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Whappo Jr. vs Bergantino HT322

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Folmeister, Oct 14, 2004.


  1. Accugroove Whappo Jr.

    19 vote(s)
    61.3%
  2. Bergantino HT 322

    12 vote(s)
    38.7%
  1. Folmeister

    Folmeister Knowledge is Good - Emile Faber Supporting Member

    May 7, 2003
    Tomball, Texas
    O.k., Kids:
    I am going to have to make a decision here regarding my new cab. I bought a Whappo Jr., and it is nice. But, I am going to look at the Bergantino HT322. I play rock (blues, classic, and original), country, and acoustic music and heard that the Bergantino may suite my sound better. Aside from weight, impedance switch, and price, which cab is your favorite?
     
  2. Is the Whappo Jr. too clean for ya? Also I don't know anything really about AG cabs but the Bergs like a lot of power, the juicy kind like from a Crest CA6 or CA9.
     
  3. Folmeister

    Folmeister Knowledge is Good - Emile Faber Supporting Member

    May 7, 2003
    Tomball, Texas
    You may have hit the nail on the head! I think I was alarmed by its clarity. I went from SWR and Eden to Accugroove. The cab made my amplification really show its colors. I may like a little cab coloration!
     
  4. Whappo Grande

    Whappo Grande

    Feb 9, 2002
    Santa Clara, CA.
    Manager: AccuGroove Speakers
    Use you EQ to dial in any coloration you want. That's the beauty of a clean cab...flexibility.

    Mark
    AccuGroove Pro Speaker Cabs
     
  5. tombowlus

    tombowlus If it sounds good, it is good Gold Supporting Member

    Apr 3, 2003
    North central Ohio
    Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
    I've got to back Mark up, here. With my Whappo, Jr., I can cop about any tone I want. If you want to sound like a 410XLT, then by golly, dial in some low mid hump, and you're mostly there. If you search the archives, I believe Boogiebass recently compared the HT322 to the Whappo, Jr. (spoiler - he preferred the Jr!). But, the HT322 is also a heck of a nice cab. I agree that it needs to be powered with a substantial amp, though. If possible, play them both side by side through the same gear. Be sure to try EQ both cabs. I do think that you will find that Accugroove cabs respond to EQ differently than many cabs do. With no inherent "peaks" or "valleys", you can boost or cut without your tone getting out of control. With my Jr., I like a bit of upper mid and treble boost, and the WJ responds very well without ever getting shrill, sharp, or hissy.

    Good luck, Tom.
     
  6. inazone

    inazone

    Apr 20, 2003
    Colorado
    Thats asssuming that you like the coloration of your bass and amp. There are many reasons to like a bass or amp besides the coloration. All pieces have to work together for an individuals "taste".

    Lets say that a player likes the feel of a bass and the size/wt of a amp but the color of the tone isnt up to par. A flat cab might not be what the player is looking for in their tone, they might need a bit more color to finish it out. Lets say the amp is a eden wt400, no matter how much you turn the bass nob up, its still going to sound like an eden.
     
  7. Whappo Grande

    Whappo Grande

    Feb 9, 2002
    Santa Clara, CA.
    Manager: AccuGroove Speakers
    Absolutely...
    The amp has a "color of the tone", as well as the bass. If a player doesn’t like the color of the tone of either one, they can simply invest in another bass or amp.
    The reason many players do not like the "color of the tone" is because the cabinet adds yet another "color of the tone" to the mix so you are no longer hearing the true sound of your bass & amp.
    If you want to hear the true sound, listen through a pair of high quality headphones. If you get a chance to do this, you'll hear what our cabinets sound like live on stage.
    Until someone tries their gear through an AccuGroove cabinet (including some time tweaking), they'll have no idea what chameleons these cabinets are in any situation. You have to experience it to understand.
    You are correct again; an Eden WT400 (or any other amp) will still sound like an Eden WT400. However, it will not sound like any Eden WT400 you've ever heard before. It will be like removing the veil & seeing what capabilities the amp really has.
    By the way, I'm not aware of any player that adds bass to one of our cabinets, although I know players that turn their bass controls down.

    Mark
    AccuGroove Pro Speaker Cabinets
     
  8. wyliee

    wyliee

    Jul 6, 2003
    South Hill, WA
    Whappo Jr. is my personal preference. I've tried my F Basses through every Accugroove cabinet currently in production and the Jr. is my favorite. Unfortunately, I don't have the cash together yet to get my own.

