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Double Bass Arco playing....

sonofabass

sonofabass

Feb 10, 2006
379
14
California
www.sonofabass.com
Disclosures
Endorsing Artist: Aguilar Amplification, Mike Lull,MXR,Gruv Gear, Mono
#1
Now, I'm sure that there are many posts regarding this BUT, as I'm sure all of you knw, may hours that could be spent practicing could be wasted searching for the answer to a specific question,



OK, - I've only been playing DB for around two years. It's a school thing, I HAVE to play it.

yes, I enjoy it and really want to be good at it but my arco playing, no matter how hard i try SUCKS like nobody's business.

I have the Rufus Reed book.....practicing slow, ,still SUCKING

Squeaks, SERIOUS fatigue and cramping in my right hand.
(French bow).

What can I do to get a good sound and not have my hand feel like it's going to fall off? :mad: :crying: :help: :hmm:

thanks in advance
 
#2
I had (ok, HAVE) the same problem. What bass do you play? Is it set up properly? Have you compared it to another bass -- a nice one that is setup right? This may or not be your problem, and chances are you don't have thousands of clams to throw around, but if you DO, this is the first thing I would try to rule out. No sense in struggling if you don't have to.

THEN, you need a good teacher to straighten out your technique.
THEN you practice those newly learned good habits.
 
#3
Everyone will probably jump on you yelling "search" and "get a teacher", but before I join them-

1/ Make sure you have good fresh rosin. It's cheap at about $15 or so.
I really like Nyman or Carlsson Swedish rosin. Don't use too much or put it on too often.

2/ Make sure you are keeping your bow about 1/2 way between the end of the fingerboard and the bridge.

3/ Learn to let your arm weight do the work, not your hand.
Relax your bow hold and feel your heavy arm dropping onto the string, use your shoulder and back muscles, but don't squeeze or press.

4/ Try a modified bow hold to start, put your thumb right on the metal ferrule, and see if that helps you. There is also the "German" style of bow, you might try sometime and see if you like it.

5/ Take the bass to a good violin shop or luthier in your area. Have them set the bass up so it's easy to play. At least get the action at the nut lowered if it needs it. Get the bow re-haired. Ask about good strings (early Christmas present?) for bowing. I like Thomastik Dominant lately, but ask me again next week!

6/ Use your computer. Google Jason Heath for a great bass site with TONS of info, video links, student resources, funny stories about exploding cars. . . Check Youtube for videos of Jeff Bradetich and other great bassists. Go over to Gary Karr's site and have a listen. etc. etc.

Best regards, and I hope you stick with it!

Laurence
 
#6
I'm a noob and going through same sorts of things, but working thru them. First thing I did that helped was get a bow rubber and put it on. The extra width it added help reduce the hand cramps. My first teacher was not too good so I started checking out a bunch of DB books/pictures and realized I wasn't holding bow correctly. I was close, but still off. That is when I decide time for a different teacher.

Final two things have helped a lot. First I got the Rabbath Art of the Bow DVD. Seeing and hearing him talk about the bow and the arm helped a lot. He covers a lot of basics. Then I got a new teacher who given me some real instruction and exercises that are helping.

That is what is working for me.
 
#7
If you don't have orchestral aspirations, you may want to get a German bow - they are just easier on the body. I am into both grips, but the German is more ergonomic and easier to started on. You can get OK wood bows for under $50 on ebay, I think the username is bowsfordays or something.
Rufus is a great player, but I would get one of the basic classical books (like he studied out of) for arco playing. Simandl is the standard, I reccomend going through it before other books, so you can know how the others compare.
I don't think Simandl covers it all, but it is great start.

IMO, arco playing = bass playing, if you "suck at arco" you suck at....
As far as rosin, that Swedish stuff is nice for drawing, but pops is the standard- start with that, then see how the others compare.
Spirocores are great arco strings, anyone who says different just does not practice enough.
Also, get a teacher.
 
#10
Mr.Phil said:
German bow is no good for orchestra? News to me.
Click to expand...

It's irrelevant. The thing is that many conductors prefer French, since it looks more like the rest of the orchestra. It's purely discriminatory. Also, it makes no sense. I've heard reports of Gary Karr himself playing with a French bow and coming out with the same exact sound as he does with German.

The good thing is that this pattern is beginning to change. I'm seeing more and more German players in prominent positions every year. All I'm trying to say is not to worry about the preferences of others, and to simply use whichever one you feel most comfortable with.

The German/French bow segregation needs to end.
 
#11
ClassicalBass said:
It's irrelevant. The thing is that many conductors prefer French, since it looks more like the rest of the orchestra. It's purely discriminatory. Also, it makes no sense. I've heard reports of Gary Karr himself playing with a French bow and coming out with the same exact sound as he does with German.

The good thing is that this pattern is beginning to change. I'm seeing more and more German players in prominent positions every year. All I'm trying to say is not to worry about the preferences of others, and to simply use whichever one you feel most comfortable with.

The German/French bow segregation needs to end.
Click to expand...

Right, and the German is generally more comfortable, esp. when someone trying French complains of a sore hand! I like both and I am glad I learned French first, but unless there is a compeling reason to learn French (you want to play tango or mambo or played an instrument in the violin family or want to play "just like Rabbath/Barry Guy/other favorite French player", etc.) I reccomend German.
 
#12
ClassicalBass said:
It's irrelevant. The thing is that many conductors prefer French, since it looks more like the rest of the orchestra. It's purely discriminatory. Also, it makes no sense. I've heard reports of Gary Karr himself playing with a French bow and coming out with the same exact sound as he does with German.

The good thing is that this pattern is beginning to change. I'm seeing more and more German players in prominent positions every year. All I'm trying to say is not to worry about the preferences of others, and to simply use whichever one you feel most comfortable with.

The German/French bow segregation needs to end.
Click to expand...

Well, I cannot contest this, as I have no experience with such situations. I have seen good orchestral players using both and I agree, it makes little difference, if you have talent... Its preference (I started French, then switched). That aside, I was just questioning the post that said if you don't have orchestral aspirations, you should play german. It was cleared up in the following post, but thanks for your input.
-Phil
 
#14
sonofabass said:
What can I do to get a good sound and not have my hand feel like it's going to fall off?
Click to expand...

Try to always keep your hand in a natural position. Just let your arm hang at your side without the bow and let your hand completely relax. The shape that your fingers take when you do this is exactly how you should (strive to) hold the bow; very natural. Try to keep you fingers consistently curved and your thumb slightly bent, but try not to push too hard on the string. Pull the bow across the string with arm weight instead of muscle. I hope this helps!
 

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