• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Alright. I'm buying a half stack. See what I'm thinking and throw some advice at me

Noshtero

Noshtero

Dec 2, 2007
538
248
Chicago, IL
#1
Edit **** I changed the title to half stack. It looks like I'm starting with a higher powered half stack and seeing if I really need a full stack. I hopefully won't. ****

I'm sure a lot of you read my last post about buying an Acoustic B410 in a pinch, and wondering what I should do.

Well... I'm dumping the whole mess and buying a new amp and stack of speakers.

So... What to buy? I have the opportunity to get a good deal on Hartke stuff because my local shop sells it and I get a discount. So I could go with:
Hartke LH1000
Hartke HX410
Hartke HX115
That'd be 1000 watts at 4ohm into a 4x10 and 1x15.

Or I could go Avatar:
Avatar Neo B410
Avatar Neo B212

I could still go with the Hartke amp. I won't be able to touch much else with that kind of power at that kind of price. In that price range I'd be talking:
Markbass LMIII
Genz Benz Shuttle 6.0

So here's the kick-in-pants. I do not have the ability to listen to ANY of this stuff with the exception possibly of the Hartke stuff, but I even doubt that as he doesn't stock much and would most likely only order it if I was buying.

So here's my thoughts:
I've heard the Hartke rig doesn't get really loud, though, I'm not sure what "really loud" means. I think my current setup (GK BL600, GK 410GLX, Acoustic B410) is nearly loud enough, but not quite, and it's only 300 watts. I would think that 1000 watts running into that 4x10 and 1x15 would be quite a bit louder. I've heard nothing but good about the Avatars.

I basically want a stack that is loud enough (with good tone) for me to play as big an outdoor event as I would play before I just switch over to a PA. My price range is $1500 or so for the whole thing, and I prefer not to buy used equipment.

So... most likely I could get the Hartke's for around the price of the Avatars. So if it was a toss up on price, which would you go with and why?

Then as far as amps. Hartke LH1000, Markbass LMIII, or Genz Benz Shuttle 6.0, and why?

Also, talk to me about ohms. The Hartke's are 8 ohm cabs, so together make a 4ohm load, and the LH1000 is rated at 4 ohm. Are with the LMIII or Shuttle 6.0 stable down to 2 ohm? I have the opportunity to get the Avatars at 4 ohm for a combined 2 ohm load.

Thanks guys! Your wisdom is MUCH appreciated.
 
#2
I think that no matter what, you've made good decisions on what kind of gear you want. You have to do the process of elimination now yourself. It's all such good gear I don't think I could help. But I do own the Shuttle 6.0 and an Avatar 212 @ 4 ohms. With a VT. Dominates...

The LMII is MUCH warmer, that is what it does really well.
 
#3
With that budget, you owe it to yourself to check out the threads on the Carvin LS1503 and the B1500. You'd be in the same boat with not being able to try before you buy, but you'd save some cash and have a 10 day period to try and return, no questions asked. A couple of those cabs with the B1500 would definitely be loud enough!
 
#4
I'm not sure that using a 4-10 with a 1-15 full range is the best idea. I'd be more inclined to either biamp, if that option is available, or go with two identical cabs. But whatever works for you.

For $1500, you have some other choices you could consider. Since you're not going to be able to audion the gear live anyway, if I understand you, you might also consider Carvin:

Link Removed

Link Removed

Link Removed
 
#6
With that Carvin package with a B1500 and 2 BRX10.4NEO's for $1600, it beats out the price of any of the other cabs assuming I was set on the B1500 head. A B1500 and 2 Avatar B410's would be $1674.

I've never run anything but 10's. Am I missing anything by not having 12's or a 15? I really want bass that you can feel in your chest, ya know? I've held to the "10's have more surface area which means more volume" theory. But whenever I read reviews of companies that sell both 410s and 212s or 115s, I always read "you really need to have one of each to cover the whole spectrum".
 
#7
Noshtero said:
With that Carvin package with a B1500 and 2 BRX10.4NEO's for $1600, it beats out the price of any of the other cabs assuming I was set on the B1500 head. A B1500 and 2 Avatar B410's would be $1674.

I've never run anything but 10's. Am I missing anything by not having 12's or a 15? I really want bass that you can feel in your chest, ya know? I've held to the "10's have more surface area which means more volume" theory. But whenever I read reviews of companies that sell both 410s and 212s or 115s, I always read "you really need to have one of each to cover the whole spectrum".
Click to expand...

It's really down more to the entire cabinet design than to just the diameter of the drivers. For example, an Acme B-2, with two 10s, has more true low end than most 1-15s (it's also relatively inefficient, but that's another issue).
 
