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Who knows anything about buying a new car?

Discussion in 'Off Topic [BG]' started by Joe Nerve, Jan 16, 2012.

  1. Joe Nerve

    Joe Nerve Supporting Member

    Oct 7, 2000
    New York City
    Endorsing artist: Musicman basses
    Not me. Never did it before, but considering it now.

    I consider myself very skilled at music equipment buying. I know how to get basses and amps dirt cheap, I know what the going prices for everything are, and can generally get anything I want for 20% less than that. I also know what my used gear is worth, and know what I'm doing when selling or trading.

    I want to be able to do that with buying a car, and what better place to learn than here.

    I've got a serious gas attack for a Hyundai Veloster, with the $2000 style package. Not a clue how to start buying. Would like to be able to go in to a dealer, say this is the price I'm looking for, either give to me, or hasta la vista. Want to trade my car in, plus put about $3000 down. Book value on my current car seems to be around $1800 cuz it's got a bit of body damage.

    Where do I start? What do I do? How do I know how much I should be paying for this thing? I don't even know about financing as I've never financed something before. Help!!!!!
  2. fenderhutz

    fenderhutz Supporting Member

    Jan 28, 2007
    Harpers Ferry WV
    See if the car you are buying is offering stupid cheap financing. Alot of times they will run 0% around presidents day or 1.9%. You typically can't beat those rates. If not try to find a credit union you can join if you can. I work for a gov't agency and got into Pentagon Federal. Crazy cheap rates. Dealerships can and will try to get you a rate through their "special" bank where they can get kick backs from interest. If you have good credit don't get suckered into a lower payment with a longer term. It's worth paying an extra 20 bucks a month to get a shorter term loan.

    Also they will haggle with values. Go in with a realistic number for trade in. Your car will go to auction to be sold. Don't think they will mark it up and sell it. So when they tell you your trade is only getting 1500 when you expect 1800 they are probably on the money. If you can sell it on your own you will fare better.

    Get pre-approved by a local bank but don't tell them your interest rate. Just you are pre-approved for a loan. They will magically come up with better numbers to get the loan lol. Car dealerships can be a one stop shop. They will do financing and everything for you. Just know your loan options before you go in.

    Dealers get many kickbacks including getting new cars cheaper by selling current models. You do have SOME haggle room.

    Edit: I don't know if it was Hyundai or Kia that did this, but the salesmans commission used to be a flat 150 bucks on each unit sold based on a survey when they call on on how the salesman did. So a huge commission isn't typically put in with the price either.
  3. Never buy on the first visit. ALMOST ALWAYS, they will come up with a better deal on the second visit. Or third. If there's one thing that makes a certain part of a car dealer's anatomy draw up very very tightly, it's watching a prospect walk out the door.

    Always act like you will be just as happy with the competition's car, even if you are head-over-heels in love with a particular model. If the salesman knows you love it, he has much less incentive to deal.

    Question everything with a dollar sign beside it. You'd be surprised at what they try to stick you with, and how easily the words "That's bulls*%t, I'm not paying that" makes it go away.

    Smile and say "you really don't want to sell me this car, do you?" at every counter offer the salesman makes.
  4. sneha1965


    Nov 7, 2007
    You should also be able to find out what the dealer paid for the car through Kelly Blue Books website. Go to several dealerships to find the best deal and never tell them who you're getting the better deal with. They can either beat it or not but don't reveal your sources so they can call around and get involved with anyone else you might be dealing with. Also, if you are going back to a dealership to close a deal stick with the salesperson you stated with so you're not paying for a split commission.
  5. Phalex

    Phalex Semper Gumby Supporting Member

    Oct 3, 2006
    G.R. MI
    Go look with no intention of buying. Then call one of the guys you used to be in a band with that works at the dealership.......

    That's how I do it anyway.........
  6. Joe - I've looked at the Veloster. It's really nicely designed, but it's low powered. There's supposed to be a new engine with more power available in a few months.

    Autoweek review: http://www.autoweek.com/article/201...oster__Review_notes&utm_campaign=awdailydrive

    That said, you pretty well know how trades work: your trade is taken at wholesale, and they take some profit out of the markup on the car to show more value.


    - You are buying a new Widget that costs $1000 and has $200 of markup, so the seller's actual cost is $800.
    - You are trading an old Widget that is worth $200.
    - If the seller is willing to make $100 profit, they will offer you $300 for your old Widget in trade.

    That's how trade-ins work with guitars, cars and widgets in general.

