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What setting is "flat" on Bass 400/400+?

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by tombowlus, Jul 14, 2005.


  1. tombowlus

    tombowlus If it sounds good, it is good Gold Supporting Member

    Apr 3, 2003
    North central Ohio
    Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
    After searching through the archives, I could not find an answer to this question. Does anyone know what is a "flat" setting on the Bass 400/400+? The operating instructions are a bit vague on this. After playing with mine, I am wondering if it is based on the Dual Showman design, where "flat" is something like 2 on Bass, 10 on Mid, and 2 on Treble.

    Thanks, Tom.
     
  2. Chef

    Chef Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    May 23, 2004
    Columbia MO
    Staff Reviewer; Bass Gear Magazine
    I think flat is on the 5's Tom, but I'm not sure why I think that;)
     
  3. Hurley

    Hurley

    Feb 12, 2004
    Cape Cod, MA
    The mids are cut only on the Mesa. It IS based on the Dual Showman. Flat is about 0-10-0.

    It's been mentioned a few times here before.
     
  4. tombowlus

    tombowlus If it sounds good, it is good Gold Supporting Member

    Apr 3, 2003
    North central Ohio
    Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
    That is how I always tried them before, but dang if it don't sound great set 2-10-2!

    Tom.
     
  5. tombowlus

    tombowlus If it sounds good, it is good Gold Supporting Member

    Apr 3, 2003
    North central Ohio
    Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
    Thanks, I must not have used the correct terms in my search.

    Tom.
     
  6. eldave777

    eldave777

    May 24, 2005
    Burning Skies answered this question on another post and he says 10 is flat on the 400+. I like that guy, he always gives good advice.
     
  7. tombowlus

    tombowlus If it sounds good, it is good Gold Supporting Member

    Apr 3, 2003
    North central Ohio
    Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
    10 across the board, or just on the mid?
     
  8. Chef

    Chef Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    May 23, 2004
    Columbia MO
    Staff Reviewer; Bass Gear Magazine
    OK, my bad.
    So it's like Fender (and bbe bmax).
     
  9. Hurley

    Hurley

    Feb 12, 2004
    Cape Cod, MA
    Y'know, I can't seem to find any of those threads either, and I posted in a few of them...

    EDIT: Ok, I found one thread. Try this. There's a link in one of my posts to another thread too.
     
  10. eldave777

    eldave777

    May 24, 2005
    10 bass, mid, treb. Turn the eq off and its flat.
     
  11. Hurley

    Hurley

    Feb 12, 2004
    Cape Cod, MA
    :confused: I don't quite understand.
     
  12. tombowlus

    tombowlus If it sounds good, it is good Gold Supporting Member

    Apr 3, 2003
    North central Ohio
    Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
    Sweet, thanks! The thing is, I even posted on that thread and I couldn't find it! :confused:
     
  13. BurningSkies

    BurningSkies CRAZY BALDHEAD

    Feb 20, 2005
    Seweracuse, NY
    First off, thanks ElDave...Nice to have a vote of confidence. I do my best to only post what I really know, or otherwise state clearly that what I think is only conjecture. :)
    It was a bumpy start, but nice to have you as part of the community, especially as a person who both plays and deals gear.


    I believe Hurley is right (BTW, he's the guy I got my 400+ from).

    The 400/+ runs flat at 0-10-0 or so...there are a few threads around here about it (believe it or not, I went through every thread that listed Mesa 400's when I got mine). Beyond that, my ears tell me this is correct, especially if you've played an old fender bassman amp, which runs this tone set up.

    I've been running mine with the bass boosted about 50%, the Mid flat or cut about 15% and the treble flat...but then, I'm playing Reggae.

    Also, Tom...remember you CAN run both preamps at once. I pretty much do that all the time. The 400 & 400+ have independant tubes for their pre stages, so you'll git more/different tone when you do this.

    This is different from the earlier D180, where you can cascade the gain stages on the pre...which is a nifty trick for overdrive, and why those 180s are sought after.
     
  14. Dave M

    Dave M

    Jun 12, 2005
    upper left corner
    As previously mentioned, the 400 is nearly flat at B=0, M=10, T=0. It is the typical blackface Fender tone stack arrangement, for the most part. to try and get it as flat as possible, the bass control would be cracked open about 2%, but there's still some roll-off below around 60hz at this setting.

    Keep in mind that with the treble shift switched in it changes the response and it won't get as flat as with it not engaged.

    This is all just the tone control shaping via the tone stack values. Other influences are present throughout the preamp and have a huge effect on the tonal response of the circuit and amp. It's not just BMT. ;)
     
  15. bigbajo60

    bigbajo60

    Nov 7, 2003
    Laredo, Texas
    But...

    ...but...

    ...isn't the point of playing through an amp like the 400 to have a sound that ISN'T anywhere near 'flat'?

    At least that's what I thought.
     
  16. tombowlus

    tombowlus If it sounds good, it is good Gold Supporting Member

    Apr 3, 2003
    North central Ohio
    Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
    I happen to like a "clean" tube sound as well as a "colored" tube sound, so it's nice to have options. So far, my Bass 400 seems to deliver in the "tonal options" department! :)

    Tom.
     
  17. I thought you could only use both the preamps on the 400+, or maybe its the 400, i think its only the 400+, im sure its only one of them you can do it on
     
  18. BurningSkies

    BurningSkies CRAZY BALDHEAD

    Feb 20, 2005
    Seweracuse, NY

    Huh?

    I'm not quite sure what you're saying here (seems to be a theme in this thread, right?)...but the 2 channels are independant in the 400 and the 400+. This means you can use either of them, one at a time, or if you use a Y into both inputs, both at the same time.
     
  19. Describe cascading gain stages to me. I have heard of this before but don't know what it is. I would like to get more of an overdrive sound from my D180 and it sounds like this might do the trick.
     
  20. popinfresh

    popinfresh

    Dec 23, 2004
    Melbourne, Aus
    I thought cascading gain was just where the more you turn the gain up, the more you overdrive the pre.. I'm probably wrong though :p