Always alternating fingers and starting with middle finger???

[justaman]

I just started playing bass the other day and I cannot find a clear answer to these questions.

I am trying to learn some songs and it just feels natural to start a lot of them with my middle finger. Is the wrong? Should it always be index-middle-index-middle when using 2 fingers?

Second question is, should I always be alternating fingers? I don't know how to post a tab, but the riff starts 3 on A, to 3 on E, back to 3 on A, to 5 on E. When doing 5 on E it feels natural to use my middle finger for a second time. I forced myself not to do that and alternate every finger, but I get to a point in the song where I have to repeat this first riff again. Problem is I have to start 3 on A with my index finger which I am not used to, so I get confused.

My goal here is to play as efficient as possible. I play guitar as well and I have a very bad habit of picking up down up down down up down up, etc; It messes me up on learning songs. I don't want that to happen with bass and my fingers!

 

[lz4005]

Make it sound right.

Don't let technique guidelines get in the way of that.

Alternate most of the time except when it makes sense not to.

 

[Corey Y]

Lead with whatever finger feels right. If you're working on a song and you need to start off with something different to make a run of notes smoothly, do that. I generally start with my middle finger and alternate with my index finger, unless I'm playing something that requires I use 3 or more fingers in quick succession. Some people feel more comfortable alternating in one direction or the other. It's only wrong if it's getting in your way or holding you back from what you want to be playing.

 

[MrLenny1]

Middle finger is good to lead off on major and 7th licks/chords.
Index finger is good to lead off on minor patterns.

 

[FretlessMainly]

Middle finger is good to lead off on major and 7th licks/chords.
Index finger is good to lead off on minor patterns.

This sounds like left hand (fingering hand) advice for a right-handed player and I interpret the OPs question to be in regard to plucking hand technique.

In any case, strictly alternating is certainly something that you should be able to do, but there are legitimate reasons where it is not only not needed, it can be a hindrance (e.g., pull-offs, hammer-ons, slurs, dead notes leading to a true note on a lower string, etc.). Not that you're at that level yet, but just so you're aware.

For now, try to learn strictly alternating as something in your toolbox, but as posted above, sometimes doing what feels right might just be right. Technically, strictly alternating is the most efficient way to play rapid passages cleanly, but not all music is rapid passages of individually plucked notes.

 

[justaman]

Middle finger is good to lead off on major and 7th licks/chords.
Index finger is good to lead off on minor patterns.

I appreciate your response, but I don't know theory, so I don't even know what this means.

This sounds like left hand (fingering hand) advice for a right-handed player and I interpret the OPs question to be in regard to plucking hand technique.

In any case, strictly alternating is certainly something that you should be able to do, but there are legitimate reasons where it is not only not needed, it can be a hindrance (e.g., pull-offs, hammer-ons, slurs, dead notes leading to a true note on a lower string, etc.). Not that you're at that level yet, but just so you're aware.

For now, try to learn strictly alternating as something in your toolbox, but as posted above, sometimes doing what feels right might just be right. Technically, strictly alternating is the most efficient way to play rapid passages cleanly, but not all music is rapid passages of individually plucked notes.

Yes I am right handed and I am talking about my plucking/picking hand.

For now, I am only working on this one song. So your saying I should do it all alternate picked because it's the most efficient? The last note plucked before going back to the main riff is played with my middle finger. So when I return to the main riff, I would now start it with my index. This completely throws me off because up until this point, every time I go back to the riff it was with my middle finger.

 

[FretlessMainly]

I appreciate your response, but I don't know theory, so I don't even know what this means.

Yes I am right handed and I am talking about my plucking/picking hand.

For now, I am only working on this one song. So your saying I should do it all alternate picked because it's the most efficient? The last note plucked before going back to the main riff is played with my middle finger. So when I return to the main riff, I would now start it with my index. This completely throws me off because up until this point, every time I go back to the riff it was with my middle finger.

With regard to what MrLenny posted, this is one way to approach using your fingering hand - but that's for further down the road.

With regard to plucking, I'd say this. First let's establish exactly what you are doing. I think you are doing this (i = index; m = middle, I'll line things up as best as I can so don't worry about my extra spaces):

A A A EEE AAA EEE EE
i m i m i m i m i mim im

OR, are you doing this?:

A A A EEE AAA EEE EE
i m i i mi i m i i m i mm

Try to do the whole line strictly alternating (the first example I posted). Since the line has 14 notes (and assuming you are using only your index and middle fingers to pluck), if you use strictly alternating, you should end up re-starting the line with the same finger you started it previously. Do it two ways: 1) starting the whole line with your index finger and 2) starting the whole line with your middle finger.

