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Am I doing something wrong? Verellen Meatsmoke Pre & MT900

Plastalmonus

Plastalmonus

Apr 22, 2017
1,177
2,862
Melbourne, Australia
#1
I very recently picked up a Verellen Meatsmoke Pre and absolutely love it in front of my Orange AD200 however I do find that at lower volumes and higher gain levels it seems to compress the signal to a nearly synth-like fuzz tone. I am going to assume it may open up once the volume is raised.

I tried running it through the Power Amp IN on my Darkglass MT900, as I have read many times that running it directly into a power amp is the optimum method however I just really don't like it. It seems to lose all oomph and sounds either muddy or overly trebly with no in between on the EQ. Are there any recommended settings when dialling in a pre going straight into a power amp? Is the Darkglass Power Amp IN just not great? Admittedly I never thought much of running the B7K Ultra straight into the PA IN either, again it seemed to just lose any meatiness that you'd get from using the built in preamp.

I can maybe chuck a recording up later but I am guessing it may just be that I don't like the valve preamp running into the class D power amp.

Anybody else running their Verellen like this?
 
#4
Plastalmonus said:
I very recently picked up a Verellen Meatsmoke Pre and absolutely love it in front of my Orange AD200 however I do find that at lower volumes and higher gain levels it seems to compress the signal to a nearly synth-like fuzz tone. I am going to assume it may open up once the volume is raised.

I tried running it through the Power Amp IN on my Darkglass MT900, as I have read many times that running it directly into a power amp is the optimum method however I just really don't like it. It seems to lose all oomph and sounds either muddy or overly trebly with no in between on the EQ. Are there any recommended settings when dialling in a pre going straight into a power amp? Is the Darkglass Power Amp IN just not great? Admittedly I never thought much of running the B7K Ultra straight into the PA IN either, again it seemed to just lose any meatiness that you'd get from using the built in preamp.

I can maybe chuck a recording up later but I am guessing it may just be that I don't like the valve preamp running into the class D power amp.

Anybody else running their Verellen like this?
Click to expand...

You mentioned a high gain setting. My guess is, that would be a big part of your problem. Back the gain off a bit and raise your volume to compensate. That should make a difference.
 
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#5
retslock said:
You mentioned a high gain setting. My guess is, that would be a big part of your problem. Back the gain off a bit and raise your volume to compensate. That should make a difference.
Click to expand...

The gain on the boost channel is at 9:00 and the Master is at 12:00. It basically sounds like it is experiencing the aftermath of an 'All You Can Eat Mexican Chilli, Bean and Guinness' night out. Really kind of farty fuzz. What I'd expect off a Fuzz Factory or Wooly Mammoth if the gain was way higher.

I have tried through the Power Amp IN of the Darkglass, in the Effects Loop of the Darkglass and in front of the Orange. I just can't find a setting on the boost channel that is usable. If the gain drops lower than 9:00 it gets really dark and muddy, if it goes higher then it loses more lows and gets a heavily compressed fuzz sound.

There's 3 options here.

1) I just really don't like the boost channel (to the point I can't see how anyone who isn't playing heavy as hell stoner/doom could).

2) It doesn't like my basses or amps

3) It is broken

I may have to go looking for other recordings of it to see what settings and sounds they use.

In comparison I love nearly all the tones I get out of the Darkglass B3K and Alpha Omega Ultra.
 
#9
I realize this thread is a little dusty, but there isn't much info on the Meatsmoke pre out there so I figured I'd share my experience. I got to try mine today at band practice for the first time, running it through a power amp. I played two basses through it, my Fender Nate Mendel P and my Nash JB-63. Both sounded equally farty at anything beyond 9 o'clock on the gain. Master was bumped all the way on both channels but even dialed back it was an issue. The difference between 7 o'clock and 9 was pretty substantial as well. 7 was almost off but still clean and 9 was almost unbearably farty. If running just the clean channel, I had no problem at all and enjoyed the fat tube sound I wanted.

I ended up using my Darkglass VMT pedal for overdrive along with the Big Muff Pi for thick fuzz.
I did not have anything in the chain before the Meatsmoke, all pedals ran after the Meatsmoke, so I know it wasn't something on that end. I am wondering if another tube might do the trick or the one I have is shot...

If anyone has suggestions, I'd definitely love to hear your ideas. I haven't opened it up since I got it but I'm assuming the tubes are stock 12ax7s.
 
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#10
I know little about these preamps, but I have always been under the impression that they are all about the overdrive.
A bad 12ax7 might be the culprit, but IME, a faulty preamp tube is more likely to respond to vibration, shock, and heat to
give a distorted or microphonic result. YMMV.
 
