification' and review. Well I guess I can think of one reason.
  17. Jim Dombrowski

    Jim Dombrowski Supporting Member

    Jan 16, 2002
    Colorado Springs, CO
    I've heard the difference that a power cord can make in high-end stereo systems, and a slight difference in my bass amp.

    However, having said that, I would not encourage people to spend any extra money on a power cord for a bass amp, as I don't believe the small difference would be worthwhile (even in a studio situation).

    There have been accusations of people "shilling" these products in these recent threads. I don't believe anyone has tried to convince you that you should buy an expensive cord, and they certainly haven't promoted any particular products, so the accusations are pretty lame. They have merely stated their experiences, and encouraged people to have an open mind.

    In the absence of any measurable quantifiers, here are some links to articles that attempt to explain how a cord could possibly affect the sound of a component.
  18. Jazzdogg

    Jazzdogg Less barking, more wagging!

    Jul 29, 2006
    San Diego, CA
    We should definitely keep this thread open so I can attempt to sell round trip excursions to the sun to those who believe it will be possible as long as all travel occurs at night. :meh:The heck with science, logic, or rationality! :D
  19. grovest


    Feb 26, 2002

    I thought you received unfair responses in your first thread a while back, and I conveyed that sentiment via PM. However, now it seems you are letting anger get the best of you.

    I know I have heard noise through audio equipment when plugging in to one power outlet, and the noise was eliminated when plugged in to another other. This tells me that power sources can affect audio output. In what specific ways or to what extent, I don't know. Probably, many of the people responding to these threads don't really know, either. Which is not to suggest that I think the explanation is unknowable.
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