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Bi-Amping on the Cheep

Count Bassie

Count Bassie

Supporting Member
Jun 10, 2006
16,797
64,578
Smithfield, RI
#1
After playing bass for nearly 37 years and using a full spectrum of gear, from much-desired and luxurious all-tube heads to Radio Shack power amps into Sears toaster ovens, I've come to view amplification in a very pragmatic way. Sound is what you're after, and more than once I've led myself into a cul-de-sac chasing the buzz of regarded brand names as if that was a clue to the Holy Grail...
So this isn't so much enlightening as it is affirming. Signal flow is not such a dark at if you can reduce a system to a road map of your signals travel. The more straight lines from A to B you can draw, and the fewer of them there are, the better of you'll be, in this weekender's humble opinion... So here's what I've come to:

Crate BT-350... Low out to Return, that power supply out to a Bill Fitzmaurice T-24.
... Highs from the BT-350 High out to a small 210 combo I put together, which has a Trace Elliot AH 250SMX dropped into the back of the enclosure. Those highs from the Crate go into the Return of the Trace and that powers the 210.

The Crate BT-350 is the preamp for the whole rig, is also the power supply for the lows. Trace head powers the highs. The Crate head has a Crossover that's adjustable down to 100Hz, a Balance control for the x-over, and 7 bands of graphic, low/mid/high knobs, and lows and highs boost toggles.

The sound of the Crate is warm and powerful, plenty of "tone shaping" built into the preamp, which includes a12AX7 tube. And you can overdrive that tube to get a nice, almost-overwhelming Ampeggy heft, that you just can't get from the Trace's preamp.

Anyway bi-amping with this stack of cobbled-together parts is better than your average garage-level desperation, and I'm liking it quite a bit! The T-24 is deep and powerful, and the little home-made 210 gag (Eminence designed Avatar Neo 10s in a reasonably well suited box) has been a pleasant working out of resources. Here it is... And thanks for condescending to read my windy, self-affirming post!

IMG_20160129_165624.jpg


The combo...

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The Crate...

IMG_20160131_090256349.jpg
 
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#3
Is the Crate set up right? It appears so, but I'm curious if you actually need to send the low out to the power section with a jumper. Wouldn't the high being used and the crossover point take care of that? IIRC don't amps have switching jacks on biamp outs? Maybe it's just brand to brand design choice, have you tried it without the patch on the low?
 
#4
basscooker said:
Is the Crate set up right? It appears so, but I'm curious if you actually need to send the low out to the power section with a jumper. Wouldn't the high being used and the crossover point take care of that? IIRC don't amps have switching jacks on biamp outs? Maybe it's just brand to brand design choice, have you tried it without the patch on the low?
Click to expand...
Well the manual indicates this procedure to get either lows or highs out through the power section of the Crate head. So I did it. It was the same procedure if you wanted to bi-amp with the A.M.P. BH-420, so I think it's standard for the era.
 
#7
You're doing it right with the CratePeg + Tuba + Trace setup. Doing it wonderfully I might add. You're doing what I did with Peaveys with built in crossover and mono power sections. Low out patched back into power section to power lows. High out to powered top rig of choice. Adjust to taste. Difference is you have a real horn sub. Clarity, clean, tactile bass hard to beat.

Don't change a thing, just enjoy.

Yes, facing the horn towards a wall or into a corner can get you some free depth and/or spl as the added boundaries effectively lengthen and/or embiggen the horn. The frequencies it's running at aren't directional anyway. Just point the top cab where you want the sound to go.
 
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#8
Wow, thanks Will33, for the good word, thanks Downunder for the advice, and the interest. Nice to know I seem to have finally done something right! Lol, even a broken clock...

There does seem to be plenty of presence, as there's nothing sucking too much power out of my punch with each side having a dedicated power supply...

Thanks again for the help- you guys may recall I've been at a thing like this for quite some time now! Much appreciate your considerations over that time.
 
#9
I recall trying to get you to biamp that sub ever since you got it. Then you were trying to sell it and I gave more pointers on biamping it.

Don't blow it up! Horns really don't like frequencies below their design intended range but you won't hear it complain about it until it stops. The low eq slider should be bottomed out.

I would be inclined to use the Trace pre section first and zero 30 40 hz. Fx send at low level to front of Crate. Lows back to Trace with blend on full, swapping the amp to cab feeds.
 
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#10
You haven't blown it so you're operating within its limits but yes, if you overdo it the sub won't give you any farty warning as the horn path filters out most of the distortion.

If you're worried about it, your plans and Bill's site will have voltage limits for your model and instructions on how to measure them. You can do it with an inexpensive multimeter and a free test tone phone app. Though if you've run it this long without problems you're probably ok.
 
#11
Downunderwonder said:
I recall trying to get you to biamp that sub ever since you got it. Then you were trying to sell it and I gave more pointers on biamping it.

Don't blow it up! Horns really don't like frequencies below their design intended range but you won't hear it complain about it until it stops. The low eq slider should be bottomed out.

I would be inclined to use the Trace pre section first and zero 30 40 hz. Fx send at low level to front of Crate. Lows back to Trace with blend on full, swapping the amp to cab feeds.
Click to expand...
You have been about this and yes I have tried to just get rid of the whole mess! Just distracted by life, low funds and a need to erase unneeded hassles... I stand humbled! Truth. But I'm glad it's worked out, and L take your advice and try that routing idea through the Trace first.

I'll look into the meter/app idea Will, thanks!
 

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