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Acoustic bass fetish club Part 2

Please tell me, do you observe any relationship between the length of the scale and the unplgd volume or timbre of the sound? Or does the acoustic sound mainly depend on the size and quality of the body?

Loaded question.
So many factors involved here.

Unplugged volume for me comes down to string selection, playing technique, solid or laminated top, body size and shape and string height.

Plugged in playing also varies with strings, Pre-Amp, but body size also comes into play for deepness. Timbre changes with neck scale from deep for long scale and to tubby/thump for shorter scale, but it isn't always the rule.

You'll hear all kinds of opinions here as volume gets confused with tone. You can get a louder volume and have a less deep tone. You can have a deeper tone and yet have a lower volume. There's volume that you as the player hear which is totally different from what those around you hear. Deep tone you can feel as you play, especially a solid wood bass. Most good ABGs will at least have a solid wood top. If you have an ABG that is all laminated woods you'll definitely be better off playing it plugged in. Laminated wood just doesn't resonate like solid wood, but then again, bracing is a factor as well as the top wood thickness. However, a bass made of all laminated woods can still have a decent deep tone when plugged in.

Then there's body size & depth. The EB Earthwood is worshipped here, but I've never played one. Based on its size and construction I have to assume it is at least deep and loud. 18 1/2" lower bout width; 14" upper bout width; 6 1/2" depth; 25" body length, 50" total length, 34" scale. This is a big bass.

Tacoma Thunderchief is another worshipped ABG. Again, I never played one. TC is 17 3/4" across at widest bottom point; 4 1/2" deep" 12 1/2" across the body at upper bout, 21 1/2" body-only length.

The Guild B-50 gets legendary praise, but has no electronics. Again, I never played one. Scale length: 30 7/8", Body width: 18", Body depth: 6 3/4", Body length: 21 3/8"

Unplugged volume is important to some, while plugged in deep tone is more important to others. Then there's the folks who say 'if I have to plug in I might as well play my P bass', who completely don't get it and aren't really worth getting their opinion if you're serious about an ABG.

If you play the dead-fish handshake light touch style with super low action you'll never get heard playing unplugged unless the person is your significant other sitting in your lap regardless of what ABG you play.

There's an ABG that has has a pre-amp that I can't praise enough and yet headstock snobs dump on it without ever even touching one. It has the APHEX Aural Exciter & Big Bottom circuitry. Plugged in, it is just awesome. I'd love to experiment with this preamp by putting it into other ABGs to see what it would do compared to the venerable Fishman preamp which you find in a lot of good ABG basses.

Cutout versus no cutout. Some swear not to play a cutout as the body has less internal area.
Body shape size: Bigger is generally regarded as better, but this subject doesn't seem to delve in body shape style like comparing Jumbo to Dreadnaught to Concert to blah, blah, blah which I think is also worth exploring as this too impacts internal area.
Acoustic+Guitars+Sizes+Dylan+Baker+Music.png

The dreadnaught's I own do have more internal area, but not necessarily solid wood all around or at least solid tops. The Ovation Celebrity I own has a rounded composite back and that bass has a very surprising deep dark tone. However, the round back makes it awkward or at least feel awkward to play.

Playing with a pick makes a huge difference in unplugged playing. Type of pick also makes a difference. I like Wedgie picks as they are made of hard rubber and have less 'clack' sound.
Link Removed
The ABG topic is an objective opinion and subjective opinion mine field. Even with my 22 ABGs, I don't have all of them with the same strings, so even I can't have a really objective opinion as much as a subjective opinion when I compare them.

And then besides all of this there is playing comfort. Generally the bigger the body the less playing comfort there is especially when playing for extended durations.

Also, there's feedback issues with playing plugged in. Know where the best place to be positioned with regard to your amp location. A notch filter is a godsend, but not all ABG pre-amps have one, but they really do help with feedback.

You've heard this a million times, but it is so true...try before you buy. However I'd add take someone with you to hear unplugged playing while you play and then switch as what you hear while playing unplugged is very different from what you'll hear when listening to the player rather than yourself.

Standard TB qualifier: Just MHO, YMMV
 
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1975 is the date I've read. In fact, I'd already relayed it to you in this post.
Yes you did, and thank you, but I've yet to see or read something officially from Guild that gives the actual start date of the B-50 production. I wish the Guild website had an 'archive' page.
 
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While searching for information on the Guild B-50 I came across this beauty which I don't ever recall reading about here on TB, but then maybe dementia is creeping in and I read it last week? Who knows, but here is what I came across: Guild B-54

B54CE Standard designed and built with Guild's revered jumbo body design, it features a solid Sitka spruce top with red spruce bracing, solid maple sides and Guild's unique arched laminated maple back.

Guild B54CE Acoustic Electric Bass Guitar Features

  • Arched laminated back
  • Red spruce bracing
  • Satin finished mahogany neck with slim profile
  • Ivoroid body binding
  • Lightweight Gotoh die-cast tuners
  • Bone nut, saddle and bridge pins

The onboard Fishman Matrix Infinity pickup system provides a natural amplified sound. Its features include soundhole-mounted volume and tone controls and a built-in voicing switch that lets you choose between two different voice settings-one with enhanced bass response and one with a flat voicing that reduces boominess and helps you cut through the mix. Couple this with the onboard tone control and you're ready to tackle any performance situation.


