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Cab advice please?

J Gold

J Gold

Jun 7, 2011
1,909
1,622
Albany,NY
#1
I recently bought a Subway D800+ as my main amp. I'm looking at adding to my arsenal of cabinets.
I'm happy with my Avatar 410, so looking at getting an upgrade 115 of some sort. I've yet to find one I loved.
The main requirement would be that at 400watts at 8ohms it can handle a 6 string bass in a metal band with a pretty loud drummer and one guitarist. I can add the 410 for full power if needed.

Just looking for ideas. Thanks in advance.
 
#2
At the risk of being "that guy", have you looked into Fearless cabs by any chance? I know I love my F115, and it seems to fit your criteria. Not sure how well it would pair with your Avatar, but it's my humble recommendation for a stand-alone:

IMG_20170109_205300910_TOPr.jpg
 
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#3
At the risk of being "that other guy," a lot of people will say that it's a bad idea to use a 1x15 together with a 4x10. The main reason is that with two cabs, half of the wattage goes to each cab (assuming they are both 8 ohms). The power going into the 4x10 gets divided equally among four speakers, whereas the power going into the 1x15 all goes into a single speaker. This is a recipe for frying the 1x15. Plus, the 4x10 will be way louder because of the greater speaker area, so you won't hear the 1x15 anyway. If a 4x10 isn't enough, get a second matching 4x10.

I also feel compelled to point out that if a 4x10 isn't enough, your band IS TOO F****ING LOUD.
 
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#4
J Gold said:
I recently bought a Subway D800+ as my main amp. I'm looking at adding to my arsenal of cabinets.
I'm happy with my Avatar 410, so looking at getting an upgrade 115 of some sort. I've yet to find one I loved.
The main requirement would be that at 400watts at 8ohms it can handle a 6 string bass in a metal band with a pretty loud drummer and one guitarist. I can add the 410 for full power if needed.

Just looking for ideas. Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...


Mesa Subway 15 handles that with ease. But I'm not sure any single 15 will 'out louden' a good 4x10.
 
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#5
Is your 410 4 Ohms or 8?

If 4 Ohms, you could add an 8 Ohm 1x15 and run it reasonably safely atop your 4x10. Subway amp in 2-Ohms mode -- 410 will get two-thirds of the power, 15 will get one-third -- that should be about right, though will vary with the specific cabs in question.
 
#7
MarkA said:
Is your 410 4 Ohms or 8?

If 4 Ohms, you could add an 8 Ohm 1x15 and run it reasonably safely atop your 4x10. Subway amp in 2-Ohms mode -- 410 will get two-thirds of the power, 15 will get one-third -- that should be about right, though will vary with the specific cabs in question.
Click to expand...
I should have noted it is 8 ohms.
 
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#10
J Gold said:
I should have noted it is 8 ohms.
Click to expand...
Well, that's slightly inconvenient.

How much do you like your 410? If you want to have two cabs and be able to use them simultaneously with the Subway, you can...
  1. Start over with different cabs.
  2. Get an identical 410. Guaranteed to work with what you have now; no worries about matching cabs or power handling. Will also work with 4 Ohm minimum amps. Doesn't give you a smaller second cab, though, if you're after that.
  3. Switch out the speakers in your 410 to make it a 4 Ohm cab and add a similar, 8 Ohm 210 or an 8 Ohm 115 for a 2.7 Ohm load.
  4. Leave your 410 at 8 Ohms and have a 210 made with two, 8 Ohm drivers wired in series for 16 Ohms. You'll have a modular, 5.3 Ohm 610 -- that'll get most of the power from the Subway, but not all of it. The 16 Ohm 210 will see something like 200-250 Watts from the amp -- I think this will hold whether running solo or with the 410 -- whether or not that's enough for your purposes will depend on the efficiency and the power handling of the cab.
  5. You could do as above but wire the 210 up with a series/parallel switch -- that'll switch it between 16 Ohms and 4 Ohms. You'd need to be sure to have it in the 16 Ohm position when using with the 410. If running solo @ 4 Ohms with the Subway, you'd need to be careful with the power (you could run the amp in 2 Ohm mode for less power at 4 Ohms, but you'd still need to watch out). Not sure that wiring scheme would be worth it in this case.
  6. You can look for a stout 115 and simply listen carefully when you run it with the 410. You could also go with an 18, but at that point you might as well get a second 410.
I have a friend who plays six string with an Eden WT550 and a Mesa Powerhouse 210. In smaller rooms, he sets the 210 vertically and that setup seems to do fine keeping up with a guitar or two and a moderately hard-hitting drummer. I haven't heard him go nuts pushing it though and he doesn't play metal. For bigger stages, I've seen him stack it with a 410.
 
