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a rare conflict

DaveParker39

DaveParker39

World Heavyweight Champion
Supporting Member
Feb 28, 2022
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#1
so, I've been in this band for about a third of it's existence, founded by two cousins, guitarists.

At one point it was a singer who played bass/keys, two guitarists (who sang a bit), and a drummer.

The most long standing lineup has been virtuoso lead singer (no other instrument), two guitarists (sing more than they used to), bassist (me, I sing lead and harmony), and drummer.

So, a 5 piece.

One of the founding cousins has been jamming with a keyboard player he really wants to try out with us. I guess this keyboard player learned a bunch of our material and is one of his close friends.

As far as the idea of having a keyboard sound in our band, that's really not an issue for me. It might be a tight squeeze on some of our stages, but I certainly don't object. I don't see it being a huge value add, but I don't object. And I'm sure he's good... the member in question has a good ear.

What I do object to is a 5 way split becoming a 6 way split when it comes to finances.

Despite having a reputation of one of the better, if not best, cover bands in the area, it's been really hard to get compensated fairly lately. I'm not gonna use exact numbers because I'm sure we do better than some people but really, a 3 hour gig is 5-6 hours of work and the more it gets divided up the less feasible it is, especially factoring in travel.

The thing is, I know I'm not the only one in the band who feels this way, but I don't want to go having a bunch of private conversations with band members to gang up about it, and I also don't feel qualified to be the big stick in the mud about it, but I don't know if I can afford dedicating as much time to the band as I do if the money keeps going down.

Part of me hopes it will just work itself out... we'll jam, realize it's impractical, and move forward...I suggested we jam with him and reserve him for things like weddings but the more I talk to the founder/cousin about it, the more it seems like he really wants to bring him on and also feels a personal loyalty to him.

What the heck do I do? We all really get along well and are pretty democratic about it all.
 
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#3
buldog5151bass said:
Time for a band sit down, before things go any further. If you all get along and things are democratic, people should be to speak their minds. The band decides if they want to try it.

Maybe with a keyboardist you'll get better paying gigs. Maybe not.
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I think it would be great at a wedding. I'm not so sure about the bar gigs.
 
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#6
DaveParker39 said:
I think it would be great at a wedding. I'm not so sure about the bar
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It sounds like you have vocals and two melody instruments (the guitars). I can see two reasons to add a keyboard:

1. You want to do different songs that need keys.

2. You want to (and have the contacts to) move to a higher tier of gigs (weddings, corporate).

Unless that is where you to go, and feel you can, as you said, it is just one more mouth to feed, and work a schedule around.

Again, the band needs to make a firm decision, and make it before the keyboardist plays with you. If the band is a democracy, as you say, majority rules.
DaveParker39 said:
gigs.
Click to expand...
 
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#8
It seems to me that a good, talented keyboard player inevitably is going to change the flavour or your band sound and maybe even start changing the nature of your playlist. Is that something all of the current band members are on board with?

I think that question is just as important as the pay split and should be discussed fully before agreeing to anything.
 
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#10
KenD said:
It seems to me that a good, talented keyboard player inevitably is going to change the flavour or your band sound and maybe even start changing the nature of your playlist. Is that something all of the current band members are on board with?

I think that question is just as important as the pay split and should be discussed fully before agreeing to anything.
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It's an interesting question as I am the most junior member of the band.

I think it would be great when we do weddings and need to do ballads but most people come to hear us play rockin guitar driven dancy stuff.

The only keyboard YOU GOTTA DO THIS SONG request we got regularly was don't stop believin and we just pulled that off by me playing a piano tone (heavy chorus) for the bass parts and the high key parts played by one of the guitarists fingerstyle (for the intro) and no one knew the difference.
 
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#11
DaveParker39 said:
It's an interesting question as I am the most junior member of the band.

I think it would be great when we do weddings and need to do ballads but most people come to hear us play rockin guitar driven dancy stuff.

The only keyboard YOU GOTTA DO THIS SONG request we got regularly was don't stop believin and we just pulled that off by me playing a piano tone (heavy chorus) for the bass parts and the high key parts played by one of the guitarists fingerstyle (for the intro) and no one knew the difference.
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So if you don't NEED a keyboard player to satisfy your audience's expectations and likes, why bring one in?

Otherwise it sounds like you're being asked, in effect, to take a pay cut just to satisfy your co-founder's friendship.
 
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#12
KenD said:
So if you don't NEED a keyboard player to satisfy your audience's expectations and likes, why bring one in?

Otherwise it sounds like you're being asked, in effect, to take a pay cut just to satisfy your co-founder's friendship.
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it does feel that way
and in fairness, our bl is a good guy he's not often on power trips, but your assessment has merit
 
#13
It’s smart of you not to have separate convos with various members, that always leads to drama.
If the cousins are the BLs, discuss your concerns with them as democratically as possible.
It’s definitely a delicate situation that should be dealt with delicately, but if you’re a member of the group you have the right to know what’s happening.
 
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#14
Better to have the conversation now vs later. I don’t think it’s inappropriate to say you’re not against adding the keys player if it’s a good fit, but doing so means the band likely needs to raise its rates to make the gig financially viable. What’s everyone’s consensus on trying to up the pay another x%?

Maybe they already have a plan. Maybe they don’t have a plan and didn’t think it’d be a big deal. What’s their reaction either way? It doesn’t have to be confrontational, and their response will tell you all you need to know to determine if you’d like to continue forward or not. At least from my interpretation of your post, you don’t want to leave but you’d feel no other option if the pay didn’t at least stay at parity (or preferably improve).
 
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#17
If the issue is how the money is divided, you could say you're open to trying out an additional member but would want to increase the band fee by 1/6 so you can keep going, otherwise he's being subsidised. Regarding the stage issue, I would trim down to a 3 piece and keep the rate the same - more space and more cash :) Hope this is helpful :)
 
#19
Around here the max a typical bar gig will pay...unless a special event.. is $300 per hr for a top drawing band.
3 pieces aren't really going to get that though so its 4 piece and upwards. Thats $75 per hr per head x 4 max
If the band wants to split that more ways thats on them, and personally if another member makes a big difference, then I'm cool with that. I'm not into makeweights for whatever reason though and some bands limit members to get a bigger slice because its their prime source of income.

Function and party gigs are a whole different price structure.
 

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