    I've also tried the Bergie several times and while it is very nice, I still prefer the Whappo Jr. If you decide to sell yours, let me know please.
     
  9. tombowlus

    tombowlus If it sounds good, it is good Gold Supporting Member

    Apr 3, 2003
    North central Ohio
    Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
    I can attest to that one!
     
  10. inazone

    inazone

    Apr 20, 2003
    Colorado
    Mark, lol, I agree and we are on the same page. If I would have known at the time you were in the san fran area the last time I was out there, I would have stopped in and shook your hand for making very nice cabs. I know that an amp has color too and I was just using the bass knob as an example. Ive also played your cabs before and even on a gig. With that said, I didnt like the el whappo, I like the older 112 and I really really like the new 210. Youve got some nice stuff!!

    The reason I posted is there are lots of reasons why people wouldnt want a flat cab. an example: If you have small hands and an ibanez 4 string is the only bass you can feel right with and you live in NYC and dont have a car, and love the tone of a svt 4pro but cant carry it and have to settle for the small eden, why would you want a flat cab to enhance a tone you dont like. Maybe a colored cab would give the overall tone a boost and the player would like it. Your right you could buy another bass and amp but sometimes people dont want to or cant.

    Its just that after going through my search for "my" tone and spending a lot of time hear at TB, The vibe I get here is that you shouldnt use a lot of eq and you shouldnt have color in a cab, its just not cool. I agree with that sometimes but sometimes its cool to have color in you gear and turn your knobs all over the place. Its like picking a color to paint your house, there is no right or wrong and I just want to put another point of view in the thread.

    By the way, I do some guys that add bass to your cabs... :bassist: :bassist: :bassist:
     
  11. Whappo Grande

    Whappo Grande

    Feb 9, 2002
    Santa Clara, CA.
    Manager: AccuGroove Speakers
    inazone, the next time you are out here in northern CA, make sure to look me up.

    Everyone has their choice of tones & preferences. If their cabs, amps & basses give them what they want, that's great. If someone loves the SVT or whatever tone, I'm not saying that they are wrong or should change, not at all.

    My point was not about other cabinet choices being viable, but the misnomer that our cabs only have one sound; clean & flat. You can in fact dial in a SVT (or whatever) sound, by using the EQ on your bass & amp.

    I know this because I personally test every cabinet that leaves our facility. Here's some of the tools I use to test:

    Lakland USA Joe Osborn 5 (Passive Jazz)
    Bee Queen Bee 6 (Active & Passive)
    Bee Worker Bee 5 (Active)
    Ritter Classic Fretless 6 (Active & Passive)
    Barker EUR Fretless 5 (Passive)

    Merlin 550 head
    Thunderfunk head
    Aguilar DB750 head
    Aguilar 500 head
    Read Purity preamp
    Millennia TD-1 preamp
    Alembic FX-2 preamp
    Crest Pro8200 power amp

    Regardless of the combination of heads & basses, I can dial in anything from a studio monitor sounds to a Eden, SWR, etc. Most of the time it’s a matter of touching the EQ on the bass or panning the pick ups. Sometimes a slight tweak on the amp is the trick.

    We most definitely agree that there are nice cabs out there with a plug & play tone or color that will meet many players’ needs. What we are doing at AccuGroove is helping the other players that are not satisfied with what they have by offering them the best of both worlds with a chameleon style "One cabinet does all" flexible approach.

    Mark
    AccuGroove Pro Speaker Cabinets
     
  12. alexclaber

    alexclaber Commercial User

    Jun 19, 2001
    Brighton, UK
    Director - Barefaced Ltd
    It's a tough job but someone's gotta do it! ;)

    Alex
     
  13. lo-freq

    lo-freq aka UFO

    Jan 19, 2003
    The Republic of Texas
    What kind of amplification are you using?
     
  14. I actually did this comparison...as a final decision to see which of my 'big' cabinets I was going to keep and which (unfortunately) I was going to move out of my line up. Just a couple of quick notes...I don't want to turn this into a diatribe about one or the other.
    Some may consider this unfair, but let's just conceed, Mark is right (ha, no pun intended)....that the AG is the 'flat' cabinet for that sake of comparison. An Aguilar DB 750 and a Sadowsky vintage 5 was used. 7 of us agreed to participate. The 322 had a thicker low mid (some may preferred this, others did not). It also had a more pronounced bump from what I could gather at around 5k. It definately had more of the 'cabinet w/ a tweeter' sound and thus sounded a bit 'brighter'. Again, some prefer this, others not. The AG, had a more pronounced low, sub response and overall more 'even' tone. The consensus was for the AG (though narrowly) 4 to 3. My nod went to the AG. Of the 3, and I think this has to have some bearing, their gigs predominantly were rock/blues; and I can understand their decision to go with the 322. Where as the other 4 had a bit more diverisity in their gig logs and made their decision based on the need for more diversity and a flatter response. It really was not a knock-out for either and I have to admit I had to consider all the pros and cons before I made a final decision...it was not immediate and most felt the same.
     
