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Alembic Time-Travel Price

#21
j.kernodle said:
put a deposit down on a wal this march. the only thing that's made it somewhat bearable is the fact that it takes almost 2 years for him to finish it. :)
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This is something I view as a bonus: Long lead times for construction give you an opportunity to save money for items that you wouldn't otherwise be able to afford!

I'm going through a similar situation with a handbuilt bicycle frame now: The framebuilder is known for having a very long lead time; at the time I put my deposit down he'd advertised the wait as somewhere between 5-6 years. This was fine by me...because at that time I didn't have the money to buy the frame if it had been available immediately. So I've spent the past few years religiously socking money away every month into long-term high-yield savings vehicles, and when the phone finally rings and he says "You're next in line" I'll not only have enough cash to buy the frame but I should have enough leftover to buy a Wal bass also!


More on topic: I remember a Musician's Friend (?) catalog from around 1973 or 74 that showed Alembic Series I basses for ~$1,600 ...and all I could think was "Wow, what could possibly make a bass worth $1,600?!?!?" Fast forward forty-something years, and I've now got a half dozen basses that all cost ~$1,600 or more

...but, sadly, no Alembics. Maybe if I start saving now...
 
#22
And just cause it's Sunday and I'm sitting around thinking about basses, I'll add these <few more cents of thoughts.

Alembic gets a bad rap on a somewhat regular basis from various bass players, which is unfortunate. They are a small company with great people that provide some very fine instruments.

Most players are either unable or unwilling to afford a new Series bass (holds hand up), or not patient enough with the used market to let a good deal come their way. Which is unfortunate, because every bass player really should spend a little time with a Series loaded Alembic. They really sound magnificent. They can absolutely dominate a mix.

The lower priced models are Alembic's efforts to reach more modest budgets. They are also nice instruments, but fall more into the category of instruments that can get lost in certain mixes, IME. The most troublesome mix is the typical two loud guitar situations. Those are pretty common, and often lead a bass player to certain conclusions about what kind of basses are useful. I would not use or recommend an Alembic for that kind of situation.

Which does not mean that the Alembic is the problem. There are plenty of other musical situations where the Alembic can shine. That's one thing on TB I've seen; there are players in a huge variety of musical situations. Better to stay open minded; because across the span of a playing career, we are most likely to find ourselves in different situations.

:)
 
#23
I've always thought the distillate was a great simple version of the filter electronics that still had the look of the series bass. I'm a big believer in filter electronics and the unique sound possibilities they give you.

Alembic used to play in the sub 2500 dollar range with the epic and the Orion I wish they'd see fit to bring back some instrument in that price range but I suppose we'll just have to make do with the used market.
 
#24
> Why? People can't have an opinion that's opposite to the rest of the thread?

It's not that people aren't allowed to have an opinion. They are. It's just that some people get caught up in exercising their freedom of speech, without bothering to consider whether or not it serves a constructive purpose or whether it only serves a deleterious purpose.

The soup tastes better when somebody doesn't throw a turd into it just because he can.
 
#27
awilkie84 said:
Why? People can't have an opinion that's opposite to the rest of the thread?
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You can't call a bass that's not yours ugly. Read our forum-specific rules, please, so you'll be aware of them next time.
 
#28
I think that while the Series II electronics would obviously be the way to go all else being equal, you can still do 'the Alembic thing' on a bass that has the Signature electronics. A balanceK Mark King Deluxe 5 with sig electronics and a heart omega would definitely work for me :)
 
#30
j.kernodle said:
I've always thought the distillate was a great simple version of the filter electronics that still had the look of the series bass. I'm a big believer in filter electronics and the unique sound possibilities they give you.

Alembic used to play in the sub 2500 dollar range with the epic and the Orion I wish they'd see fit to bring back some instrument in that price range but I suppose we'll just have to make do with the used market.
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I've really had minimal experience with filter based pre-amps. I tried Mike Z's ACG and really had no idea how to use the pre-amp. I've been messing with 3-4 band preamps for perhaps a little too long.
 
#31
While I appreciate your right to make a statement like this, as the Partner here at Fodera in charge of dealing with business management issues, I'd urge you to search Talk Bass for many of the very extensive posts that I have made about pricing and costs. The reality (for better or worse) is that we a roughly 10% margin business. Doing anything at the highest level of which you are capable of usually comes at a cost.

Our pricing is set at a level that allows us to build at the quality level we have set for ourselves and remain a viable business. I'd welcome you to pay a visit to our shop and see how we do things. A local film student did this short video about us last year. It does a good job of catching the essence of this place.