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#13
Sure.

I just had a quick look at the Avatar site -- which I probably should have done before answering. I noticed the TB153 cab (there are a couple of threads that mention that cab on this site if you look). Dimensions are exactly the same as the 410 (though I suspect -- and the description implies -- that the porting is different). It might or might not match up well, power-wise, with your 410 (also noticed that those are available with different drivers -- which are in yours?). You can chat with Avatar about that. Since it's the same size as your 410, though, unless there's some definite advantage to the TB153 (might be -- I don't know), you might just get a second 410. That's the safest bet if you like your 410 and aren't looking for a smaller cab.

If you like your 410 and want a smaller cab to go with it, get a 210 with the same drivers. Your call how you'd want to go about that.

EDIT: As I think on it more, I'm not sure how much I like the idea of a 16 Ohm 210 (or a switchable 16/4 Ohm 210) in your case. If you want to run a modular 610 with a 4-Ohm-minimum amp, a 16 Ohm 210 makes sense. If you regularly play with a solo 210 and a tiny head (like the GK MB200), then 4 Ohms makes sense.

Disadvantages:
  • Might be hard to sell the 210 later on, if you decide to.
  • Running at 5.3 Ohms, the amp will have a little less headroom than at 4 Ohms -- might or might not be an issue for you.
Advantages:
  • Doesn't require you to modify your current cab.
Rather than swapping speakers, you could sell your 410 and get a 4 Ohm version -- or see if anyone wants to trade a 4 Ohm for an 8 Ohm.

Multiple, 8 Ohm 210s (two or three) are also an option.
 
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#14
I use Markbass NY 151s and GK NEO 115s...both are serious @ss kickers and fit your 400W @ 8ohms requirement. Both have very different tone profiles so keep that in mind. The GK is VERY mid-forward with an emphasis on low-mid growl...the Markbass is more of a focused punch in the chest. This is what my ears hear...YMMV.
 
#19
J Gold said:
The main requirement would be that at 400watts at 8ohms it can handle a 6 string bass in a metal band with a pretty loud drummer and one guitarist.
Click to expand...

That is probably not going to happen. No matter the wattage specs, a single 1x15 is unlikely to be able to handle the volume of a metal band that is loud enough for you to be worried about competing. As has already been said, a 1x15 will not be as loud as a decent 4x10, so unless your 4x10 is *easily* able to handle your power needs by itself, a 1x15 by itself probably won't cut it.
 
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#20
Lobster11 said:
At the risk of being "that other guy," a lot of people will say that it's a bad idea to use a 1x15 together with a 4x10. The main reason is that with two cabs, half of the wattage goes to each cab (assuming they are both 8 ohms). The power going into the 4x10 gets divided equally among four speakers, whereas the power going into the 1x15 all goes into a single speaker. This is a recipe for frying the 1x15. Plus, the 4x10 will be way louder because of the greater speaker area, so you won't hear the 1x15 anyway. If a 4x10 isn't enough, get a second matching 4x10.

I also feel compelled to point out that if a 4x10 isn't enough, your band IS TOO F****ING LOUD.
Click to expand...
if its too loud, you're too old
 
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