#8
IMO:
1. You'd be ahead of the game by using (2) 4x10s instead of a 4x10 + a 1x15. I used to play through an Ampeg B4R, 4x10 + 1x15. I tried biamping and full range, but was never satisfied with that combination. I'd definitely go with (2) 4x10s if given the opportunity again.
2. I paid less than $1,000 for all of that about 3 years ago - used.
3. You'll be limiting yourself quite a bit if you only want new for $1,500. If you're dropping that kind of change for a new rig, I'm not sure why you wouldn't consider "new to you / used".
Good shopping, regardless of what you decide!
 
#9
Noshtero said:
With that Carvin package with a B1500 and 2 BRX10.4NEO's for $1600, it beats out the price of any of the other cabs assuming I was set on the B1500 head. A B1500 and 2 Avatar B410's would be $1674.

I've never run anything but 10's. Am I missing anything by not having 12's or a 15? I really want bass that you can feel in your chest, ya know? I've held to the "10's have more surface area which means more volume" theory. But whenever I read reviews of companies that sell both 410s and 212s or 115s, I always read "you really need to have one of each to cover the whole spectrum".
Click to expand...

The BRX series have pretty good bottom end. Very popular and generally well-regarded cabs. I recently bought a BRX 10.2 and it's a very noticeable step up from the regular Carvin 2x10 neo line.
 
#13
The LH1000 actually delivers 1200w into the HX410 + HX115 in bridged mode (Bass Gear Mag issue 3). This is the rig I have and I'm not sure where you read/heard this rig doesn't go loud? It goes very loud indeed. In fact it shifted ceiling tiles in the first rehearsal room I tried it in at full(ish) volume. Although the 410 +115 config seems a little old fashioned, it really works with the LH1K rig. If you can get a good deal, and you like the LH/HX tone, then it's a massive bang for your bucks. I use a Tech21 vt bass pedal in front to get additional EQ options.
 
#14
Just a bit of opinionizing here; I recently bought a Hartke LH500 and quickly returned it for a Shuttle 6.0. The Hartke was a great price and sounded very good on its own. When I brought it to band practice though, I couldn't get it to stand out in the mix at all. It wasn't a matter of volume, it had that. I EQ'ed every which way 'til Sunday and just couldn't get my notes to stand out where I could really hear what I was doing. It seemed the natural voicing of the amp kept it buried by the drums and guitar.

The situation was a three-piece hard rock band and the guitarist running through a triple-rec. FWIW, I think that amp may work better in other situations like jazz.

I'm quite thrilled with the Shuttle going into an Avatar B410. A pair of 8-ohm B410s driven by a Shuttle would bring down buildings.:bassist:
 
#15
Noshtero said:
With that Carvin package with a B1500 and 2 BRX10.4NEO's for $1600, it beats out the price of any of the other cabs assuming I was set on the B1500 head. A B1500 and 2 Avatar B410's would be $1674.

I've never run anything but 10's. Am I missing anything by not having 12's or a 15? I really want bass that you can feel in your chest, ya know? I've held to the "10's have more surface area which means more volume" theory. But whenever I read reviews of companies that sell both 410s and 212s or 115s, I always read "you really need to have one of each to cover the whole spectrum".
Click to expand...

Consider that Carvin package would likely be enough horsepower to completely bury nearly any band that you play with. (not a bad thing in some situations;)) You may need a structural engineer to check out the integrity of the venue before firing up such a beast.
 
#16
If I were to get a 4x10 cabinet, I would probably go with a 4ohm. I don't want to haul two large cabinets around with me. Besides, I think a 4x10 is plenty for an outdoor event. The LMIII should provide more than enough power, and it's easy enough to carry. I hate making multiple trips back to the car. :D

Peace,
Joe
 
#18
NWB said:
Consider that Carvin package would likely be enough horsepower to completely bury nearly any band that you play with. (not a bad thing in some situations;)) You may need a structural engineer to check out the integrity of the venue before firing up such a beast.
Click to expand...

I'd actually recommend just getting the B1500 + single BRX10.4 at first and letting the remaining cash sit in the bank until you're sure you need it. Once you've got a feel for that setup, you can experiment with a borrowed 18" or 15" to see how it works with the sound, if you're still thinking that way.

You may find that the single 4x10 cab is enough for your needs. If not, you can always get another cab later.
 
#20
UncleFluffy said:
I'd actually recommend just getting the B1500 + single BRX10.4 at first and letting the remaining cash sit in the bank until you're sure you need it. Once you've got a feel for that setup, you can experiment with a borrowed 18" or 15" to see how it works with the sound, if you're still thinking that way.

You may find that the single 4x10 cab is enough for your needs. If not, you can always get another cab later.
Click to expand...

Ya I was kinda thinking the same thing. I wish I had the means to try a "serious" 410. My experience comes from playing a GK 410GLX through a GK BL600. So I had 180ish watts going to a cheaper 410 and it wasn't very loud at all outside. I'm trying to tell myself that the Carvin B1500 + BRX10.4 will be staggeringly louder, but I wish I could try before I buy. I understand Carvin has a 10-day trial, but I'll still eat $200 in shipping to get it and send it back should I not like it.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back