You guys should check out the Crown [Invalid or Expired Link Removed]. Crown engineers are on line there with the straight scoop.
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Bill Fitzmaurice Help me with my subs!
- Thread starter kringle77
- Start date
You guys should check out the Crown [Invalid or Expired Link Removed]. Crown engineers are on line there with the straight scoop.
If that system design works for you, excellent. I simply find that it is my philosophy to not bridge output stages for the aformentioned reasons, and with the added reason that if a power stage does fail in an amplifier, if I am running a large amplifier in stereo config I can simply migrate that channel's load to the working channel. I have had to do so before, and I do not doubt that I will again.
Cheers,
Mick
I played two very different clubs this weekend. The first is very small with a tile floor. We put the subs together and cross fired the tops. Great sound, very punchy.
Tonight we played at a medium sized club with a hollow floor. I tried using the same set up. It just wasn't happening. There was some weird, distorted overtones. Probably the same effect as overdriving the top of an acoustic guitar by strumming too loud. We seperated the tops and the sound got better, We seperated the subs and the sound cleared right up. So, I'd say, at most clubs, definitely keep the subs together, but this gig with a hollow floor was an exception.
Im wondering if having 3 tops, two cross-firing with one in the center, firing forward would be a good idea. Lots of cancellation, Im sure. But, having any pair of speakers that are not vertical will give you that. Anyway, just an update from the trenches. Goodnight.
Tonight we played at a medium sized club with a hollow floor. I tried using the same set up. It just wasn't happening. There was some weird, distorted overtones. Probably the same effect as overdriving the top of an acoustic guitar by strumming too loud. We seperated the tops and the sound got better, We seperated the subs and the sound cleared right up. So, I'd say, at most clubs, definitely keep the subs together, but this gig with a hollow floor was an exception.
Im wondering if having 3 tops, two cross-firing with one in the center, firing forward would be a good idea. Lots of cancellation, Im sure. But, having any pair of speakers that are not vertical will give you that. Anyway, just an update from the trenches. Goodnight.
That is the problem. When bridging, you use either:
The CH1 red binding post for speaker positive and the CH2 red binding post for speaker negative. You do not use the black posts.
or
The appropriate one of the two NL4 connectors with a custom made NL4 cable, usually using 1+ as positive and 2+ as negative.
It might be wise to give the amplifer manual another read.
Yeah, we cleared that up a few posts ago. That was the origional problem. I've played 4 or 5 gigs since then. The first 4 were way better witht he subs in one spot. The hollow floor created alot of problems at the last one. Seperating the subs really helped. They were also near a wall so, alot of low end going on. I had to high pass the subs at 45hz as well. Good after that. I promise that the subs will go back together at the next gig.
Missed that.
Usually, you need to make sure that each sub is either within
2 feet of a boundary (floor, wall), or at least 8 feet away from a boundary. Anywhere in between and you can get quite a notch.
Did you actually walk the room, to make sure that when they were split, the bass was better everywhere, not just down the middle? Often, when they are split (especially when outdoors) the bass will be great down the middle, but there will be frequency dependent dead spots throughout the audience area.
Invalid Link Removed
Yeah, they were a foot from a side wall, which probably caused some weird reflections. And, with a hollow floor, the sound was boomy. When seperated, the sound got much better. Just an exception to the norm I guess. Not a great sounding room, but a good club. Sometimes you just have to know a room I guess. When we get the new pa, we'll normally stack the four 1x15 subs in one spot with a 3-way top sitting on them, and the other 3-way top on a speaker stand on the other side of the stage. This should be the "right" way to do it, I think.
The one closest to the wall should have been ok. The other one might have had a frequency notch. And perhaps the wall reflections of each had a detrimental affect on the other.
When you are back in the venue and have time to experiment, shove the first sub against the wall (standing up if it's a 2x), and stack the other on top of it. This should put the anomalies in the vertical plane, where they will have much less effect.
It's a long rectangular room. If I place the subs, stacked vertically against the wall, should they be firing down the length of the wall? I have seen where some guys actually point the subs at the wall, about a foot away. Never tried it myself. Thanks for the tip, by the way.
I was just thinking about this past weekends sub issues. These mackies have four 10's each. If I set them next to each other, it's like having an 8x10 lying on it's side. Won't that destroy my horizontal coverage? Lots of cancellation? At one gig, I stacked them and it sounded good but, the sound got very directional.
When I start using the new 1x15 subs, four of them, I was thinking that it may be best to stack them two wide and two high. But, Im not sure about cancellation issues with subs or, it it even matters with low frequencies.
When I start using the new 1x15 subs, four of them, I was thinking that it may be best to stack them two wide and two high. But, Im not sure about cancellation issues with subs or, it it even matters with low frequencies.
The smaller the sub array, the more even the coverage. A two box array, even if they are duals and lying down, should not much real directivity. When the array starts getting larger, or when the cabinets are separated, is when problems arise. You can easily model this at Link Removed (add red dots to represent each woofer, then move the woofers around to see what happens). There may be some info of interest in in these documents: Link Removed and Invalid Link Removed