    Note: if you can sell your old Widget for more than $200 yourself, then you can get the seller to discount the new Widget $100 and come out ahead financially. You do have to go to the work of selling the old Widget yourself.

    Variables include finance incentives, rebates from the manufacturer, or other monetary spiffs that aren't part of the trade.

    Do your online homework and look up the ACV (actual cash value = wholesale) value of your car. Edmunds.com is my preferred reference for this. You can also find the approximate cost of the new vehicle to the dealer online. Come in, check it out, do your homework first.
  7. elgecko


    Apr 30, 2007
    Anasleim, CA
    Fleet/internet car buying is the only way to go if you know EXACTLY what you want. All the haggling is done before hand.
  8. I do know it's nice having a car that no else ever had.
    Nothing like that new car smell!!!!! :bag:
  9. hover


    Oct 4, 2008
    100% Haggle-Free New Car Price Quotes from Local Dealers - TrueCar

    go from there. go in WITHOUT mentioning a trade, and negotiate your price before bringing that into the fold.

    Go in WITHOUT telling them what you would like to spend a month, due dilligence and stand firm with the price you want to pay, and run that against an ammortization schedule (you can find a TON of them online) so you will know exactly how your APR and such work into the actual monthly payment.

    Get your final best price and financing scenario in paper and DO NOT sign anything until it's to your liking, THEN bring up the trade, especially good if you own it outright. Then comes the haggling, as they will offer less than it is worth, but stand firm or make them meet you at least halfway. BE PREPARED TO WALK AWAY.

    Otherwise all they will do is fudge numbers and essentially write out your trade in value somewhere when they run your actual final financing.

    Edmunds is a more realistic site for your trade in value, I think KBB is a little optimistic.
  10. hover


    Oct 4, 2008

    Yeah, nothing like breathing in the out-gassing of the plastics and foam / fabrics, usually semi-toxic compounds. Especially the motor coating applied to the block from foreign imports.
  11. MJ5150

    MJ5150 Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Apr 12, 2001
    Olympia, WA
    How is your poker face? You'll need it.

    I heard once that the dealership sends your credit app out to a bunch of finance companies, then present back to you the best offer, which is actually the best offer for them based on the kickback they get from the finance company. So one company could have offered you a better APR, but less kickback to the dealer, so the dealer skips it. The last few vehicles we bought, we used a car loan from our credit union to avoid this.

    It's unfortunate how much deception goes on during negotiation between you and the mystical guy in the back room with the big marker.

  12. sneha1965


    Nov 7, 2007
    Another thing, go by Carnax to see what they will give you for your car. Their offer is good for a week. That way if the dealer won't give you as much (which they most likely won't) you have leverage. I did that before getting my Honda CVR. Honda offered me $2700 for my car when Carmax offered me $4000. I told them NO and that I would go back to Carmax to get the $4000. They came back and told me they would give me $3500 for my car and they could do all the paperwork there, that way I wouldn't have to drive back to carmax. I told them driving back to Carmax would be the easiest $500 I've ever made my life. They then gave me the $4000 for my car.
  13. kserg


    Feb 20, 2004
    London, UK
    Put 2 dealers against each other.

    Talk to a dealer, see price they give you. Go to another dealer see what price they give you. Tell dealer with higher price that another place has it cheaper... See if they lower the price bellow what other dealer is asking...

    My new car, i was unable to do that with because it was special order. Not having automatic is worth every penny i did not save.

  14. When I worked in car sales, people who used this strategy always won. My dealership had a very strict policy on haggling, so I almost always lost, too. :(

    But on the bright side, I no longer work in car sales. :hyper:
  15. I sold cars for a family dealership for two years and enjoyed it. There are still a lot of good, long-established family dealerships that aren't systems places.

    OTOH, there are a lot of high pressure places. I don't go to them.

    And I don't pit dealerships against each other, or play games, or become a pain in the ass to them or myself. I'm a used car buyer, so I can't use online buying to have new car dealers compete...but that's OK since I'm spending $10,000 to $20,000 less!

    I do my homework on my trade - in the very, very rare event that I trade, because I usually sell my own car and get more for it. Then I go and drive cars - sometimes only one or two - and check their values with Edmunds and Cars.com for my area. At that point, I'm ready to make a deal.

    I never liked people to play buying games with me, and I don't do it to others. If you know some good car dealerships, you don't have to.
  16. OldDog52

    OldDog52 Gold Supporting Member

    Jan 1, 2011
    Someone explain to me why it's dumb to mention a trade-in while haggling. If you've done your homework in advance, you know what your trade is worth, low book and high book. You also know the MSRP of the new vehicle, the dealer's nominal invoice cost, and any incentives they may have from the car mfr. at the time. If you approach it from "I will give you my car + $whatever" for the new car, and never waiver from that, they can monkey with the numbers all they want but all that matters is that number.