Product Specifications
Guild B54CE Acoustic Bass Guitar Specifications
Body
  • Body Back : Arched Maple
  • String Nut: Ivoroid
  • Body Shape: Jumbo
  • Body Sides: Maple
  • Body Style: Hollow Body
  • Body Top: Solid Sitka Spruce
  • Bracing: Scalloped Red Spruce
  • Purfling: Black/Ivoroid/Black

Special Electronics: Fishman Matrix Infinity End-Pin Mounted Preamp with Volume and Tone Module

Hardware
  • Fretboard: Rosewood
  • String Nut: Bone
  • Hardware: Chrome
  • String Nut: Bone
  • Tuning Machines: Gotoh Lightweight Die-Cast

Neck
  • Fretboard Radius: 12 inches (305 mm)
  • Fretboard: Rosewood
  • Neck Material: Mahogany
  • Number of Frets: 22
  • Nut Width: 1.625 inches (41.3 mm)
  • Position Inlays: Pearl Dot
  • Scale Length: 34 inches (864 mm)

Accessories
  • Case/Gig Bag: Deluxe Hardshell
  • Strings: D'Addario EXP PBB170 Coated Phosphor Bronze Bass, (.045-.100 Gauges)
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Anyone here fortunate enough to own or play one?
 
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Yes you did, and thank you, but I've yet to see or read something officially from Guild that gives the actual start date of the B-50 production. I wish the Guild website had an 'archive' page.
The date may have to be emended to 1976.
The Guild B-50 appears in this price list, "effective November 1, 1976"
https://www.gad.net/Blog/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/Guild-1976-11-Price-List.pdf
as confirmed by Hans Moust's Guild Guitar Book: The Company and the Instruments : 1952-1977
Guild Guitar Book
and by Ted Beesley's Guitar History : Volume #5 : Guild Guitars
Guild Guitars
in turn as noted by a gentleperson from Smithfield Fair (mentioned above by @GretschWretch), who also originally thought it was 1975
The Great B-50
 
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If I were in the market for a bass, I'd be looking hard at the B50/B30 examples, especially since Earthwoods in decent condition are now fetching prices getting up around $3000 USD, and the new Euro stuff is in that region too.

However, my Mota does nicely in the BA-ABG area, with the same dimensions as an Earthwood, lots of unplugged volume, and a very resonant UB tone. My Tacoma Thunderchief is very nearly as loud unplugged, with a thumpier tone and a really nice neck. For intimate unplugged or amped use, my Martin B-1E is just so sweet and rich, and easy to play as well. Not quite as loud unplugged.

@B-Mac is entirely right about all of the things that play into ABG output. I would say that if I was shopping for a loud (unplugged) ABG, i'd look at body size, construction (including materials), and scale, in that order.

Gimme a solid wood (spruce over mahogany preferably), well-built X-braced archback with a 19x25x6 box and a 34 scale, and I will move the world.
 
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The date may have to be emended to 1976.
The Guild B-50 appears in this price list, "effective November 1, 1976"
https://www.gad.net/Blog/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/Guild-1976-11-Price-List.pdf
as confirmed by Hans Moust's Guild Guitar Book: The Company and the Instruments : 1952-1977
Guild Guitar Book
and by Ted Beesley's Guitar History : Volume #5 : Guild Guitars
Guild Guitars
in turn as noted by a gentleperson from Smithfield Fair (mentioned above by @GretschWretch), who also originally thought it was 1975
The Great B-50
Thanks for the follow up :thumbsup:
 
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The date may have to be emended to 1976.
The Guild B-50 appears in this price list, "effective November 1, 1976"
https://www.gad.net/Blog/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/Guild-1976-11-Price-List.pdf
as confirmed by Hans Moust's Guild Guitar Book: The Company and the Instruments : 1952-1977
Guild Guitar Book
and by Ted Beesley's Guitar History : Volume #5 : Guild Guitars
Guild Guitars
in turn as noted by a gentleperson from Smithfield Fair (mentioned above by @GretschWretch), who also originally thought it was 1975
The Great B-50

This

Smithfield Fair - Wikipedia

gives a pretty good timeline of the band's history. I bought and still have the band's first lp, and I thought no later than 1973. Turns out it could not have been earlier than 1977. The band group photo on the back includes a B50.
 
There's an ABG that has has a pre-amp that I can't praise enough and yet headstock snobs dump on it without ever even touching one. It has the APHEX Aural Exciter & Big Bottom circuitry. Plugged in, it is just awesome. I'd love to experiment with this preamp by putting it into other ABGs to see what it would do compared to the venerable Fishman preamp which you find in a lot of good ABG basses.

Would this by any chance be a Dean? If so, it totally lines up with my experience. As noted earlier in this thread, my first real ABG experience was with an old and inexpensive Dean that a friend loaned me, and while the acoustic-only sound is just sort of OK, it totally delivers when plugged in. Warm, substantial, and satisfying, especially when I put on d'Addario tapewounds. For what it's worth, it has a Shadow P7 pickup/preamp, so maybe the mojo is in the instrument itself?
 
