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Where Do I Go From Here?

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Poon, Jul 1, 2003.


  1. Poon

    Poon

    May 20, 2003
    Los Angeles, CA
    So I ended up buying Wally's Aguilar GS410. Thanks again Wally by the way and I love it to death. However, I don't yet own a Head or any form of amp to power it. So I'm stuck with an Aguilar GS410 sitting in pristine condition in my living room just collecting dust.

    1.) I still like the Sound of the Eden Metro head. I can get the whole metro combo for $700 or less used. Which is significantly cheaper than me buying the metro head for $1039 brand new. In addition to that, I get a 2x10XLT for free basically. I figured I could have the amp portion detached if I'd like and I could mount it in a road case. But if I decide I should want to use 6-10" speakers, won't it look/sound kinda weird with two eden speakers atop of 4 aguilar 10's? Or should I never combine the two?

    2.) Should I get another head/rig system all together? A friend of mine suggested that I get a Great Power Amp and A great Pre-Amp that are all relatively light and I'll be good to go. But this doesn't address the fact that I want a smaller cabinet for smaller gigs.

    3.) If part 2. Should I get another Aguilar Cab to compliment the GS410. Perhaps try to sell the 210xlt portion of the metro after I buy the amp? And then buy a GS210. That way if I get another 4ohm cab, I can run the system at a 2-ohm load? But I've heard bad things about running amps at a 2-ohm load for too long? I know the lower the impedence, the higher the heat. We'll see.

    4.) Trade in my GS410 for a 410XLT or 410XST? I think this is most unlikely since I love the sound of the aguilar, but hell...ya never know. But my matching speakers problem will be solved. I will have matching sounds from cabs, but I will have lost the aguilar sound.

    5.) Screw this all and buy a spector bass. (kinda random, but its going through my head)

    6.) Another option.

    I don't have the immediate need for a bass amp since both of my bands have bass amps waiting there for me when I show up to gigs or practices, but they aren't anything incredibly great. I'm selling off most of my old equipment to buy new stuff and I'm going through this phase of trying to find my sound.

    My main concerns here are.
    1.) Portability (weight...etc)
    2.) Expandibility (Being able to accomodate any size gig from small coffee shop to large Hall)
    3.) Sound and Tone
    4.) Money (I want the best rig for the least amount of money)
     
  2. Munjibunga

    Munjibunga Total Hyper-Elite Member Gold Supporting Member

    May 6, 2000
    San Diego (when not at Groom Lake)
    Independent Contractor to Bass San Diego
    You want/need a used Eden WT-400. If you have more cash, get a WT-550. Probably not too many used ones out there, though.
     
  3. lo-freq

    lo-freq aka UFO

    Jan 19, 2003
    The Republic of Texas
    I would consider getting a good head next that can handle 2 ohm loads (WT-400 can't--sorry Mungi). WT-550 or a second hand EBS Fafner (or TD-650) or second hand EA iAmp-600 (or 800), something along those lines.

    Then get a GS210 (or new bass guitar).

    You should definantly listen to whatever with your bass & cab before buying if at all possible.
     
  4. Munjibunga

    Munjibunga Total Hyper-Elite Member Gold Supporting Member

    May 6, 2000
    San Diego (when not at Groom Lake)
    Independent Contractor to Bass San Diego
    I wouldn't argue with much of that. Except it's "definitely."
     
  5. lo-freq

    lo-freq aka UFO

    Jan 19, 2003
    The Republic of Texas
    Munji, I'm a sorry combination of being a bad speller and too lazy to spell-check.

    [BTW, what the he11 is "Zig"?]
     
  6. CaptainWally

    CaptainWally Supporting Member

    Oct 21, 2000
    Sandy Eggo, CA
    Glad you're happy Poon. That's a sweet cab.

    You already heard my two cents. Get a QSC1602 and a used preamp (Ampeg SVP-Pro)? The head room is so worth it and it's only a 25 lbs rig.

    For a small cab, I'd say just pick up a used GS112. There are better small cabs on the market(Epifani?), the GS112 is the best value. Easy as pie to carry and loud enough for small/small-med gigs (say the Starry Plough?)
     
  7. lo-freq

    lo-freq aka UFO

    Jan 19, 2003
    The Republic of Texas
    I can't believe it. I misspelled "Munji" and Munji picks on my missspelling of "definitely".

    Fut the whack is groin un, Munji?

    BTW -
    ---------
    Q: What did the fish say when it swam into a concrete wall?
    A: "Dam."
     
  8. Poon

    Poon

    May 20, 2003
    Los Angeles, CA
    Wally Suggested a QSC1602 for a Power Amp
    and a SVP-PRO for the preamp?
    Any other suggestions? Has anyone ever used the WP100 Navigator by Eden? It has as **** load of knobs, which looks fun, but somewhat frustrating at the same time. Can anyone comment to me on their performance? Its only 12 pounds, so it isn't too bad. Wally, I thought your Aguilar DB659 sounded great, but as we discussed, it does have its limitations and some inherent design flaws. I'd love the DB680, with exception that it is really expensive. I think its around 17 lbs. Not too bad. But not great either. Any different suggestions for Power-Amps I should try out. Are all of these going to be 2ohm stable. Because the cab I have now is 4ohms and if I combine it with anything else the minimum it will be is 2.67ohms, but if I get other cabs I would probably get 2 8-ohmn versions. Just incase I want to increase the rig beyond 2 cabs (i.e. for versatility sake)

    Oh guys...I've always wondered this. When does it become useful to have your output become stereo? I've always used mono applications or bridged to mono applications, but I don't quite get when I would want to use Stereo Applications. Could somebody explain this to me. Thanks.
     
