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Will this rocker switch work well for a/b switch? Specs included

Discussion in 'Effects [BG]' started by PraiseBassing, Jun 5, 2017.


  1. PraiseBassing

    PraiseBassing Supporting Member

    Mar 6, 2017
    California
    Thanks for checking this out and I hope this is the best place for this question.

    I'm looking to build and a/b switch to use as a mute for unplugging as well as tuning when I don't want to use my pedal. Also just wanting to do some inexpensive hobby work.

    I'm looking at this rocker switch for a couple reasons. I like that it's round and easier to make a round cut out than square or rectangle. I also like the rocker vs footswitch because without an LED I can visually tell which output the signal is routed to.

    Will this particular switch have any negative effects on sound? Will it ause any popping when switching between outputs? This will serve as the only mute between cables and amps/speakers and I am hoping to silently remove cables when using my amp that lacks a mute or when using my acoustic going into a direct box.

     

    Attached Files:

  2. 40Hz

    40Hz Supporting Member

    The switch itself shouldn't be an issue for thus type if application. A switch is a switch. What will determine whether or not it's a problem is the rest of the circuit it's used in.

    The General Guitar Gadgets website has a few different DIY A/B and similar switching projects to look at. You might want to start there to see the different options you have for building your device.

    But from what you're describing, it sounds more like you're looking for a basic "kill switch" than an A/B switch.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2017
    Swimming Bird likes this.
  3. PraiseBassing

    PraiseBassing Supporting Member

    Mar 6, 2017
    California
    A killswitch was my original thought yes, but since making an a/b wouldn't take much more, I figured I would just do that so that it could still be useful in the future probably. (Key word being probably)

    Thank you for the heads up about GGG, had never heardof it!
     
  4. 40Hz

    40Hz Supporting Member

  5. PraiseBassing

    PraiseBassing Supporting Member

    Mar 6, 2017
    California
  6. boomertech

    boomertech Frank Appleton Supporting Member Commercial User

    Apr 8, 2009
    Syracuse, NY
    Designer/Owner of FEA Labs
    If you have clicking with an A/B config, you might want to build a shunting mute instead.

    Like this:

    QrnieWl.

    Use the SPDT switch instead of the relay contacts.

    -Frank
     
  7. PraiseBassing

    PraiseBassing Supporting Member

    Mar 6, 2017
    California
    That is for just input and output correct?

    By clicking do you mean when going from one to another there is a click/pop through the signal it is putting out?
     
  8. boomertech

    boomertech Frank Appleton Supporting Member Commercial User

    Apr 8, 2009
    Syracuse, NY
    Designer/Owner of FEA Labs
    You said that you are looking for a mute switch.

    You would use this circuit at the amp input to mute the signal.

    With an A/B switch you may have a click or pop on the signal when the switch is used. If you make an A/B switch, you will want the input jacks to shunt the signal to ground when they are not used. Because if you only use one input as mute, the other position of the switch needs to be terminated, or else it will be a noisy open circuit.

    -Frank
     
  9. boomertech

    boomertech Frank Appleton Supporting Member Commercial User

    Apr 8, 2009
    Syracuse, NY
    Designer/Owner of FEA Labs
    For noiseless cable connects consider these:

    np2x-au-silent-web.

    -Frank
     
  10. PraiseBassing

    PraiseBassing Supporting Member

    Mar 6, 2017
    California
    Frank, Thank you for your responses! This will be the first pedal I do, so I am still learning much of this. Do you have any resources to help me understand shunting and what is involved? Would this work in a passive configuration?

    As to the silentplugs, I recently ordered some lava cables with G&H quiet plugs, I only have active basses and these plugs do not work with them. I thought Nuetrik may be better because they're system is triggered slightly differently, but their site sights these same issues. Planet waves latching circuit breakers seem interesting to me, but I think there may be no way to visually or physically tell the difference between on or off switch position. This is why I am looking in the direction that I am.

    Thank you again Frank!
     
  11. boomertech

    boomertech Frank Appleton Supporting Member Commercial User

    Apr 8, 2009
    Syracuse, NY
    Designer/Owner of FEA Labs
    Shunting is the grounding of the signal (the signal is shunted to ground).

    In the mute circuit above, the signal is always connected to the output, either directly or thru a resistor to ground. When muted, the direct connection around the 10K resistor is opened and the signal is shunted to ground.

    I have 1 passive bass and 4 active basses that I have used those Neutrik plugs on without issues. The only thing that I have to do is sometimes lube the switching ring with fader lube to keep it from getting sticky from hand grime.;)

    -Frank
     
  12. PraiseBassing

    PraiseBassing Supporting Member

    Mar 6, 2017
    California
    Have a silentplug on the way. I'll try it on an old cable to see. Thanks for all your help Frank! I'm sure I'll still build the switch for fun and the mute to try out some shunting! I'll let you know how it goes. Thanks again!
     
  13. PraiseBassing

    PraiseBassing Supporting Member

    Mar 6, 2017
    California
    Just installed the right angle version on a cable, and it worked for silent plugging and unplugging on only 1 out of 4 of my active basses. My Sire V7 was silent in both active and passive. My two Carvins were silent with the active/passive knob pulled out to passive, but not silent in active. Lastly, my Lakland 55-01 was not silent in passive or active.

    Looks like the pedal is the way to go. Will probably just go straight to a shunting mute since I can put it in a smaller box.
     
  14. PraiseBassing

    PraiseBassing Supporting Member

    Mar 6, 2017
    California
    Everything to build the shunt mute switches should be here tomorrow. Should be able to get at least one done Friday.
     
  15. This is not true. There are a number of factors that are worth considering. For example, a switch with a high ampacity may be prone to loud popping noises, when switching. If a switch is too heavy duty, it might also be annoyingly stiff when you try to flick it back and forth. There is also the matter of make-before-break versus break-before-make. It makes a difference, in that instant that you flip from one position to the other.
     
  16. 40Hz

    40Hz Supporting Member

    Hmm...I thought I already said: "What will determine whether or not it's a problem is the rest of the circuit it's used in."

    The circuit will dictate things like make-before-break, amperage capacity, type of mount, lead style, etc. But a switch is a switch as far as the function it performs.
     
  17. PraiseBassing

    PraiseBassing Supporting Member

    Mar 6, 2017
    California
    IMG_4917.JPG
    Here we have 5 shunted(shunting?) mute switches completed and working flawlessly as well as silently! Unfortunataly I order boxes that were 2"x2" to have the smallest footprint, but I am not able to make the switch and jacks fit in them so that will have to wait until new ones come in.

    O and also a 10ft cable that was cut from an old 20ft cable that I resoldered the used end back on. Since I have mute switches, I need cables to go from the switch to amps or DI boxes so I'll use the other 10ft of cable and another 20ft cable that I have to make four 5ft cables for my basses and one more 10ft cable for my acoustic.
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2017
  18. boomertech

    boomertech Frank Appleton Supporting Member Commercial User

    Apr 8, 2009
    Syracuse, NY
    Designer/Owner of FEA Labs
    Good job! Those "x-wing" switches are known for quick failure. So, if you have any issues with them you might want to get a better switch.

    -Frank
     
  19. PraiseBassing

    PraiseBassing Supporting Member

    Mar 6, 2017
    California
    For future reference, do you have a recommendation for replacements?
     
  20. boomertech

    boomertech Frank Appleton Supporting Member Commercial User

    Apr 8, 2009
    Syracuse, NY
    Designer/Owner of FEA Labs

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