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Another Overpriced Pre-CBS Jazz
- Thread starter PolkaHero
- Start date
It's one thing to criticize a particular price on a particular specimen as being "overpriced"... it's something else entirely to criticize collector markets driving the prices higher than what players can afford. Yeah, we get it, the '62 or '58 or whatever is not fundamentally a better bass than what you can get off the rack at Guitar Center or certainly what a custom shop can make for a couple k. But guess what? There are pennies out there that coin collectors will pay tens of thousands for. If, in circulation (in the hands of players, if you will) that penny would function no better than any other penny. A classic Leica might have a certain look to the images (well, not really), but your iPhone is a better daily camera and a lot more practical to use. That '57 Chevy? It is way more a guzzler than what's in your driveway and it doesn't have power windows and locks (or maybe does but no satellite radio or OnStar or ABS or something).
Yes, collectors drive these markets. No, the prices don't make sense to users. They aren't supposed to. No one says they are supposed to. Collectively I'd wish we'd get over collector-driven prices.
Yes, collectors drive these markets. No, the prices don't make sense to users. They aren't supposed to. No one says they are supposed to. Collectively I'd wish we'd get over collector-driven prices.
Last edited:
Ric5
Inactive
- Jan 29, 2008
- 29,772
- 30,452
- Disclosures
- I like 5, 8, 10, and 12 string basses
I have owned and played instruments from the 60s and 70s … I sold them all … I prefer new tools
old basses aren't better … they are just older
old basses aren't better … they are just older
Good luck with that. Like you said, as long as there are multiple people willing to pay extreme prices for collector's pieces, then the prices on those pieces will always be driven by the collector's market. And don't tell me if you own something collectable and valuable that you wouldn't sell it for every penny you possibly could get. Nobody would, or I would call them "morons" to their faces. As long as they couldn't beat me up, that is
But here's the good news...there's plenty of gear out there that anyone can afford. And it's pretty darn nice. That got me over the high prices on collector's items long ago. Hopefully one day it will help everyone who can't afford them get over it, too.
In the '80s and '90s I met a few people that did this. Back then most of the guitars were going to the Japanese market and shipping counterfeits was more acceptable when they went that direction. A lot of those forgeries are coming home now, and once a forgery slips through as authentic it becomes a source to authenticate other vintage guitars.
Smooth_bass88
vaxx!
- Oct 31, 2006
- 12,122
- 16,793
- Disclosures
- have been on nationally released albums, charting on the Billboard 200
Yes it is and I absolutely play it out all the time. It obviously sounds amazing but it's also a cool conversation piece as people tend to 'ooooh and aaaah' over it.
Well said man!
I was born right at the beginning of the 80s and have had to opportunity to play a few great 1960’s and 1970’s era Fenders. Many were duds but some are seriously great in the terms of tone...but not one was at the level of finish and quality that basses made more recently are. Twisted necks and truss rods that don’t hold or barely fight the neck from straitening are common for Pre and CBS era Fenders. This can still happen to new basses but there is much lower chance of it happening.
I get it though, collectors like to buy a piece of history as an investment or toy.
I owned a 1962 Fender Precision that I traded to a collector. I hear recently that this bass is headed to a collector overseas. It never ends. Somewhat makes life interesting. But it’s amazing what some spend their money on.
I bought a '74 AVRI off one of the fine gentlemen on this site and thought is would be my "it won't kill me if it gets robbed" drag it everywhere bass, and now that's my baby. It's as nice as any bass i've owned, and it didn't cost 27 grand.
Now, a guitar player i play with has 30 guitars. Mainly Les Paul Jrs and Melody makers, gold tops and some Epiphones. All 50's and 60's. Boy's got some $$$s there.
Now, a guitar player i play with has 30 guitars. Mainly Les Paul Jrs and Melody makers, gold tops and some Epiphones. All 50's and 60's. Boy's got some $$$s there.
I decree that this article should appear in every thread of this type.
I'm guilty of this!
That’s right and I’ve seen sellers conflate asking and selling price I.e. pointing out how their item is a bargain because the same thing is “going” for more on EBay.
I went to the very first Dallas Guitar Show in the late 70's.
A guy was selling a Flying V, supposedly from that first run in the late 50's. It looked like it had been chained to a pier in Galveston Bay getting soaked in salt water for 4 or 5 years. He was asking 5 grand for it, which was quite a pile of $$$ back then.
That broke me of the vint market ever since.
For 28G's, I could have several new axes and rigs, and lots of money left over. Or if I just had to have an axe for that money, a built-for-me Alembic Series. I'd be hard-pressed while sober and not held at gunpoint to give that for an old Fender. But I have no doubt someone will step up and be thrilled with it, and good for them.
A guy was selling a Flying V, supposedly from that first run in the late 50's. It looked like it had been chained to a pier in Galveston Bay getting soaked in salt water for 4 or 5 years. He was asking 5 grand for it, which was quite a pile of $$$ back then.
That broke me of the vint market ever since.
For 28G's, I could have several new axes and rigs, and lots of money left over. Or if I just had to have an axe for that money, a built-for-me Alembic Series. I'd be hard-pressed while sober and not held at gunpoint to give that for an old Fender. But I have no doubt someone will step up and be thrilled with it, and good for them.
My '61 Jazz was a complete POS when I purchased it cheap from an estate sale. Previous owner completely hacked it up, changed out all of the pots and used steel braided wiring, sanded down the entire body and headstock about a quarter of an inch (unevenly I might add), not to mention a crack in the back of the neck/headstock area. Even the neck plate was from a '74 Fender, ***?! But once I got it to a top notch luthier and had the body/neck/headstock repaired/refinished it's a killer instrument. My modified MIA Jazz Deluxe is still my main player, but this '61 plays better and has a deeper/gutsier sound even being passive compared to the active Deluxe model. That being said I still wouldn't expect to get twenty grand for it. But I wouldn't take less than ten!
That bass is gorgeous!
I'll stick up for it (a little). Stack knobs are relatively rare, which drives up the prices. As for the refinish component, fender did in house refins during that era, which is most likely what they are hedging against. I'm not an expert, but from what I've seen, a fender done refin in 1965 or something wouldn't hurt the value like a more recent, or poorly done one would.
As for value, older Fenders are priced as collectibles now. That's just the market. And that adds a large premium to the price beyond the intrinsic value of the instrument. Single greatest bass I ever played was a pre CBS J that had been refinished, but plenty of them are nothing special. For the most part though, these are not really aimed at players any more, unfortunately, so the pricing is more about scarcity than anything
I'll stick up for it (a little). Stack knobs are relatively rare, which drives up the prices. As for the refinish component, fender did in house refins during that era, which is most likely what they are hedging against. I'm not an expert, but from what I've seen, a fender done refin in 1965 or something wouldn't hurt the value like a more recent, or poorly done one would.
As for value, older Fenders are priced as collectibles now. That's just the market. And that adds a large premium to the price beyond the intrinsic value of the instrument. Single greatest bass I ever played was a pre CBS J that had been refinished, but plenty of them are nothing special. For the most part though, these are not really aimed at players any more, unfortunately, so the pricing is more about scarcity than anything
My only real vintage piece is a 1965ish epiphone olympic, and that is exactly how I was able to get it. It has all replacement (and upgraded) hardware, and someone swapped the neck pickup for a tele bridge pickup (I also have a strong suspicion that this started life as a one pickup guitar and was modded to two). At any rate, I got it for 250 bucks when the going rate for olympics was 1000, spent a little more to swap the pickups again, and it is a great axe.
