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ampeg fear...

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by ollybarclay, Apr 26, 2006.


  1. ollybarclay

    ollybarclay

    Dec 14, 2005
    so, couple of things..

    i'm running an ampeg svt 4 pro with ampeg 610 cabinet mono bridged with the supplied speakon that's got a 'mono bridged' rubber label on the cable - so it's not the fact my speakon is incorrectly wired. everything else is connected correct too...

    problem is, i'm HAVING to CRANK the gain to just below peak (as you're 'meant' to do) but ALSO having to crank the master to about 3 o'clock to be even remotely heard over my drummer, if i didn't have the sansamp i'd be more screwed than...something that's really screwed..

    now, having just got back from tour with a band where the bassplayer uses a mesa m-pulse 600 thru the same cabinet and gets a LOUD as F**K punchy sound, i have to say i felt thoroughly underwhelmed with my rig.

    so much so that i tried using a single power amp with a regular speaker cable and although still nowhere near what i wanted was a bit more convincing

    anyone got any ideas what could be wrong? given the expense we're talking here i'd love to know it was something that i'm doing wrong / could be repaired if anything's bust.

    head bought new in december 05
    cabinet new in march 06

    any help MUCH appreciated!!
     
  2. 8mmOD

    8mmOD

    Mar 20, 2005
    USA
    I endorse & use Tech 21 pedals, Eminence loaded cabs, EMG pickups, Jim Dunlop picks & Ernie Ball Strings, BC Rich Basses.
    Sounds like either your speakon cable is wired wrong (i know, it has a label on it) or you are pushing way too much low and & scooping out most of your mids, which is where the meat of the bass guitars volume & tone resides.
     
  3. hasbeen

    hasbeen Commercial User

    Sep 23, 2004
    Vice President, KMC Music. Warwick U.S. distribution, Ampeg distribution
    yes, what 8mm said. There are many, many variables here. What type of sound are you going for and how were you eq'd?

    How were you eq'd on you bass too? Is it active?
     
  4. ollybarclay

    ollybarclay

    Dec 14, 2005
    perhaps you're right:
    -15dB pressed in
    bass about 3oclock
    midrange about 1oclock (so there's plenty mids)
    mid selector 4
    treble about 9oclock

    into sansamp for a bit of drive

    to be honest though, the reason for it being effectively really quiet because of driving too much bass sounds ridiculous... :S

    the guitar is active, bass is half way up, treble max, tone max.
     
  5. rok51

    rok51 Supporting Member

    Sep 2, 2002
    Crawfordville, FL
    Well, for one thing, try leaving the pad (-15db) switch out. That is eating up a serious amount of your volume right there. Most of the time, even with active basses, you can leave the pad off...it's only when you come across a bass that is so bloody hot that you wind up hitting the 'peak' light when the gain is set to 1 or 2 that you need to use the pad.

    It took me years to finally come around to the concept that if my rig sounds 'right' to me on stage, it's going to be boomy and or muddy out in the room. An old bass playing friend told me over and over that in order to sound tight and clear out in the room, it had to sound 'thin' on stage. He was right. It will take you a while to 1)accept this, and 2)adjust your ear to where 'thin' sounds right.

    It will be worth it, though.

    Kim
     
  6. hyperlitem

    hyperlitem Guest

    Jul 25, 2001
    Indianapolis, IN
    im having the EXACT same problem with my rig. B4R into ampeg 6x10. gain at like 5 and master all the way down. Are ampegs severley underpowered?> ive checked all the stuff out you guys are saying. Apprently 1000 watts isnt what it used to be. Im thinking of trading mine in, cuz a guy in a band that isnt ear shaterringly loud like mine mine be able to use this amp.
     
  7. Eric Cioe

    Eric Cioe

    Jun 4, 2001
    Missoula, MT
    You're boosting every EQ knob you have except your amp's treble? Try and set your bass a little more flat and disengage the input pad. That might do the trick.
     
  8. zachbass02

    zachbass02 One Hairy....squatch.

    Jan 3, 2005
    Nashville, TN
    In my experiences, Ampeg rates their stuff very liberally. I just swapped my Ampeg 350h for a Hartke 3500 and also bought a Trace Elliot SMX350(I think is the right model) head, both are rated @ 350watts, and both smoke the the Ampeg in terms of loudness:bassist: . Where I used to have the Ampeg master volume cranked and still couldn't be heard, I haven't had the Trace past 3 and I am louder than 2 screaming guitar 4x12 cabs. If you like the Ampeg sound, then stick with the Ampeg and get a good power amp to go with it. For me, I wanted a little bit more of a modern punchy tone that I couldn't coax out of the Ampeg. But yes, Ampeg heads are underpowered......:bawl:
     
  9. Daywalker

    Daywalker

    Apr 13, 2005
    SOCAL
    As you can see by my sig, I have the same set-up as you. I also, am having the same problem as you. I would agree with just about all the suggestions here, or you could just trade it all in for Aguilar stuff like I'm doing...:D
     
  10. ollybarclay

    ollybarclay

    Dec 14, 2005
    great! :crying:

    if i have to play that particular game, i'll be looking at some of the mesa stuff..:D
     
  11. chaosMK

    chaosMK

    May 26, 2005
    Albuquerque, NM
    Hi-fi into an old tube amp
    Maybe make sure that the button for Stereo/Mono is on the right setting. It can be hard to tell because the button is set so deep.