  15. inazone

    inazone

    Apr 20, 2003
    Colorado
    Well thought out and you took your time. Congrats and now go enjoy yourself and play bass. :)
     
  16. inazone

    inazone

    Apr 20, 2003
    Colorado
    Just curious, which one did you think was louder or had the potential to be louder.
     
  17. Folmeister

    Folmeister Knowledge is Good - Emile Faber Supporting Member

    May 7, 2003
    Tomball, Texas
    I was using an SWR SM-500. Then I ran my Studio 220 as a pre through my PLX 2402. Then I went nuts. I bought a used Aggie DB 728 and a new Demeter HBP-1. I am still working with the new rig and I was told about the Bergantino by Juan Ortiz at Basses Acoustic-Electric (whom I bought the Demeter and AG cab from). He thought the Berg would give me more of the sound I was previously working with (SM-500 + Mesa PH 2X10 + Mesa PH 1X15). Don't get me wrong. I love the Whappo and feel like the king of the world owning one. I just seemed to find that there were tone shaping limitations with my pre Aggie/Demeter rig. Juan is trying to help me find a more
    familiar sound. What a guy! He really is a wonderful resource. I think I am more than a little intimidated by the Whappo and lost confidence!
     
  18. lo-freq

    lo-freq aka UFO

    Jan 19, 2003
    The Republic of Texas
    First off, I would suggest working with the EQ on what you have (basses and preamp -- the HBP-1 is pretty versatile). If after having exhausted all possible settings there, you're still not happy, then consider the following advice.

    The Berg HT322 sounds fairly 'tubey' with almost anything. I suspect that if you combine it with the Agie DB728, you might end too 'tubey' sounding.
    Allow me to throw another option your way, considering you liked the Mesa cabs, you could try a Schroeder 410. It has a definite M-B vibe while being a bit tighter, cleaner, and will almost certainly go lower louder.
    I have a Dem 201S/PLX1602 and traded an HT322 (sounded really great with the rest of my system, by the way) in on a Schroeder 410.
    Reportedly, they sound good with all-tube amps, so it might be worth a try.
    I love the sound of the 322, but more so the 410.
    Everyone's taste is a bit different and there's a lot of great stuff out there to try out.

    Good luck in your tone quest.
     
  19. Thunderfunk

    Thunderfunk

    Mar 27, 2004
    McHenry, IL
    I might be accused of saying AccuGroove cabinets are "invisible" leading to a confused opinion of them being "only clean and flat," which they are, but that is only half the story. As Mark would say, it gives you a neutral starting point and from there your rig can go into hyper-drive with a slight amount of eq. It's much easier to eq your rig when starting with a flat (and extended) freq response than having your eq "colored" by the cabinet. How much of your eq power is used to counteract the un-flat response of your cab just to begin with? And how much conflict is created trying to overcome a cab with an un-flat response? :D

    Dave "Thunder" Funk
     
  20. Arthur U. Poon

    Arthur U. Poon

    Jan 30, 2004
    SLC, Utah -USA-
    Endorsing Artist: Mike Lull Custom Basses
    I've talked with Juan also. You're right, he's a really nice guy, and he shared a lot of info with me.

    I'd love to be able to book a flight, take my Read Purity/CrestCA9 and my Roscoe-6 and fly to a city that has a music store that has the Bergantino HT322, Accugroove El Whappo, and Schroeder 410 all in stock and ready for me to try. Unfortunately I can't afford to travel or be away from my family or my day job right now.


    -Now Art's in Fantasyland!!!! :D-
    I wish there was a store that would ship one to me, and allow me to try it on a gig. If I wasn't completely satisfied I could ship it back and try the next. I'd gladly pay shipping each way and I'd baby the cab so there wouldn't be any wear or damage done.
    -Art, wake up! SLAP!!!!! Thanks, I needed that! :D

    But right now as it stands I'm most interested in the Berg HT322. Plus, I'm sure all three cabs are so good, any of the three would suit me very well.


    -Art