Scarf joints

[HaMMerHeD]

So I'm having some trouble here. Consider the following:

On the left is the scarf joint that I see most often, where the headstock is cut off at an agle (in this case 13 degrees), then the headstock piece is inverted and glued back to the cut area of the neck.

The middle shows a less common way I've seen it done, where the headstock is cut off at an angle, then the headstock pieces is inverted and glued to the back of the neck.

The right option is one-piece option.

The question is: Is there any reason I would choose one scarf joint technique over the other?

It seems to me that the first option should logically be the most sturdy, as the headstock piece would be pulling against not only the neck, but the fingerboard as well. The second option looks like it'd be a lot easier to build, whereas the one-piece option is a nightmare of carving for a total amateur like me.

The scarf join, honestly, is the most intimidating cut of my entire project..because if i **** it up, the whole neck blank is more-or-less toast.

 

[Rickett Customs]

The center is what I do most, as far as scarfs are concerned. depending on what you're doing though.

I'd use the first one, If I was planning to not veneer the front and back.

The second one, you would want to cap off the front (and possibly the back), or else the joint will be visible.

Either way, they both work.

I try to stay away from anything more than 12 degrees, 10 is my norm.

Shouldn't be intimidating though, you can always re-cut it and do it again.

 

[HaMMerHeD]

Thanks Jason. Do you recommend a table saw, a miter saw, or something else for the scarf cut?

I have some Red Oak 1x3s I am practicing on before I cut into the expensive (for me anyway) maple/purpleheart laminate.

 

[Rickett Customs]

Tablesaw will make a clean cut. I use a bandsaw and clean it up with a router, on a jig.

 

[ctmullins]

Option 1 for me. Tablesaw with a jig. Take the time to make a nice jig - mine is so-so, and it produced a so-so cut that needed some trimming. Somebody around here had some nice photos of their tablesaw scarf jig, but I can't find them right now...

 

[Musiclogic]

Bandsaw and router jig, the router jig is sooo ridiculously simple to make, there is no reason to not use it unless you are routerless. But I do not do scarfs often, only lately since I started making necks for my Cool Lute shop. We should all post the jigs we use for scarfs.

 

[fuNKmaster83]

i always use the first one...

 

[iamlowsound]

I have a jig for the second designed, I haven't used it yet. I would assume that if you are doing a compound scarf joint for a fanned fret system you would want to use the second, as it makes the nut location MUCH easier to calculate. Otherwise you would get into a lot of 3D geometry.

lowsound

 

[Rickett Customs]

HammerHed,

Simplest jig:

Take 2 pieces for 3/4 or 7/8 plywood, 2' x 5" for each piece will do. Screw the piece together with wood screws (square up the edges, if needed), cut your desired angle on one end (hell, you can do it at both ends, for 2 different angles if you want). Unscrew the 2 pieces, line them up on your neck, plus the piece that you cut off. Clamp the jigs to the pieces (a little inside the piece, if you please...makes it easier), clamp down the pieces that you're surfacing as well. Take a scrap piece of wood, to put on the bottom of the router (8" x 3" or 4" will do), drill a hole big enough for the router bit. Use a bit with a bearing guide on it (put the bearing *just* through the hole).....

There you are, the worlds simplest scarf jig......

I use an almost simple type of jig, but a base is affixed to it instead.

 

[Grant Bass]

what? am i the only one stupid enough to run my scarf over the jointer? its scary but its clean!

 

[pilotjones]

what? am i the only one stupid enough to run my scarf over the jointer? its scary but its clean!

LeFay use a jointer, with the neck or headstock on a fixture on the outfeed side, and the infeed side dropped out of the way.

 

[pilotjones]

I have a jig for the second designed, I haven't used it yet. I would assume that if you are doing a compound scarf joint for a fanned fret system you would want to use the second, as it makes the nut location MUCH easier to calculate. Otherwise you would get into a lot of 3D geometry.

lowsound

I used the first.

With the compound miter, you are getting into 3D geometry regardless of the approach you take. For example, you can't just cut it and flip the headstock. You have to turn the headstock around the long way and re-cut it, as if it's another neck, producing a triangular waste piece. And the headstock does not continue on the same centerline of the neck.

 

[Big B.]

what? am i the only one stupid enough to run my scarf over the jointer? its scary but its clean!

No, you arent the only one. My joiner has a Byrd spiral head though, so the fear factor isn't nearly so high as it would be with straight knives.

 

[LedBelli Bass]

I use the method in the second illustration . . . never had any issues yet.

Also, the scarf joint is one of the first things I do after laying up a neck; it's easier to work with a trued and squared piece of stock and you are far less likely to commit an error that will cost you the neck.

 

[HaMMerHeD]

I am going with the middle option i think. It seems a bit more straightforward to me. I made a simple scarf jig today with a built in protractor. Seems like it will do the trick. Thanks folks.

 

[FBB Custom]

what? am i the only one stupid enough to run my scarf over the jointer? its scary but its clean!

I use method #3 (no scarf) but I run the freshly cut headstock angle over my jointer. Before I had a legitimate jointer, I used a router jig.

 

[iamlowsound]

I used the first.

With the compound miter, you are getting into 3D geometry regardless of the approach you take. For example, you can't just cut it and flip the headstock. You have to turn the headstock around the long way and re-cut it, as if it's another neck, producing a triangular waste piece. And the headstock does not continue on the same centerline of the neck.

Yes, thanks for mentioning that. What I was getting at, is that it is easier to locate the nut location, because there is no 3D geometry to do that. Your cut line is simply your nut location. If you do it by the first method, there is.

lowsound

 

[Rip Topaz]

I use method #3 (no scarf) but I run the freshly cut headstock angle over my jointer. Before I had a legitimate jointer, I used a router jig.

Are you using some sort of jig to run it over the jointer?

 

[pilotjones]

Yes, thanks for mentioning that. What I was getting at, is that it is easier to locate the nut location, because there is no 3D geometry to do that. Your cut line is simply your nut location. If you do it by the first method, there is.

lowsound

Right. If you don't do any geometry calculation, then one way you know where the nut is in relation to the body end of the neck, but not how long your headstock will end up; the other way you know where the nut is in relation to the top of the headstock, but not in relation to the body end of the neck. This is the same as with a conventional straight scarf.

 

[FBB Custom]

Are you using some sort of jig to run it over the jointer?

Nope. The router method is potentially safer. I can't say I recommend using the jointer for safety reasons, but it is quicker for me, and personally I am comfortable doing it. Do not do this on an under-powered jointer or with dull knives. You do not want the piece to chatter over the knives.

I clean up the edge of the cut with a hand plane before running it. I also make sure the headstock face is long enough (7"+) so that there is enough wood on the tables at all times to get a flat face. I hold down the headstock with a good push block and my left arm supports the neck shaft.