Anyone avoid electronic tuners?

[nashvillebill]

Actually, I don't tune to an electronic tuner.

The ones at school are really bad, I don't trust them - ..... I'd probably invest in an electronic tuner, but still tune to the piano or something at the beginning of every set.

I've put my electronic tuners through a lot of abuse. Every one of them has stayed perfectly in tune with each other. And if in doubt, I pull out the old tuning fork, and guess what, the electronic tuner is ALWAYS right. So try one tuner, then check your instrument with another tuner and see if they are in tune. Chances are they will be.

IMHO it's not good to keep second guessing and trying to tune by ear at a gig. Plug in to the tuner, tune it, and be done with it.

NOTHING sounds worse than bands with an out-of tune instrument, and nothing irks me more than people who claim that their ears are more accurate than an electronic device. (flame suit on)

 

[Thor]

I hate to rain on your parade, but the inability to hear whether or not you're in tune has nothing to do with whether or not you use a machine or not. If your guitar player can't hear it, he needs to work on ear training. Not tuning his guitar.

I defer to Ed, I was about to say the same thing.

I wasn't born with perfect pitch, but when you play enough and
listen, you eventually develop an understanding of tonality.

I may be a musical perfectionist. I don't mean to criticize your friend,
but part of growth and development as a musical artist is to listen to
yourself carefully first, then later listen to your group. And when you can hear yourself well, then your blend is much better, and the group
functions better.

No musician I know as I get older is totally happy with their sound.
I have come to see that once they stop striving for better sound or are personally satisfied, they have stopped wanting to grow.

Hope I am never satisfied.

 

[Steph Dawe]

So try one tuner, then check your instrument with another tuner and see if they are in tune. Chances are they will be.

That's half the problem - both of the school's tuners diagree with each other. So we all tune up to the piano, so even though we may be out, we're still all in with each other.

The audience doesn't notice.

I guess it's just a preference thing, and by my way of tuning I develop my ear as well.

Oh well.

 

[FreakWalrus]

Forgive my foolish question but are you all using harmonics to tune?

I haven't played many gigs that are quiet enough for me to tune by ear. I usually use a tuner because standing directly infront of my 4x10 I can barely hear myself above the crowd and warm up noises. If I think I can, I usually dont because I dont trust myself to get it right quickly the first time.

If its quiet I find it quicker and easier by ear.

 

[Chris Fitzgerald]

That's half the problem - both of the school's tuners diagree with each other. So we all tune up to the piano, so even though we may be out, we're still all in with each other.

Well Said. What no one has mentioned yet is that if you tune to an eloectronic tuner, you're basically ****ed when it comes to playing with a real piano, since 99 out of 100 are not tuned perfectly to A440. I also find that when I tune to a tuner, I never know which part of my DB note the tuner is supposed to be reading, since the initial attack of DB strings goes sharp, then settles down. Gotta concur with FOGHORN that it's better just to use your ears.

 

[jrthebassguy]

Well, with the music I play, I can tune by ear when I'm in my bedroom, but there aint no way I can hear myself tune at practice or a gig when everyone is talking or playing, so of course I use an electronic tuner then.

 

[IvanMike]

Forgive my foolish question but are you all using harmonics to tune?

I haven't played many gigs that are quiet enough for me to tune by ear. I usually use a tuner because standing directly infront of my 4x10 I can barely hear myself above the crowd and warm up noises. If I think I can, I usually dont because I dont trust myself to get it right quickly the first time.

If its quiet I find it quicker and easier by ear.

before i used an electric tuner i always got an "A" from the guitar player and tuned my 1st harmonic on the a string to him. Then i tuned the rest of my bass with harmonics so it would be in tune with itself. If you're in a situation where this is you only alternative I would suggest soloing the bridge pickup, using a pick, and bumping 500 Hz if you are really having a problem hearing the oscillations.
I use a korg BT-2 without problem, but i'm probably going to switch to a boss tu-2 for the mute and improved visibility in most situations. I gave the tu-2 a thorough demo and give it a big thumbs up. I tried the korg rackmount tuners but found them to be too sensitive - (as mentioned already they are sharp on the attack, flat on the decay), no matter how lightly i plucked the strings.
Tuning without being muted is a big no no usually,although i usually give a quick check with the harmonics at low volume at times, or just give the old G-D-A-E thump (like at the beginning of "live at leeds".

 

[Steph Dawe]

Well Said. What no one has mentioned yet is that if you tune to an eloectronic tuner, you're basically ****ed when it comes to playing with a real piano, since 99 out of 100 are not tuned perfectly to A440. I also find that when I tune to a tuner, I never know which part of my DB note the tuner is supposed to be reading, since the initial attack of DB strings goes sharp, then settles down. Gotta concur with FOGHORN that it's better just to use your ears.

before i used an electric tuner i always got an "A" from the guitar player and tuned my 1st harmonic on the a string to him.

I always get a G from the piano and tune backwards.

