Worst tone ever.

Discussion in 'Miscellaneous [BG]' started by Munjibunga, Nov 10, 2002.

  1. Munjibunga

    Munjibunga Total Hyper-Elite Member Gold Supporting Member

    May 6, 2000
    San Diego (when not at Groom Lake)
    Independent Contractor to Bass San Diego
    Some of you may recall that my first amp was a '65 Fender Bassman 50 with a 212 cab. My assessment of the tone I got out of this rig with a '65 P-bass was that it was the worst known to humans. WRONG!

    My new band is doing Crossroads, Clapton-style, so I was listening to it on a Cream album in my car. Bruce's tone is so horrible that I had to pull over to throw up! Beyond that, his line is so disjointed and meandering, I immediately decided that I'm going to fix it up and play something meaningful, without respect to the original. It just sucks too much!

    Then, the other night at rehearsal, a couple of the folks in the band (including the leader) were discussing a former lead guitarist who said "Clapton is over-rated." I said, "Well, he is." Oop. A bit of a political faux pas. Clapton is a hero to the current lead guitarist, who happens to be the lead singer's (the boss) husband. But, I'm still in the band, so I must not suck. I did a little damage control by saying, "Well, his guitar work isn't that exceptional, but as a total musician, he's great." Hope it worked.
  2. DigMe


    Aug 10, 2002
    Waco, TX
    I agree with you on Clapton, Munji. I, for one, think the whole "Clapton is God" thing that was popular to shout at one time was all a misunderstanding. I think someone originally wrote "Clapton is good." and people got confused and dropped an 'o'. He's good..just not as great as some claim.

    I'll have to dig up a copy of Cream's CR some day and check out that nasty tone.

    brad cook
  3. I think a lot of people who don't understand the subjective nature of music like to think there is such a thing as "the greatest (guitarist/bassist/drummer) ever", and seeing as they can't tell for themselves, they just follow whatever some adamant music fan says. Then they just echo them.
  4. JimK


    Dec 12, 1999
    I like that LIVE version of Cream's "Crossroads"; that includes Bruce's tone.
    As far as "disjointed" & "meandering"-
    To me, it's the spirit of those 3 guys going for it...to me, they were not playing it safe. Personally, I'd rather have it(i.e. improv-ing & jamming) "disjointed" than totally rehearsed & "clean".
    There's a few "clams" on many early Rock recordings...IMO, that's immaterial.
    If it was 'in the moment' & 'real', I'm alright with it.

    About Clapton-
    ...there wasn't a whole lotta guys out there in the arena of '60s Rock doing what he was doing.
    Was he "god"? No.

    My first "real" rig & "real" bass was a '64 Bassman head with a '74 4x12 Bassman 100 cab with a '64 P-bass.
    I was quite satisfied with the tone I got...it's in the hands, right?

  5. rickbass

    rickbass Supporting Member

    I heard Cream in concert doing "Crossroads" back in the "Stoned Ages."

    Bruce's tone through the Marshall stacks was incredibly better than the piss-poor recording technology available for bass back then.

    Yeah, I had an EB-3 and it was a muddy thumper no matter how you had it dialed. But through those Marshall stacks, his tone was pretty doggone fine.

    Clapton was mighty fine. I just don't think most people knew he was just overamplifying rehashed blues riffs at the time.
  6. DigMe


    Aug 10, 2002
    Waco, TX
    ie - Munji should purchase new hands?

    brad cook
  7. Munjibunga

    Munjibunga Total Hyper-Elite Member Gold Supporting Member

    May 6, 2000
    San Diego (when not at Groom Lake)
    Independent Contractor to Bass San Diego
    Don't need no steenkeeng new hands. I've got an Eden amp now.
  8. jobu3

    jobu3 Artist formerly known as Big Joe

    Feb 17, 2002
    Mountain Top, PA
    oh you play eden i had no idea, in fact i've never even heard them mentioned on this site before. maybe they don't really exist? :rolleyes:
  9. JimK


    Dec 12, 1999
    ...or maybe I need new ears?

