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What is the REAL watt rating of the Ampeg SVT-HLF 4x10?!?!

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by KlarkKent, Jul 12, 2002.


  1. KlarkKent

    KlarkKent

    Dec 17, 2001
    Los Angeles
    Oh my GOD!!!

    I'm going crazy here!!!

    At first I thought, cool! Guitar Center had it as 800 watts at 4 ohms. I was going to buy it.

    Then I go to Ampegs web site, they have at 400 RMS at 4 ohms....then I though, crap, it's not my amp.....( I have a carvin 1000 watt amp, I want to pour more wattage in my cab.

    Then I'm at Guitar Center today, and while I'm checkin out the 6x10 ampeg, I mention I was going to buy the 4x10 but it's rated only RMS 400, the head guy at GC says "no, no, it's 800, Ampeg says weird stuff on their site"......so what the hell?

    My power amp is 1000 bridged at 4 ohms, and 700 bridged at ohms...so I want to take advantage of all that power, I don't want a cab that only operates at a max 400.

    Does make any sense, or do I need another talkbass spankin and lecture?

    klark kent
     
  2. I don't know what the real rating is, but you're going to get 1000 watts no matter what the cab is rated (not counting impedence) The rating doesn't limit how much power it takes in, it is just a recommeded maximum to keep you from blowing the speakers. You're probably safe if you exceed it by a considerable amount if you don't drive it too hard or clip the amp.
     
  3. tornadobass

    tornadobass Supporting Member

    Nov 20, 2000
    Iowa City, Iowa
    Endorsing Artist: Black Diamond & SuperSensitive strings
    If you look closely at the Ampeg web site, it says:

    Program Handling : 800 Watts  
    RMS Handling : 400 Watts  

    In a way, both are right...but the 400 watt rating is the one that you should pay most attention to.

    You can still use your 1000 amp with this cab...you'll have spare headroom, which is better on a cab than an amp that's being cranked full out. Your Carvin is rated at 4ohms: 350/350w or bridged: 4ohms: 1000w

    If you're concerned about too much power, just use one side of the amp...350 watts...but you'd be fine with the 1000 watts, too, if you don't crank it.

    Tornadobass
     
  4. ldiezman

    ldiezman

    Jul 11, 2001
    Nashville
    400 watts is the continous rating.. meaning that you can constantly push 400 watts through that cab without problems.. 800 watts is peak... say you accidently bump the volume and you through out some huge sound, it won't destroy your cab..

    but you can run 1000 watts in there and be ok, you will have the headroom you need.. just don't turn the amp up all the way
     
  5. I have a similar question. I have a 410 SVT-HLN which has a 500 watt RMS rating. I'm thinking of running my QSC PLX 1602 bridged into it which would be 1600 watts. I'm wondering where would be a good place to set the poweramp's volume so I can't send too much power to the cabinet. Is it linear-the volume at halfway would roughly be equivalent to 800 watts?
     
  6. Well, i think you are all wrong. I'm staring at the back of my SVT-HLF right now, and it says 500 watts RMS, 1000 watts Program
     
  7. berserk

    berserk

    Aug 24, 2000
    Parma, Ohio
    The SVT-HLF has a rating of 400 RMS and 800 program
    The SVT-HLN has a rating of 500 RMS and 1000 program

    Both are four ohms and have the same size and speaker arrangement.

    RedBassMan check the back or your cab it may be an HLN, mine is.

    That is the only difference I know of between the cabs. If anyone else would like to share any other differences I would appreciate it.

    It seems that the HLN might serve KlarkKent's needs better.
     
  8. Hey,

    Mine is an HLF model, 500 watts RMS, 1000 watts program

    Thanks
     
  9. My 410 HLF distinctly says 500W RMS, 1000W program, so I'm with RedBassMan on this. I'm not really sure what "program" means, though. I've never seen a mathematical expression for it..... However, if the cab can take 500W RMS, it's peak rating would be 707W (from the strict mathematical definition of RMS), so I don't know what the 1000W thing is all about. At any rate, you're safe with this box with any amp up to about 1000W, if you're not driving it really hard. The odd peak of 1000W probably won't hurt anything.
     
  10. I also have an SVT-410HLF (Impedance 4 OHMS - Power Rating 500w RMS / 1000w Program.

    But unlike everyone else, I am wondering what (if any) damage I could cause by running it with my TE 150w head until I get the funds for a new higher watt head.

    Also, what would be the ideal wattage head for the SVT-410HLF?
     
  11. You don't need to worry about it. If the head produces 150W clean at 4 Ohms, even if you could drive it to 100% THD continuous (which you can't) it would still only produce a maximum of 300W (very very distorted!). This is well within the power handling parameters of the cab. It is extremely unlikely that you would damage the speakers with this head.

    There isn't really an ideal wattage for a particular cab. Anything up to 1000W will work fine. You can do this because even under hard usage a 1000W amp probably will only put out an average of about 1/3 of its rated power. Average power is what you need to be concerned with. Again, the odd peak of 1000W probably won't hurt anything.
     