 

[heath_the_great]

i try to tune by ear....cant really do it....oh well..ill get it one day...but i see a tuner is a tuner, i dont trust in the ones built into multi effects pedals, eg zoom, digitech.....but i use a korg CA-30 and i just run out of the effects loop on my head into the tuner but i plan on buying a korg onstage pedal tuner......

if i do tune by ear...if i know one of my strings is in tune, i usually tune by harmonics, and i tested this up against a tuner one day and i was under 5% out on each string

 

[The Golden Boy]

i always got an "A" from the guitar player and tuned my 1st harmonic on the a string to him. Then i tuned the rest of my bass with harmonics so it would be in tune with itself.

I personally find that to be the second most unprofessional thing you can do as a musician- the first is playing out of tune.

"Hey, give me an A" means "Hey, I'm too cheap to buy a tuner."

FWIW I find the Boss TU-12 and the TU-2 to be the ideal combination of tough, quick and accurate. They're not excessively accurate- but more than accurate enough for most any situation. I also have a Korg rack tuner- I don't like playing the "bouncing" game with that- too accurate to the point that it really doesn't matter.

 

[Marc Piane]

I look at a tuner much like a calculator... you still need to be able to do the math in your head.

 

[driver800]

my bass was in tune when i bought it.

 

[IvanMike]

I personally find that to be the second most unprofessional thing you can do as a musician- the first is playing out of tune.

"Hey, give me an A" means "Hey, I'm too cheap to buy a tuner."

Hey relax, that was 18 years ago -

 

[The Golden Boy]

Hey relax, that was 18 years ago -

I specifically cut out the "before I used a tuner" to use your example. Most everybody's done it, so it's not a slam specifically on you. I look back at videotapes of old shows and cringe in horror at the things I did...

Sorry for not being more clear about that and appearing to insult you.

 

[IvanMike]

no problem, no offense taken, besides, can think of some much more unprofessional things i did at gigs 18 years ago

 

[The Golden Boy]

Round about 14 years ago I did play a show playing guitar. I changed strings right before playing, and I ended up breaking strings- and I didn't bring a tuner. However I did bring a video camera that had sound... :scowl:

You live, you learn...

 

[Chris Fitzgerald]

I personally find that to be the second most unprofessional thing you can do as a musician- the first is playing out of tune.

"Hey, give me an A" means "Hey, I'm too cheap to buy a tuner."

Personally, I find this to be one of the most ridiculous statements I've heard here at TB - the first was a comment about how practicing with a metronome makes your time worse.

"Hey, give me an A", on a jazz gig, generally means "Hey, I'd like to be in tune with the actual piano I'm playing with rather than some artificial electronic standard".

To each his own, I guess.

 

[The Golden Boy]

Personally, I find this to be one of the most ridiculous statements I've heard here at TB - the first was a comment about how practicing with a metronome makes your time worse.

"Hey, give me an A", on a jazz gig, generally means "Hey, I'd like to be in tune with the actual piano I'm playing with rather than some artificial electronic standard".

To each his own, I guess.

I guess I've got to be proud to claim "one of the most ridiculous statements...at TB"

However I don't view A440 as an "artificial electronic standard." It may be different on a jazz gig, but at a rock show the electronic keyboards are set at A440 and can be changed from there. In other words everyone is on the same sheet of music, so to speak (or the same "artificial electronic standard" as it were)

It is completely unprofessional to be playing "the tuning song" between songs, or even mid song. Completely unprofessional. I mentioned that I had a tuning incident caught on video. I tried to tune quickly by ear. Not only was one string off (if I remember it was a G that broke) so I ended up un-tuning my B and E. I had to play power chords after I figured it out. (I did play an open E chord after tuning and it sounded right at the time- but I was in a hurry- in reality it was nowhere even close.) A pedal tuner with a mute available around that time would have been the Arion Stage Tuner- I got one later on. You live you learn. Because of that incident I'm terrified of being out of tune.

In my experience in the past 10-15 years or so (since good tuners have been available and affordable), the bands that say "hey, give me an A" and proceed to tune by ear are generally young and or inexperienced, or really don't care what the audience thinks.

Disclaimer: I realize some may be looking at this from having an instrument that isn't practically tuned between songs (piano), and not to get into the whole "electronic instruments are an abomination" thing, but easily transportable keyboards most always factory set at A440 and can be changed to fit other instruments as well. It only makes sense that everyone be at "concert pitch."

 

[Steph Dawe]

"Hey, give me an A", on a jazz gig, generally means "Hey, I'd like to be in tune with the actual piano I'm playing with rather than some artificial electronic standard".

+1

In my experience in the past 10-15 years or so (since good tuners have been available and affordable), the bands that say "hey, give me an A" and proceed to tune by ear are generally young and or inexperienced, or really don't care what the audience thinks.

Will the audience really notice if you're out of tune?

If you're extremely out of tune, then yes. It sounds really bad.

But if you're a couple out, then only the musicians around you will notice.

 

[jeff schmidt]

Yes - I also hear it's a complete waste of time to even bother tuning URB and Fretless basses since you can always slide and make each note in tune.