  9. Hey Poon,
    Got the Metro last night...........WOW. I'm speechless..........pure sugar. Thanks for the info!
     
  10. Munjibunga

    Munjibunga Total Hyper-Elite Member Gold Supporting Member

    May 6, 2000
    San Diego (when not at Groom Lake)
    Independent Contractor to Bass San Diego
    Misspelling "Munji" is excusable. The blatant and rampant misspelling of "definitely" drives me insane. It's just another symbol of the decline of modern civilization.
     
  11. lo-freq

    lo-freq aka UFO

    Jan 19, 2003
    The Republic of Texas
    Most pro audio power amps (such as qsc, stewart, crown, carvin, mackie, etc.) can handle 2 ohm loads only if you're using non-bridged mode, i.e. using one or both sides of the amp in either parallel (dual-mono) or stereo mode (there's a few that can only handle 4 ohm loads in these modes, in those rare cases, the bridged minimun impedence is usually 8 ohm). Back to most pro power amps, usually their minimum impedence in bridged mode is 4 ohm.

    With most pro amps, it is OK to run only one channel at a time in stereo mode.

    The QSC PLX1602 in stereo or parallel mode is rated at 300Wpc @ 8 ohm, 500Wpc @ 4 ohm, & 800Wpc @ 2 ohm; in bridged mode it's 1100W @ 8 ohm & 1600W @ 4 ohm. I think you would have to deduce from these ratings whether it would meet your current &/or future needs (I have a 1602 myself: it's a good amp; if you need more power there's the 2402, 3002 or 3402 PLXs).

    Stereo mode would only be useful if you have a stereo input source or if you are biamping or if you are only using one side of the amp, i.e. bass preamp into channel 1 input and channel 1 output to cab(s).
    [Parallel mode takes one mono input and feeds it to both channels & the two channels each have their own level control and can handle different impedence loads, if needed.]

    Here's a link to the PLX owner's manual, (their server seems really slow) it has some diagrams that explain using the differnet modes and configurations.

    I believe I got all this stuff straight, if not I'm sure someone will enlighten us.
     
  12. I use an Aggie GS210 above an Eden 210XLT; the combo sounds great. If I had to pick a favorite, the Aggie might win by a hair, but I love both of them and who cares if they look different! Why should we segregate gear brands anyway? ;) I'd say it's much more likely you'd encounter difficulties due to one cab being a 210 and the other a 410...I would think the 410 would be significantly louder, and maybe drown out the 210 completely. And then there's the issue of how to distribute power between the two cabs...maybe someone who's had experience with this can help you out; I don't really know what you should expect.

    Regarding the Navigator... I have one and very much like it. There are indeed lots of knobs, but I just don't use most of them :D I found a sound I like so I don't mess with it; there are plenty of options to play around with if you want though.
     
  13. CaptainWally

    CaptainWally Supporting Member

    Oct 21, 2000
    Sandy Eggo, CA
    BTW, only suggested the Ampeg because it's inexpensive and sounds pretty good. IMO, most preamps sounds good in there own way.
     
  14. Poon

    Poon

    May 20, 2003
    Los Angeles, CA
    Do you guys think that for $700, the Metro Combo is worth it? I would end up paying more than that just for the head, brand new. I mean, I can get 2 seperate channels, which I can tweak for two different basses live? Different volume levels and different tone settings in accordance to what I like. + I'd just get an extra Eden 210xlt. But thinking long term, do you guys think it would be better for me to just get a pre-amp and power amp combo. Hell, I could even get the metro and get a power amp if I needed it. Do you think I can just survive on modifying the sound off of one channel. Hmmm. Many decisions, much help is needed.

    I'm a man of symmetry as well. I like buying things so that they look symmetrical. For example, I don't know if I could buy just one GS112. I'd buy 1 just for starters for maybe small gigs, but eventually I'd want to buy 2 for medium gigs. I think I have some psychological problems (compulsive buying). That's why I was thinking of getting a GS210 to compliment the GS410. But now I'm thinking that tonally, it would be more complete if I had 2 12's.
    I'm a salespersons dream come true. Tell me what to do.

    -P
     
  15. CaptainWally

    CaptainWally Supporting Member

    Oct 21, 2000
    Sandy Eggo, CA
    The Metro sounds good, but it's quite an 80 lb. cube to haul. Probably won't fit in that trunk...

    I'm a broken record here, but I'd go pre/power and a small cab... -or- I'd go cool small head like a WT400 and a 12" cab (Aggie 12 or something).

    I just wouldn't want my head to be part of an 80 lb. package.
     
  16. Poon

    Poon

    May 20, 2003
    Los Angeles, CA
    Wally. Don't think you are being a broken record, I didn't even consider a poweramp/preamp combo before you suggested it. And in regards to your comments, I thought the same thing. I didn't want to lug around 80lbs just for the head portion. But, I talked to the people at eden and they said I could remove the head portion of the Metro and seperate it from the 2x10 portion of the Metro. I still need to try out more amps, but I like to keep hearing suggestions. Thanks guys.

    -P