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Can't make a decision on cabs

MSUsousaphone

MSUsousaphone

Dec 4, 2009
2,499
38
43
Lake Charles, La
losersreunion.com
Disclosures
Endorsed Artist: Myco Pedals
#1
I just made a GIANT change and am a little at a loss with what cabs I should go with.

I used to have an Eden rig; Nemesis RS700 head and 410 & 115 cabs....but I recently picked up a Mesa Boogie Strategy 400 Power Amp. I just bought an old Ashly SC-40 Preamp to pair with it. Now it's cab buying time. I'm trying to keep it between $600-800 but might be able to stretch a tad more if there's a big difference in that price jump. Looking for two cabs....like a 410 & 212 pairing or 410 & 115.

The trouble part is that I prefer clear articulation over massive low end (kinda like Eden or GK) but I play with a lot of FX including fuzz so I would really love to avoid tweeters. All of those usual suspects I'm experienced with and like seem to only make cabs with tweeters. I mainly play altrock/indie. I'll hold down the bass a lot of times with a nice tube/OD tone but in other songs I look for more of a hi fi sound to move around a lot and sometimes play chords. Kind of a hybrid playing style.

So, in summary, I'm looking for clear, articulate, tweeterless cabs to pair with my Mesa 400 and Ashly SC-40. Any suggestions?
 
#4
Is taking the horn out of the circuit going to lose some frequencies that a tweeterless cab would still be able to give me? I kinda heard that....not sure if it's true.

If that's not a factor, the GK Neo series is where I would be looking, for sure.

I would prefer lighter cabs....but that's not a deal breaker. I can handle the weight if I need to. I would prefer 8 ohms but, again, it's not the biggest factor to me. 4 ohms would be just as good.
 
#5
Clear/articulated tones are best achieved with matching cabs. Mixed driver size cabs can sound great together, but in my experience you cannot get away from that tone.

The tweeter is putting out what the speakers cannot do - if you lower the tweeter dial far enough, you will not hear the tweeter highs at all. If you remove the tweeter from the circuit, I am pretty sure you can end up messing with the internal crossover of the cab - at least on some of them. That's when the cab will not sound really goofy. Not all cabs are like that though.

Keep in mind that tweeters on bass cabs are generally very directional and you will only hear them well right in front of them. Go the sides a bit and the sound will drop off quickly.
 
#7
My recommendation:
1st cabinet: SWR Goliath III 4x10
2nd cabinet: a stool

The stool is an ideal lower cabinet because it raises the effectiveness of the upper cabinet by a factor of 3, all without using any energy whatsoever, making it the most efficient bass cabinet in existence. They're very economical, in fact you don't even have to purchase one, since they're the most widely accepted tech rider request among the venues I've surveyed.
 
#8
MSUsousaphone said:
Is taking the horn out of the circuit going to lose some frequencies that a tweeterless cab would still be able to give me? I kinda heard that....not sure if it's true.

If that's not a factor, the GK Neo series is where I would be looking, for sure.

I would prefer lighter cabs....but that's not a deal breaker. I can handle the weight if I need to. I would prefer 8 ohms but, again, it's not the biggest factor to me. 4 ohms would be just as good.
Click to expand...

The tweeter horns add a flavor a lot of people like, but the G-K NEOs I don't think will be at a loss without it. I think the MBE series also have a switch to turn the horn off.
With the NEO cabs switched to Bi-amp the crossover is out of circuit BTW. NEO cabs use a dynamic horn (cross-over needed) and the MBE use a piezo horn (no cross-over). :)
 
#12
Lake Charles - do you know Doc from Doc's? great guy.

Anyway - nearly all cabs with tweeters do not roll off the highs on the woofers, they simply roll the lows off the tweeter. Turning off or turning the tweeter all the way down would not affect the HF coming off the cone drivers.
 
#13
I use a pair of Eden D112XLT that deliver what I think you are after. Might not be enough output for you - I'd be looking at a pair of D212XLT if I needed more. I use them in a rock band with sensible stage volume but have never come close to running out of gas.
 
#14
I love Doc. That's the only place I trust with my bass/rig repairs. I agree, great guy.

I have an Eden EN410XST and N115RS, right now. It was because of the tweeters I was looking to move them. So if I just lowered the tweeter volume, would that be enough to help out when I'm fuzzing all over the place? Or should I turn them off all the way?

I think that's really my big hangup, my ignorance when it comes to tweeters and FX. I hear different things from everyone.
 
#15
Maybe look at the Mesa PH2x12 cab. Or just go with a Ampeg 8x10. You can get plenty of 8x10 used for under your limit. And.......wait for it.......fEARful 15/6. Great cabs that will do everything you desribed that you wanted. Need more volume add a second cab or 15/sub down the road.
 
#17
Start with the tweeters all the way down, then dial them up if you need more articulation. I would also suggest you only use the tweet in the top cabinet. I can get pretty grindy at times (GK MB Fusion tube pre distortion) and still usually run a tweeter up just a bit so you can barely hear the difference. I like it - you might not.
 
#18
cableguy said:
With the fEARfuls you have a 6" mid driver that handles distortion real well. And the dedicated LF driver handles synth and octave effects awesome too. Just my 2cents. People can say I'm drinking the kool-aid but I'm very happy with mine.
Click to expand...

Haha. I dig kool-aid.

And thank, Ben. I feel more comfortable using my Edens for now, while the financial dust settles on last week's impulsive reach. I'll be checking out the suggested stuff while I'm doing it.

I started off almost going Glockenklang and then pulled a total 180 with the Mesa. My mind is still catching up. :hiding:
 
#19
Technically, even without rolling off the highs on the woofers adding a tweeter does change the high output on the woofers since the same amount of treble is halved between the two circuits. IMO it has no practical influence on how a bass cab sounds, just a property that has practical implications in other applications, i.e. tone stack circuits.

IMO they're a bullsh|t extravagance unless you're Vic Wooten and using fresh strings every week. If not, anything over 2kHz does more harm than good. As an experiment, turn off the tweeter on a friend's cab, see how long it takes for them to realize it's off. They'll notice the knob is in the wrong position before they hear an appreciable difference. I turned off every tweeter I could for each band at a house tech gig for two months, and not one noticed, including the house band's bassist, who didn't notice it was off the entire time. When I pointed out that the knob was in the wrong position, he of course noticed the difference when I pretended to turn it up (which I didn't at first).

What really bugs me is how much space they take up on a 2x10. 4x10's I don't much mind paying for a useless tweeter since they occupy unused space and there's no option on good quality cabs, but if I'm buying a 2x10 it's for the sake of size primarily. Yorkville has traditionally put the vent on the rear of their 2x10's to shorten their profile, but still give up 2" of height for the damned tweeter.
 
#20
People wonder why sound "guys" get no respect :rollno:
They probably knew something was not right but getting the music right was more important than messing with equipment that SHOULD have been set to their liking. We had a guy last 60 minutes into a concert who did this. He had to find a new job. ;)
 

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