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Would this by any chance be a Dean? If so, it totally lines up with my experience. As noted earlier in this thread, my first real ABG experience was with an old and inexpensive Dean that a friend loaned me, and while the acoustic-only sound is just sort of OK, it totally delivers when plugged in. Warm, substantial, and satisfying, especially when I put on d'Addario tapewounds. For what it's worth, it has a Shadow P7 pickup/preamp, so maybe the mojo is in the instrument itself?
It's a Dean, but not the Performer Plus 32" with the Shadow Pre-amp, but that's a good one too.
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The one I'm referring to that I highly recommend is the Exotica Quilt Maple 34" with Aphex.
IMG_7366.JPG
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@jd56hawk is a true believer too.
 
While searching for information on the Guild B-50 I came across this beauty which I don't ever recall reading about here on TB, but then maybe dementia is creeping in and I read it last week? Who knows, but here is what I came across: Guild B-54

B54CE Standard designed and built with Guild's revered jumbo body design, it features a solid Sitka spruce top with red spruce bracing, solid maple sides and Guild's unique arched laminated maple back.

Guild B54CE Acoustic Electric Bass Guitar Features

  • Arched laminated back
  • Red spruce bracing
  • Satin finished mahogany neck with slim profile
  • Ivoroid body binding
  • Lightweight Gotoh die-cast tuners
  • Bone nut, saddle and bridge pins

The onboard Fishman Matrix Infinity pickup system provides a natural amplified sound. Its features include soundhole-mounted volume and tone controls and a built-in voicing switch that lets you choose between two different voice settings-one with enhanced bass response and one with a flat voicing that reduces boominess and helps you cut through the mix. Couple this with the onboard tone control and you're ready to tackle any performance situation.


Product Specifications
Guild B54CE Acoustic Bass Guitar Specifications
Body
  • Body Back : Arched Maple
  • String Nut: Ivoroid
  • Body Shape: Jumbo
  • Body Sides: Maple
  • Body Style: Hollow Body
  • Body Top: Solid Sitka Spruce
  • Bracing: Scalloped Red Spruce
  • Purfling: Black/Ivoroid/Black

Special Electronics: Fishman Matrix Infinity End-Pin Mounted Preamp with Volume and Tone Module

Hardware
  • Fretboard: Rosewood
  • String Nut: Bone
  • Hardware: Chrome
  • String Nut: Bone
  • Tuning Machines: Gotoh Lightweight Die-Cast

Neck
  • Fretboard Radius: 12 inches (305 mm)
  • Fretboard: Rosewood
  • Neck Material: Mahogany
  • Number of Frets: 22
  • Nut Width: 1.625 inches (41.3 mm)
  • Position Inlays: Pearl Dot
  • Scale Length: 34 inches (864 mm)

Accessories
  • Case/Gig Bag: Deluxe Hardshell
  • Strings: D'Addario EXP PBB170 Coated Phosphor Bronze Bass, (.045-.100 Gauges)
View attachment 4689151 View attachment 4689152 View attachment 4689153 View attachment 4689154 View attachment 4689155 View attachment 4689156 View attachment 4689158 View attachment 4689159 View attachment 4689160 View attachment 4689161 View attachment 4689162

Anyone here fortunate enough to own or play one?
Guild B-54CE STD, 2012, Natural Gloss Finish | Reverb
I also see that for sell . Wonder what it's all about? Reissue of gulid b50?
 
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Guild B-54CE STD, 2012, Natural Gloss Finish | Reverb
I also see that for sell . Wonder what it's all about? Reissue of gulid b50?
All I know is that it basically is a B-50 with a preamp. Controls are in the sound hole and the plug is at the bottom strap lock.
This is where I found my referenced info.
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
Other than this I know absolutely nothing about this bass except now with these two references I feel G.A.S. starting...oy vey...
 
The B-54CE doesn't really resemble the B-50 or B-30, so it couldn't really be called a "reissue". It more closely resembles the B500, which was smaller, also maple and had a cutaway (and a pickup, I believe, since Nathan East played one on Eric Clapton's "unplugged" performance)...

1993B_500.jpg


Guild B-54CE STD, 2012, Natural Gloss Finish | Reverb
I also see that for sell . Wonder what it's all about? Reissue of gulid b50?
 
The B-54CE doesn't really resemble the B-50 or B-30, so it couldn't really be called a "reissue". It more closely resembles the B500, which was smaller, also maple and had a cutaway (and a pickup, I believe, since Nathan East played one on Eric Clapton's "unplugged" performance)...

View attachment 4689447
Thanks for this clarification/additional info. I'd really like to know more about these other earlier Guild ABG's besides the modern 140, 240 and mini as well as the older B-50 and B-30. The more I dig the more models I see mentioned in other forums, but without any pix.

So far I haven't found any actual body size dimensions for it.
Guild Announces B-54CE Standard Acoustic Bass Guitar

https://www.gad.net/Blog/guild-guitar-catalogs/
 
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