We are not the right builder for everyone, but for those who respect and care about what we do, we believe that we have made the right decisions about how to build things and price them to ensure that we can continue to make the very finest stringed instruments we are capable of building.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BmpvtoCHexY

Kindest regards,

Jason

Root 5 said:
I think many of the so-called "Boutique" brands are obscenely over-priced today. There just isn't enough work to be done to justify $6,000 to $15,000 for a solidbody bass. Warwick, Spector, Alembic, Fodera, etcetera, all need to have a long hard look in the mirror where their prices are concerned.
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#32
Just Thumpin' said:
Our pricing is set at a level that allows us to build at the quality level we have set for ourselves and remain a viable business.
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...though only just barely, I would think! That you are able to survive on only a 10% margin is impressive; you must run a pretty tight ship. Congratulations on being able to maintain your high standards on such slim profits.

And I know that -- provided I had the wherewithal, obviously -- if it turned out Fodera or Alembic etc were making 20% margins I still wouldn't hesitate to buy one. A company's gotta stay in business, and I don't begrudge any luthier from trying to make a living.
 
#33
Roscoe East said:
...though only just barely, I would think! That you are able to survive on only a 10% margin is impressive; you must run a pretty tight ship. Congratulations on being able to maintain your high standards on such slim profits.

And I know that -- provided I had the wherewithal, obviously -- if it turned out Fodera or Alembic etc were making 20% margins I still wouldn't hesitate to buy one. A company's gotta stay in business, and I don't begrudge any luthier from trying to make a living.
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Remember, 'margin' is typically after all salaries and costs are paid. It is 'profit' after all expenses (in the typical definition, and after taxes, etc. depending on which definition of 'profit' is used in the numerator). 10% is quite healthy, but given the quality of the product, and the demand level, seems quite fair IMO.
 
#34
Root 5 said:
I think many of the so-called "Boutique" brands are obscenely over-priced today. There just isn't enough work to be done to justify $6,000 to $15,000 for a solidbody bass.
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And on what information and experience are you basing this opinion? Go make a bass at that level of quality and build detail. Then, make a few thousand more. Along the way, turn a profit, employ the team of expert craftsmen you will need to complete the various components of these instruments, and avoid foreclosure and starvation while supporting your family.

You slab guys are spoiled. Go price an entry-level doublebass. $1500 to $2000 is chump change just to get your foot in the door. Any of my middle-of-the-road, late 19th or early 20th Century German basses could go for close to $10,000. Good 19th Century French basses are worth as much as a new BMW. And old Italian basses? Forget about it. I've seen them go for a quarter of a million dollars. Once you have an instrument, then you have to maintain it. Go price that. It'll shock you.

And people line up to pay, because these instruments are worth the money if they do what you absolutely need an instrument to do. Just like Alembic basses.
 
#35
KUNGfuSHERIFF said:
And people line up to pay, because these instruments are worth the money if they do what you absolutely need an instrument to do. Just like Alembic basses.
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Very, very true. Musicians playing electric instruments for modern music pay very little when compared with all of the other musicians out there. Be thankful you can get the quality of an Alembic or Fodera (or any other builder) for so much less than a top shelf violin.
 
#38
Root 5 said:
That's because there's a perception amongst the non woodworking bassists among us, that building an Alembic or Fodera is tremendously difficult thus warranting an obscene price.

It isn't and they don't.
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Shaving or shaping wood is one thing. Taking a vision from mind to physical art while adhering to basic engineering principles is another. I can catch a football. Calvin Johnson does it better and our respective bank accounts confirm that. Likewise the honor student in shop class and the luthiers and craftsmen at Fodera and Alembic.
 
#39
Actually, not only did I see that flyer the OP mentioned, but I bought my Distillate for $1,450.00 that same year the bass model (and the flyer) came out. That was in 1981... I still own the Alembic (Distillate) bass.

Mine has a Purpleheart top which got me the lower price. The store owner at Make N Music in Homewood, IL wouldn't sell me the Zebrawood (Distillate) for less then the $1,850.00 you see in the flyer.
 
#40
Root 5 said:
I think many of the so-called "Boutique" brands are obscenely over-priced today. There just isn't enough work to be done to justify $6,000 to $15,000 for a solidbody bass. Warwick, Spector, Alembic, Fodera, etcetera, all need to have a long hard look in the mirror where their prices are concerned.
Click to expand...

The saleability of a product and its value is what the market will bear. Simple and as clearly 'distilled' (pardon the pun) as that.

You make a product and you name your price, if there are buyers - you have a market. If not you rethink. There is no inherent morality in it. You can buy land that has nothing on it for a lot of money and the price is determined by the desire for the land. That's what the market will bear, and that's what you can sell for.
 

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