  12. Thanks for the info spacegoat ....

    Just so I am clear ... are you saying there are no draw backs to running a head that is significantly less wattage the cab can handle?

    Am I correct in assuming that more watts will just give me more volume?
     
  13. The only real drawback is if it isn't loud enough for your application. If you have to drive the amp super hard to be heard you need a new amp. If it's loud enough for you without driving it really hard then everything's cool. Underpowering speakers is a myth.:p
     
  14. Thanks again spacegoat ....

    Tonight will be the first time I run the TE AH150 and the new 4x10 with the rest of the band. Guess I'll know if I need more power soon enuff!

    That damn drummer boy is hella loud so my guess is I am going thave to crank up the amp to 75%+ .... time will tell if it's gona cut it!

    Thanks again.
     
  15. Ryan L.

    Ryan L. Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Aug 7, 2000
    West Fargo, ND
    Both of mine say "410HLN" on the back of them on the serial number plate. Rated at 500 continuous, 1000 program.

    Ampeg did the same thing with the 410HE's. They are still known as HE's, but on the back, they are called an SVT410HEN. Same cab, higher power rating.

    When I use only one cab, I mono bridge my SVT4PRO into it (1200 watts) and they have never given me any trouble. And I usually only use one cab nowadays.
     
  16. Hey spacegoat!

    I finally got to play my new setup with the entire band and guess what! My TE 150 is plenty loud enough with the new SVT-410HLF. As a matter of fact I never had to raise the volume on the TE past 4! I've been running the TE into an 8ohm cab for years and never realized I was only using half the available power! Needless to say I am very very happy with the Ampeg cab and while I do want one I am going to hold off on getting a matching Ampeg head. A lot of ppl talk trash about the TE stuff but mine has been serving me well for a long long long time. Then again, it is a 'pre Gibson' model ... if that has anything to do with it. Speaking of which ... does anyone know if Gibson would refurb an old trace elliot? Like I said mine is old and most of the pretty green lights inside died years ago, the little white plastic things on the eq sliders are all cracked and falling off ... the "in/out" buttons on the face don't work (gota use the foot switch) ... I had to swap out the plastic nuts from the effects loop with the ones on the inputs after the input nuts got smashed in a nasty fall .... just a bunch of minor stuff like that needs fixed. Since I have decided to keep her for a few more years I figure it would be nice to see her in her original glory. Any suggestions on where I could get this kinda stuff fixed?

    Thanks again ....
    Laterz
     
  17. I think Gibson would look after your request...get ahold of Robert Perales at Gibson (TE Rep). He's been wonderfully accomodating in helping me with a problem with my Trace Elliott 410h cab (which I think is an exceptional sounding 410).

    I think, and hope you'll find that if nothing else Gibson's customer service is exceptional. Good luck with the refurb..I think you'll be happy you kept your old TE head, great stuff!

    Regards, Al.
     
  18. Guys,

    The "N" in HEN and HLN means "Neutrik", for the speakon jack on the back, and has nothing to do with the power rating, or thats what ampeg told me.
     
  19. Don't let Spacegoat mislead you! The most common way speakers get blown is from underpowering them! You end up trying to push the amp, making it clip the signal so badly that you end up with a flat-top signal that is close to direct current. That will blow the speaker. At low power, it might not cause damage, but if you're dealing with high-powered amps, it definitely will. You owe it to yourself to learn about this stuff! Many power amp manufacturer's websites have good info on this subject. Even though I'm not a big fan of their gear, I read a really good explanation of this on a Peavey website.

    Brian
     
  20. I'm not the one misleading people here. ;)

    Clipping or underpowering doesn't blow speakers. Too much power blows speakers. A clipped amp will only blow a speaker if the amount of power being supplied to the speaker is greater than what the speaker can dissipate. Clipped amps do not produce DC or anything like it. I can prove this mathematically if you'd like. Think about this: Say you have a 100Hz sine wave going into a speaker. If you crank the amp that's generating that wave so that it clips off the tops of the waveforms, the speaker still moves in and out 100 times a second. This is a simple example, but you get the picture. Now, where "underpowering" comes into play as a source of speaker failure. An amp will only blow a speaker if it can produce average power greater than what the speaker can dissipate as heat. When amps clip they can put out more power than they are rated for. This is a function of the fact that clipped waveforms have more energy than non-clipped ones of the same amplitude. Theoretically, an amp can put out twice it's rated power under severe clipping. Therefore, you could blow, say, a 500W speaker with a 400W amp. Because that amp could put out more than 500W when clipped hard. But could you blow that same 500W speaker with a 100W amp? Not likely.

    The reason you can get away with overpowering is that amplifiers generally only put out a fraction of their maximum power, on an average. There may be peaks where the amp hits full power, but they're usually short lived. The average power is much less.

    Before you accuse people of misleading others, you might want to make sure you know what you're talking about, yourself. ;)