#11
Could be hotter basses push the beginning stages too hard. More for initial gain, less filters and common distortion tricks.

Otherwise the distortion just really isn't that special and no way to change it.

Only so many ways to get distortion. They all start sounding the same. Sometimes gain stages and filtering really make a difference. Otherwise it's just the same old opamp / diode / or transistor getting blasted
 
#13
BogeyBass said:
Could be hotter basses push the beginning stages too hard. More for initial gain, less filters and common distortion tricks.
Click to expand...

The P I have has an SD QP pickup that is super hot but the Nash JB-63 is pretty normal. Diailing back the volume helped a little but it was still super farty at low gain settings on the boost channel. I'd like to open it up more headroom and Dirty Duke suggested using some lower gain tubes which I'm willing to try out.

The Darkglass VMT pedal has a great sounding OD I've dialed in but I'd love if I could get the same or better sound out of the Meatsmoke and sell the DG and/or bigmuff.
 
#14
BuiltToSpill17 said:
I realize this thread is a little dusty, but there isn't much info on the Meatsmoke pre out there so I figured I'd share my experience. I got to try mine today at band practice for the first time, running it through a power amp. I played two basses through it, my Fender Nate Mendel P and my Nash JB-63. Both sounded equally farty at anything beyond 9 o'clock on the gain. Master was bumped all the way on both channels but even dialed back it was an issue. The difference between 7 o'clock and 9 was pretty substantial as well. 7 was almost off but still clean and 9 was almost unbearably farty. If running just the clean channel, I had no problem at all and enjoyed the fat tube sound I wanted.

I ended up using my Darkglass VMT pedal for overdrive along with the Big Muff Pi for thick fuzz.
I did not have anything in the chain before the Meatsmoke, all pedals ran after the Meatsmoke, so I know it wasn't something on that end. I am wondering if another tube might do the trick or the one I have is shot...

If anyone has suggestions, I'd definitely love to hear your ideas. I haven't opened it up since I got it but I'm assuming the tubes are stock 12ax7s.
Click to expand...


Have you contacted Verellen? RTFM :D?
 
#15
Hey Plastalmonus,
I do not own the Meatsmoke Pre, but I do have the Meatsmoke Amp. When I´m playing with my Dingwall, the Overdrive Channel is of no use. Just mushy, farty sounds, nothing really usable on bass. My passive Kiesel Vader on the other hand sounds a little more refined on that channel. Kind of a heavy rock distortion.
I think active pickups are just not for the Meatsmoke OD, at least Dingwalls that is.
What really helps imo is cutting the lows before going into the OD Channel. For this I´m using a Horizon Devices Precision Drive and with that even my Dingwall sounds good on that channel !
 
#16
Yeah, it seems like the consistent issue is hot pickups or higher output from an active pre-amp for some.
Suggestions I've seen so far are:
  • Use a passive bass with lower output pickups (or turn your volume knob down) - most of my basses are passive and I still have this issue, although cutting volume seems to tame it, there still isn't much headroom and I don't like the clean tone with the cut so it'd be a little busy on songs where I'm using both clean and OD -- that's some guitar player business I don't have time for ;)
  • Change the Boost channel tube to a lower gain tube
  • (implied) use an EQ pedal or active preamp setting to cut bass freqs prior to going into the MS
I'm going to contact Verellen as @Jim Carr suggested as well. I'm not the original owner, but I'm confident based on everything I've read that they'd still be happy to help. I'll post my findings here.
 
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#17
I have owned 3 preamps, finally having a custom one built. 2 meatsmoke amps. One 300. Watt and a custom 400 watt Meatsmoke Hiwatt 2 channel as well as the Hybrid.

Swapping the 12ax7 with a bugle boy or Millard 12au7 has made all the difference in the world .
 
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#18
I received my Meatsmoke Pre last November. I found the stock JJ tubes too harsh and the boost channel unusable. I tried a variety of NOS 12au7 tubes and it really helped. It was also interesting to hear the different character of the tubes. I finally contacted Ben a month ago about cleaning up the harsh boost channel which he did. Two clean channels! I can now go back to using 12ax7 tubes if I want and it still sounds great. I now have more control over gain and overdrive. I've had great fun tube rolling with this pedal.
 
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#19
Got a Golden Lion ax7 and Mullard au7 in there now. Still having the same issue. I emailed Verellen and Ben said he wouldn't be able to make an assessment without seeing it in person. It sounds like @Valveman had the same issue I did so I'm hoping Ben can sort it out. Off to the West Coast it goes!
 

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