    You should be getting mad thunder out of that head.
     
  12. ollybarclay

    ollybarclay

    Dec 14, 2005
    button was in for the mono bridging as it should have been and now is out as i'm only using one power amp...
     
  13. arbitrary

    arbitrary Supporting Member

    Oct 24, 2005
    Boston, MA
    how ironic.
    I just bought (should be here friday) an agulir db659 preamp to replace my svt4 pro as well.
    I should be getting a power amp within a month,.
     
  14. jablues

    jablues

    Oct 17, 2005
    Seville, Spain.
    +1
    I had the same problem with my SVT-4pro and I replaced it with an Aggie DB750 and ....................... my God, what an amp!! :hyper:

    J.
     
  15. Jerrold Tiers

    Jerrold Tiers

    Nov 14, 2003
    St Louis
    You didn't mention the "ultra-low".... is it on or off?

    If the cable is messed up, you could have been using only one amp.......

    As for the bass thing, nope, not ridiculous.........

    Low end doesn't carry well.
    Low end takes relatively way more power to get as loud as mids.
    You don't HEAR low end as well as mids
    Lows leak out of the room everywhere, thru wood floors, walls, ceilings, doors...

    So, cranking the lows ends up using most of your power to try to fill the place with fundamental, which is a losing proposition anyway since they leak out of the room all over.

    Having all that EQ on the lows may be trying to get 12 or 15 dB more out in the lows than the mids. That means you are putting maybe 16 times more power into the low lows than into the rest of the sound.....

    It should be pretty obvious that will re-balance your sound well into the harder-to-hear "mud range".

    The -15 dB isn't helping any either, it just lowers your volume and forces you to dime everything.

    If everything is correct, you should have guitarists weeping and small animals dropping dead out in front of you with that setup.

    Engage "mono". Use a cable wired 1+2+ at the amp end and 1+ 1- at the speaker end, plugged into the mono output. plug cable into 4 ohm cabinet...... result 1200W (rms) capability.

    As far as "liberal ratings", if that means we "add a few watts for luck", I happen to know that ain't quite right.... if we say it, it does it.

    I think we just give you too many EQ options....... :D
     
  16. Daywalker

    Daywalker

    Apr 13, 2005
    SOCAL
    RE: Mr. Tiers

    That's one thing that has baffled me throughout my bass playing years. Why do all(just about) bass amps have an untra-low button if all it does is screw up your sound? I mean, I LOVE the tone with it in, but it just messes up the works when I crank it. Are there any amps out there that can be safely pushed loudly with the low boost on? How do I get that moderate sound I love to stay the same at high volumes? Is it even possible?
     
  17. That's odd. I have a 3 Pro and I only have to turn it to 12 o'clock to be heard. Turn the pad off like others have said, unless I had a 18v active bass, I wouldn't use it.
     
  18. Jerrold Tiers

    Jerrold Tiers

    Nov 14, 2003
    St Louis
    If you have the power and the speakers for it, the switch can be used loud. BTW, you don't.....

    Otherwise it is good for different things.... can sound awesome for quieter jazz etc (and crappy, too, depends). Something where you want the lows and can deal with less power left over.

    Not every button is good all the time....... But the new rule seems to be "everything not forbidden is compulsory"!
     
  19. KOakley

    KOakley

    Sep 26, 2002
    Hampton Va
    Ampeg Fear.....the feeling my guitarist gets when he's playing too loud and I threaten to dime my B4R in retaliation. Only had to do it once to establish the proper respect on his part.
     
  20. 8mmOD

    8mmOD

    Mar 20, 2005
    USA
    I endorse & use Tech 21 pedals, Eminence loaded cabs, EMG pickups, Jim Dunlop picks & Ernie Ball Strings, BC Rich Basses.

    Well that simply shows your inexperience with bass amps ;)

    but Jerrold explained this pretty well in his first post so I won't elaborate.

    FYI, its pretty easy to scoop out all your mids with a sansamp pedal as well. The ultra low pushed in on the amp, the sansamp with the blend knob turned up. Its a recipe for mud. OTOH, with the 4 pro dialed in properly and the sansamp dialed in properly, that combination sounds badass.

    Just curious, do you have the sansamp in the fx loop or on the front end?

    One of the things that I dont like about the 4 pro is there are so many options that it can be difficult trying to dial in a good sound from scratch. You guys trading in for Aguilars, I can understand that, its a different sounding amp and probably suits your style better. But the notion of the 4 pro being underpowerwered is laughable.
     

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