The strictly alternating is fairly simple (although string crossings complicate it); what makes it complicated is that you want to start each note grouping with the same finger. Since you have groups of three notes, you can't do that and be strictly alternating. This will teach your brain to get past the hurdle of: imi mim imi mim...you need separate the form from what your plucking hand is doing. Keep in mind that it takes 10,000 hours on an instrument to master it, so just keep at it.

 

[justaman]

I start this riff with my middle finger and play it like this. This is the riff the whole riff then it repeats.

A E A E (middle again would feel more natural) E A A A E E E E
m i m i m i m i m i m i

 

[Laklandfan]

I do often, but most of the time I try not to think about it. There's so much else going on in the moment, it's trivial. Assuming it's not causing a musical malfunction.

 

[two fingers]

Middle finger is good to lead off on major and 7th licks/chords.
Index finger is good to lead off on minor patterns.

This is a joke. Relax people.

 

[two fingers]

Welcome to TalkBass @justaman !!!

Alternating will allow you to move more fluidly. Which finger you start with matters little or none.

 

[Bodeanly]

Pay more attention to your fretting hand. The plucking hand will find its way.

 

[punchdrunk]

The truth is that, if it sounds good, it is good. It not so much the mechanics of your touch, rather it's the feel you put forth. Play the most basic line, but touch the bass in a way as to coax the most beautiful sound. Make it sound good. That's the most important thing... Technique will arrive as you progress, so don't go too crazy stressing about that part... Focus on making every single note beautiful.

 

[InhumanResource]

I just started playing bass the other day and I cannot find a clear answer to these questions.

I am trying to learn some songs and it just feels natural to start a lot of them with my middle finger. Is the wrong? Should it always be index-middle-index-middle when using 2 fingers?

Second question is, should I always be alternating fingers? I don't know how to post a tab, but the riff starts 3 on A, to 3 on E, back to 3 on A, to 5 on E. When doing 5 on E it feels natural to use my middle finger for a second time. I forced myself not to do that and alternate every finger, but I get to a point in the song where I have to repeat this first riff again. Problem is I have to start 3 on A with my index finger which I am not used to, so I get confused.

My goal here is to play as efficient as possible. I play guitar as well and I have a very bad habit of picking up down up down down up down up, etc; It messes me up on learning songs. I don't want that to happen with bass and my fingers!

Learn the rules before you break the rules. It sounds like you are just about there - you know you're supposed to alternate fingers on every attack...special stuff like "raking" across strings notwithstanding. As long as you can actually perform that alternating back and forth technique, feel free to break it where you feel necessary.

I too had alternating fingers and one-finger-per-fret drilled into my head. And now, I usually still do it...but sometimes I revert to the ol' Jamerson hook (one finger attack) on certain tunes and grooves because it just feels right.

So, break the rules. Take liberties with technique and interpretation of tunes. But only after you know and can play by the rules first.

 

[fakeneckplate'65]

I try to think of my fingers as you would use sticking playing rudiments on a drumset. L is my index finger R is my middle finger. Sometimes I substitute L for my thumb, which is sort of like K.

It also depends on what part of the beat I come in on. Downbeats are index, " & " is my middle finger.

It helps a lot with technique to use your plucking fingers to play rudiments.

 

[physics]

I employ an exercise on my right(stroking) hand where I drill myself on the rest stroke. It consists of rapid and smooth finger alternation on each string, doing a simple bass line up and down the neck.

If you do this consistently for a long enough time you will become proficient and it will become natural, to the point that you can then focus on other techniques you need to learn. As others have mentioned, when it feels good and sounds good then you'll know that you're on the right track.

 

[Orion1985]

This is a pretty good explanation for why you want to alternate and it also explains the raking technique which is something that you were describing in your OP. Strictly alternating index, middle, index, middle... isn't always the most efficient technique. I don't really think too much about which finger I am plucking with each note but I do use both somewhat evenly. If I ever played anything where I would need more speed than I am capable of currently I might need to pay closer attention to that portion of my technique but so far so good. I think it matters more to make sure your attack is the same no matter what finger you are plucking with.