    Seriously, I thought about this again while in the "home library"-
    I do recall listening to that version of "Crossroads" back in Rick's Stoned Age(good one!) & thinking, "S***, this is impossible".
    The tune, in & of itself, is very, very basic. Bruce's take, IMO, is very active...not unlike Jaco's approach in the near future(e.g. his approach to a basic 12-bar Blues/"Dry Cleaner From Des Moines").
    Anyhoo, I expect a certain degree of "disjointedness(?)" when guys are jamming &/or energy playing.
    Anything less, IMO, means someone's playing it a little too 'safe'.

    I retired my Bassman amp...an Eden amp is now sitting on top of it in my practice room. ;)
  10. Brad Barker

    Brad Barker Supporting Member

    Apr 13, 2001
    berkeley, ca
    not to mention totally wasted!
  11. Fuzzbass

    Fuzzbass P5 with overdrive Supporting Member

    Jack's tone is definitely old-school: big phat "frowny face", not modern ScoopTone. If you don't like Jack's tone, then you probably don't like Mel Schacher, Felix Pappalardi, Andy Fraser, or other classic "electric tuba" players. ;) That's cool, it's all a big YMMV.
  12. I actually love that tone, dirty, overmidified, whatever, I love it.
  13. Munjibunga

    Munjibunga Total Hyper-Elite Member Gold Supporting Member

    May 6, 2000
    San Diego (when not at Groom Lake)
    Independent Contractor to Bass San Diego
    There y'go, guys and gals. If you suck, you can always say, "I don't like to play it safe."
  14. Peter Green ala Fleetwood Mac was known as,
    The Green God before, Clapton was God :p

    As to who is better? HMMMMMMMMMMMM?

    Bruce's bass tone was pretty muddy most of the time in my opinion.

    p.s. God this shows how old we are!
  15. DigMe


    Aug 10, 2002
    Waco, TX
    *giggle giggle*

    brad cook
  16. LOL. I must be the most dangerous player around, then.
  17. JimK


    Dec 12, 1999
    Good one.

    I'm interested in where you think Bruce is "disjointed" on that tune.
    Give me a time so I can cue it up & have a listen.
  18. I agree with JimK- I like what Jack Bruce does on that song, although the tone is a bit out-dated.

    There are times in the song when Bruce pretty much disregards the root of the chord. The problem is he typically does this when Clapton is in solo so there is no one covering the root and that, I feel, is what gives it that disjointed feeling at times. The cool thing, for me, is that adds tension to the song and it's a great release when the hit back into rhythm, on the down of the one, when Clapton starts singing again.

    If that sucks maybe I have something else, I didn't think of, to aspire to. All this time I was trying to sound good.
    :p ;)
  19. LiquidMidnight


    Dec 25, 2000
    Clapton's a great guitar player, but he holds himself back way to much, which in turns, sometimes makes me apathetic towards him. When he lets loose he's great, but when he doesn't, it's bad. I also think he should stick to what he knows best: Blues and Blues based rock. Some artist can have a heavy commercial sound and it works for them, but I never thought having a commercial direction worked for clapton.

    I agree, I always thought Bruce's tone on Crossroads was terrible. It sounded like a bunch of farting. Funny thing is, I once played through a rig that sounded exactly like it. Now his playing, OTOH I always though kicked serious ass on that song. I love how he just lets it loose. All kinds of interesting things, pentatonics, walking lines, interesting root rythms. I just love his playing on that song.
  20. I love that tone!

    And that whole bassline.

    And, anyways, there's quite a few points in that song where the bass is imitating the guitar solo, only about half a bar behind :confused: I'm not sure, but I think it's cool.

    And isn't this saying something, the youth of today admireing people from their parents generation, despite the older generation dislike them.

    Or something. I'm too tired for this.