    Example: The car you want is $30,000 MSRP. Dealer invoice is $28,200 (you know because you researched it). The car mfr. is kicking in $1000 of dealer or buyer incentive money (you know because you researched it). Your trade is worth somewhere between $1500 and $2000 (you know because you researched it). You decide you are willing to give them $28,200 minus $1,000 minus what you will accept for your trade. Let's say that's $1750 for the trade.

    $28,200 (invoice)
    - $ 1,000 (mfr incentive to the dealer)
    - $ 1,750 (your trade-in)
    $25,450 This is your offer, including the trade-in. They can cook the variables any way they want (and they will) as long as the net cost is $25,450.

    Now, if they come back and say Your car + $28,000, you can just smile and get up and start walking away as you say "We're so far apart it's not worth our time". That's when you find out if you are really way off on your offer. If they let you walk, keep walking and don't turn back.

    What's wrong with my strategery?

    EDIT: In my scenario, if the dealer's true cost is $28,200 minus $1,000, they would not make any money on the deal. So the reaction you get from them on that initial offer will tell you a lot as far as whether you are in the ballpark or not.
  17. never take your wife, she will get bored and cost you money rushing the sale
  18. Truth.
  19. Tat2dHeart

    Tat2dHeart Only two strings away from an attitude problem.

    I always take my laptop, a book, a red sharpie, and the "look."

    Do your research in advance, and know what the vehicle you want and what your trade is worth. Be prepared for them to add the trade offer back into some other line of the cost somewhere. Some are blatant with that and some are slick, but nearly all dealerships add it back in somewhere.

    When the sales guy wants to go to the back room to "talk over the numbers," I haul out either the laptop or the book. If it's the laptop, I make sure he sees that I'm looking at vehicles at someone else's dealership. If it's the book, I let him wait while I finish my chapter before he gets my attention again. Then, I get out the sharpie. If his price isn't my price, I just make a really big X through his numbers and write in my own. Then I push it back across the desk and stare at him expectantly (e.g., the look). After blustering a bit, he'll eventually get up and go back to the back.

    Sales guy only gets two trips to the back. If he comes out the second time without my numbers, I pack up and head for the door without a word. When he comes after me (they always have), I just say, "I'm sorry. It looked like you didn't want to sell me the car today, so I have other people to see." Then head for the door again. If he lets me go, his loss. If he stops me again, the guy in back with authority to negotiate needs to just come talk to me personally. I don't like the "runner" approach - it's a tactic to keep the buyer off his game.

    I take my time, walk away when I need to, and go prepared with my facts. My last truck was MSRP of $42K at original sale. It was on the lot at $29,900 with 16,000 miles. I bought it for just under $14,000.
  20. Bassamatic

    Bassamatic keepin' the beat since the 60's Supporting Member

    The best way to buy a new car is to go to Edmunds.com. You can:
    - find out what they think of the car and read reviews and road tests.
    - Find out the true dealer's cost
    - Find out what others are paying - a real price you might expect to pay
    - Check all the options
    - Request a quote from several dealers
    - check the value of your current car
    - Go on the forums and see what the REAL finance rates are. A dealer can give you a great price and make the real profit on a higher interest rate.
    - Get tons of buying tips

    Go to your dealer and get to know the car. Call and ask when you can take the exact car you want for at LEAST a 20-30- minute test drive - roads. freeway, traffic - everything you will drive. The quick 5 minute test drive tells you nothing. See how it is to park. Check the back seat. See how it drives with 4 people in it. DO NOT BE IN A RUSH TO BUY. NEVER BUY THE FIRST TIME- you cannot be objective.

    I have had many many cars. The best buying experience came with -

    1. Buying - Selecting the car - getting all my pricing and financing information and shopping several dealers by internet. It was all done when we arrived - the car was prepped and we just walked in and signed the papers and drove home. Poof - it was done!

    2. Leasing - Getting all the information on Edmunds, including the best lease rates. I went to the dealer, checked out the car, and gave the salesman my price, the interest rate I wanted (called money factor for a lease) and the monthly rate I would agree to pay. He just took the paper to his manager, got approval and it was done. No haggling, took 30 minutes. I gave them a reasonable amount over cost (it was a brand new model so there was no super sales at that time) and I have super credit so I could demand the best interest rate.

    BE PREPARED - and it can be very easy.

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