 

[innsmouthface]

To the OP: to me it seems to me that you are trying to think about finger alternation based on alternate picking (with a pick, described better than I could here: Alternate picking - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia).
In my experience, making sure that downbeats are on a downstroke and upbeats on an upstroke is very-very important when playing with a pick, and makes playing in time much easier&better. However, alternate fingerpicking is not like this, so it's not "downstroke: middle finger, upstroke: index finger". It is a bit more free, you can start with whatever finger you like and then always use the other finger for the next note, regardless of note length.

I hope this helps a bit

 

[Honch]

I just started playing bass the other day and I cannot find a clear answer to these questions.

I am trying to learn some songs and it just feels natural to start a lot of them with my middle finger. Is the wrong? Should it always be index-middle-index-middle when using 2 fingers?

Second question is, should I always be alternating fingers? I don't know how to post a tab, but the riff starts 3 on A, to 3 on E, back to 3 on A, to 5 on E. When doing 5 on E it feels natural to use my middle finger for a second time. I forced myself not to do that and alternate every finger, but I get to a point in the song where I have to repeat this first riff again. Problem is I have to start 3 on A with my index finger which I am not used to, so I get confused.

My goal here is to play as efficient as possible. I play guitar as well and I have a very bad habit of picking up down up down down up down up, etc; It messes me up on learning songs. I don't want that to happen with bass and my fingers!

Welcome to the bass world. Actually there are no rules of thumb... (well, thumb isn't involved here). I would suggest to go by YOUR natural feeling, and gut reaction. I think you will detect yourself when something feels too awkward and needs to work on. I had tremendous help and "advantageous handicap" of having went through formal training in classical guitar in my early teens. Only now, the nails are cut short. I kept breaking and cracking them all of the time. I even use THREE fingers from time to time, on bass, for short tremolo bursts (like John Enthwhistle), and you should not limit yourself to one particular technique or the other.

Alternate picking on guitar with pick is a different thing. Most pro's with strict alternate picking can play almost anything without struggle. You must adhere to alternate picking when skipping strings and jumping across the fretboard. Not all notes that you play resides on the adjacent strings all of the time.

The thing of special notice I do think is important, is when doing a downward scale, lick, or line on bass. Or "bass run". From the G-string to low E. Then you'll always tend to do a rest stroke with a finger, and it resides already on the next adjacent string that you're supposed to pick/pluck. It's very tempting to carry on this way. But try to do it the other way around, going from low E to G-string on the way up, you have nothing to rest your picking fingers on but have to lift them across the string in order to do that upstroke on every string. The speed is immediately reduced to half! That's where practicing strict alternate could come in handy, but doesn't really show itself until years down the road.

1. Start with whatever finger feels best to YOU.
2. No, you should not always be alternating fingers. It depends. However, if you are disciplined and do a military drill, and torture yourself into strict alternate fingering, like a marching drill, I think you'll be able to learn tricky parts and new things quicker without struggle. Alternate picking leaves a "one way only" to do things, and you don't have to think and start over again, when faced with new music that you haven't experienced before. Also, if faced with immediate transposing, or playing in different keys, it's almost always easier to "translate". However, alternate picking aren't the most efficient or economical. A lot of excess movement and energy is consumed.

I find alternate fingering on bass, is slightly more important on bass than on guitar. Bass lines are more often than not, a rhytmical figure or line, that includes a lot of accents, and dynamics, and thus, one ore more notes in the line, are considerably louder than the rest. These can occur anywhere in the line, and in succession, and just once in a while. The dynamics, and accents is what makes such a line a fluid one, and ... a groove. This is important to learn when you practice fingering, alternating or not.

Me myself, and this is a personal idiosyncrasy only and not a rule for everyone else, have problems with accenting notes if I do fast rest-strokes in a descending order. Having to play two notes in succession with same finger. But that's only me.

- - - -

And as the rest have already said: Do not translate (confuse or mix up) guitar picking with a pick onto any fignerpicking on bass. It's another planet.

 

[justaman]

Hmm still a lot of mixed responses... So from that video I take it one should be alternating fingers most of the time, but if your descending, crossing strings, you can employ the raking technique. So raking could make sense for this song I am learning, but the guy in the video says it's more for fast bass lines or solos.

Maybe I should just keep what I am doing and stick to alternating fingers. I guess I just have to keep it at and go really slow and hope the muscle memory is there. My alternate picking on guitar is abysmal because my brain is use to down up, down down, up, down up, up, up, down, or whatever.